Sir Alex Ferguson Thread

[Manuf 1,448]

The key players that night were Cech, Cole, Mikel, Lamps and Drogba. They were all either signed by Mourinho or greatly influenced by him. For all of Robbie's great work in galvanising that squad, that night was very much the culmination of Mourinho's project and a couple of players' seasons of hard work.

And don't confuse width with wide players - we didn't have a Robben or Duff but if you actually look at the team, especially in Europe, the wide players (Ramires more than any other) were the most frequent out ball or focus of the attack. Even in the FA Cup semi-final and final we either used Drogba as a target man or used Ramires's pace on the right wing to break out of defence.

How could Mourinho influence Cech? Did he change his keeping style or what? When we bought Cole he was already one of the best left-backs in the world and both Cole and Mikel played roughly over 1 season with Mourinho. Please don't tell me he made them great players they are now... The only player that was a rough diamond polished by Jose was Drogba and tbh if it wasn't for that Cech penalty save he would be called a villain instead of a hero. He also gave that penalty away that Messi couldn't convert.

Isn't football succes always a result of couple of years of hard work? Mourinho had as much to do with us winning the trophy as all the previous managers, well maybe except Scolari. He did give us Bosingwa tho :eyebrows:

[Manuf 1,448]

The funny thing is most of those things now apply to RDM. Under him we won 2 of our last 8 games and with Man city and Fulham coming up, there's every chance of that bad run continuing. We got destroyed in Italy yet again, and lost to West brom yet again.

I'm pretty sure he was fired because Roman decided to act quicker this time, and not let things get as bad as they did under AVB - where we fell to 5th and needed to win CL to make the competition this season. If at the end of the season we end up in the top 4 then he would have been justified, whether anyone likes it or not.

Well, Roberto lost only 12 out of 36 and tbh the only games I blame him for were WBA and Swansea. We got robbed against Man Utd, couldn't convert our chances against QPR and that cunt Suarez scored a goal after fouling Ramires. He did make few mistakes but I felt that with January window he would change a lot of things, especially this wanker up-front as he realized he's not good enough for anybody in the last games.

Champions League is a different story as we had two teams that were unbeaten for a huge amount of time. Can you really compare Juventus and Shakhtar to Genk, Valencia or Bayer Leverkusen?

[The only place to be 11,313]

How could Mourinho influence Cech? Did he change his keeping style or what? When we bought Cole he was already one of the best left-backs in the world and both Cole and Mikel played roughly over 1 season with Mourinho. Please don't tell me he made them great players they are now... The only player that was a rough diamond polished by Jose was Drogba and tbh if it wasn't for that Cech penalty save he would be called a villain instead of a hero. He also gave that penalty away that Messi couldn't convert.

Isn't football succes always a result of couple of years of hard work? Mourinho had as much to do with us winning the trophy as all the previous managers, well maybe except Scolari. He did give us Bosingwa tho :eyebrows:

Actually Mourinho's influence on Cech changed the way he used the ball. It became a case of getting it up to either Didier to hold the ball up for support from midfield to take advantage of broken formations, or to the wings to isolate full-backs and wingers 1-on-1.

Cole was already a great player, but Mourinho had a pretty big impact on Mikel's personal life and the way he approached the game.

Drogba wasn't a rough diamond, but he did kick on under Mourinho and then again under Ancelotti. You're also forgetting Lampard who became world-class under Jose. My original point though is that Robbie didn't build last season's team. He essentially just let them be themselves with a bit of tinkering here and there.

[Milan 17,835]

Actually, Fergie has 'only' one CWC title (+ one Intercontinental Cup) so he probably can't stand the idea that Benitez would have more than him.

[Sheva. 5,373]

Well, Roberto lost only 12 out of 36 and tbh the only games I blame him for were WBA and Swansea. We got robbed against Man Utd, couldn't convert our chances against QPR and that cunt Suarez scored a goal after fouling Ramires. He did make few mistakes but I felt that with January window he would change a lot of things, especially this wanker up-front as he realized he's not good enough for anybody in the last games.

Champions League is a different story as we had two teams that were unbeaten for a huge amount of time. Can you really compare Juventus and Shakhtar to Genk, Valencia or Bayer Leverkusen?

Yes he didn't lose as many as AVB, but we certainly were not headed in the right direction. The CL group was tough no doubt, but with our bad form in the league and likely elimination in the CL, things could get very very bad before January.

[Manuf 1,448]

Actually Mourinho's influence on Cech changed the way he used the ball. It became a case of getting it up to either Didier to hold the ball up for support from midfield to take advantage of broken formations, or to the wings to isolate full-backs and wingers 1-on-1.

Cole was already a great player, but Mourinho had a pretty big impact on Mikel's personal life and the way he approached the game.

Drogba wasn't a rough diamond, but he did kick on under Mourinho and then again under Ancelotti. You're also forgetting Lampard who became world-class under Jose. My original point though is that Robbie didn't build last season's team. He essentially just let them be themselves with a bit of tinkering here and there.

Well if Mourinho did help Cech with his ball contribution that he should hang his head in shame, becuase that's the only thing Cech's been criticized for.

The man we should be thankful for polishing Mikel is Carlo Ancelotti. He was the man who helped John reach the higher level.

Lampard was chosen as the 2nd best player in the world, behind Henry, the season before Mourinho took charge. Can't say Jose made him world-class either.

Of course Robbie didn't build the last year's team. He gave them confidence, hunger and passion. He collected everything all the previous managers worked on and put the best team possible that night. It wasn't a pretty victory, but a glorious one after all. It's biased to credit how this man changed the whole season to managers who worked few years back.

@edit - excuse me, I made an error above. He was chosen 2nd best player in the PL, not the world.

[BlueSanti 290]

The funny thing is most of those things now apply to RDM. Under him we won 2 of our last 8 games and with Man city and Fulham coming up, there's every chance of that bad run continuing. We got destroyed in Italy yet again, and lost to West brom yet again.

I'm pretty sure he was fired because Roman decided to act quicker this time, and not let things get as bad as they did under AVB - where we fell to 5th and needed to win CL to make the competition this season. If at the end of the season we end up in the top 4 then he would have been justified, whether anyone likes it or not.

I am pretty sure Roman decided to act even more stupid this time and acted disgracefully to the legend.

[Manuf 1,448]

Yes he didn't lose as many as AVB, but we certainly were not headed in the right direction. The CL group was tough no doubt, but with our bad form in the league and likely elimination in the CL, things could get very very bad before January.

The CL is not in our hands anymore. We need other team to change our situation, nothing Benitez can fix. I wouldn't say our form in the league was "that" bad. We fucked few games, but we could handle the situation until January. We always go through bad period in November/December and Robbie was the only manager fired for that. And I'm not saying he should get a whole season, as I know that football clubs are also investments now, but 2 weeks until the CWC or some time after January window wouldn't change our situation so dramatically.

[BlueSanti 290]

Well if Mourinho did help Cech with his ball contribution that he should hang his head in shame, becuase that's the only thing Cech's been criticized for.

The man we should be thankful for polishing Mikel is Carlo Ancelotti. He was the man who helped John reach the higher level.

Lampard was chosen as the 2nd best player in the world, behind Henry, the season before Mourinho took charge. Can't say Jose made him world-class either.

Of course Robbie didn't build the last year's team. He gave them confidence, hunger and passion. He collected everything all the previous managers worked on and put the best team possible that night. It wasn't a pretty victory, but a glorious one after all. It's biased to credit how this man changed the whole season to managers who worked few years back.

@edit - excuse me, I made an error above. He was chosen 2nd best player in the PL, not the world.

Altough that I agree with your post I have to add something. Lampard was also selected as 2nd best Europen player in 2005; just behind Ronaldino.

[The only place to be 11,313]

Well if Mourinho did help Cech with his ball contribution that he should hang his head in shame, becuase that's the only thing Cech's been criticized for.

The man we should be thankful for polishing Mikel is Carlo Ancelotti. He was the man who helped John reach the higher level.

Lampard was chosen as the 2nd best player in the world, behind Henry, the season before Mourinho took charge. Can't say Jose made him world-class either.

Of course Robbie didn't build the last year's team. He gave them confidence, hunger and passion. He collected everything all the previous managers worked on and put the best team possible that ni

Ight. It wasn't a pretty victory, but a glorious one after all. It's biased to credit how this man changed the whole season to managers who worked few years back.

It's not biased - it's just a recognition of Jose's importance at the club then and now. I personally think Di Matteo went back to what the key players knew and that was the pragmatic approach of Mourinho.

I also don'r recall Lamps getting that recognition until after Mourinho arrived but I'd have to check.

Also Cech's distribution serves a purpose - if you look at what he's done recently it's incorporated a lot more short kicks to one of the two defenders or Mikel much like they do at Barca.

[Joker10 946]

The funny thing is most of those things now apply to RDM. Under him we won 2 of our last 8 games and with Man city and Fulham coming up, there's every chance of that bad run continuing. We got destroyed in Italy yet again, and lost to West brom yet again.

I'm pretty sure he was fired because Roman decided to act quicker this time, and not let things get as bad as they did under AVB - where we fell to 5th and needed to win CL to make the competition this season. If at the end of the season we end up in the top 4 then he would have been justified, whether anyone likes it or not.

That is extremely low standard. So all Rafa has to do is not fuck up?

[Manuf 1,448]

Altough that I agree with your post I have to add something. Lampard was also selected as 2nd best Europen player in 2005; just behind Ronaldino.

yeah but it was after the season Mourinho took charge so I didn't want to sound as Jose had nothing to do with Lamps being the player he is. I think that saying best European player should be counted as the best player in the World

[The only place to be 11,313]

I am pretty sure Roman decided to act even more stupid this time and acted disgracefully to the legend.

The one thing I don't think Roman is, is stupid. He's made a brave decision (and it is brave because he knows how the fans feel about Benitez) to do what he thinks is best for the club until the end of the season.

Answer this one question - did you feel more hopeful for this game against Man City knowing Benitez was in charge, or knowing Di Matteo was in charge?

[BlueSanti 290]

Actually, Fergie has 'only' one CWC title (+ one Intercontinental Cup) so he probably can't stand the idea that Benitez would have more than him.

If I was working so hard like Ferguson I would also be pissed if some cunt won it without even doing anything. Just saying that even if he said it because of this reason I do not wonder at all.

[The only place to be 11,313]

If I was working so hard like Ferguson I would also be pissed if some cunt won it without even doing anything.

Because that's why Fergie is saying it.

[Manuf 1,448]

It's not biased - it's just a recognition of Jose's importance at the club then and now. I personally think Di Matteo went back to what the key players knew and that was the pragmatic approach of Mourinho.

I also don'r recall Lamps getting that recognition until after Mourinho arrived but I'd have to check.

Also Cech's distribution serves a purpose - if you look at what he's done recently it's incorporated a lot more short kicks to one of the two defenders or Mikel much like they do at Barca.

I'm not saying Jose wasn't important, I really consider him as THE most important manager in our history, but Roberto deserves majority of the credit for that CL win. What I think Robbie did was not great tactical approach to the game but bringing the heart back after that terrible spell with Andre.

Yep, Lamps was already considered one of the best midfielders out there, that's why Mourinho planned the midfield around him.

The Cech's distribution nowadays is far different to what he did under Mourinho. We don't have many tall players nowadays so we have to play it from the back.

That is extremely low standard. So all Rafa has to do is not fuck up?

do you really feel he was brought here till the end of the season to make some kind of a wonder? of course he's just a filling for the gap between we get a proper manager.

[BlueSanti 290]

yeah but it was after the season Mourinho took charge so I didn't want to sound as Jose had nothing to do with Lamps being the player he is. I think that saying best European player should be counted as the best player in the World

Thats was exactlly my point mate. Even though Mourinho didn't 'create' Super Frank he also had his contribution in it.

And yeah you are right; I just wanted to be precise :-)

[BlueSanti 290]

Because that's why Fergie is saying it.

Did you read the whole thing or just picked some parts?