Leif

Compilations? I assume of his best bits? (As that's how most on here judge a player.) If we did that for every player we would have spent that £50mil on Negredo, not Torres.

Right, and Mata? He can't get in ahead of Fibreglass. So is he overrated? Shall we sell him? If you think Johnson hasn't shown 'talent' then I'm not sure you watch football.

Ah, so doing the weak and easy thing of trying to base it all off stats I see. You still didn't answer my question. How many full games of his have you actually seen?

Ah, Mata can barely get a game for Spain these days. Sturridge isn't in the England squad. David Luiz is rarely picked for Brazil anymore (his injury aside). Ramires can't get a game for Brazil. Let's fuck them all off and buy more expensive players who ARE in their national teams starting line-ups, shall we? Great logic.

Ah, best in Portugal for a few seasons in a row? Was Falcao not the best just a season or 2 ago? Cardozo has also been ahead of Hulk. Yeah, well you'll find Chelsea fans on here who rate Torres higher than Sturridge and Drogba. Doesn't mean he IS better though, does it? Doesn't mean he SHOULD be our number 1 man. Also, I can and will deny that he's a great player. He's just like most of the players we target - grossly overrated. May I ask - how many games of his have you seen?

Borini 'wasn't good enough' - sure is good enough for Roma and the senior Italy squad. (and now many want him back.) Just because a player can't show off his goods doesn't mean he's not good enough. That's just stupid to imply. Cristiano Ronaldo only had TWENTY FIVE league appearances for Sporting. If Manchester United had that stupid mentality I keep seeing all over this forum (thinking a player isn't good enough based on amount of appearances or what they haven't achieved in their current team), they wouldn't have had one of the greatest ever players.

Oh by the way - Hulk league appearances (whole career) - 202 appearances, mainly made up of Porto, Tokyo Verdy and Consadole Sapporo. Adam Johnson league appearances (whole career) - 186 appearances, mainly made up of current champions Manchester City and Middlesbrough. Johnson is 1 year younger and English. He's also less than half the price. It's simple.

Not proven!? He has 73 Premier League appearances for the current PL champions Manchester City and 11 league goals for them, where'as Hulk has only just over 20 more appearances than him in a FAR inferior league.

Just because someone isn't already in a top team demanding a ridiculous fee means they're a second-rate player. Anyone with just 1 eye can see that Jarvis has consistently been one of the best wingers in the UK these past few seasons. Also - Was Cristiano Ronaldo 2nd-rate when he was at Sporting? He didn't play for a big club, and I doubt you knew of him back then. Doesn't mean you just ignore that player and then go buy an inferior, more expensive one, just because they're talked about more. Hulk isn't even "great". He's good at best. The only reason he got those assists with Falcao is because, simply, Falcao is one of the best strikers in the world. Put Hulk and Torres in the same time, and I guarantee that Hulk won't get more than 5 Torres assists.

Just to put something into perspective. Here is a more accurate list of the only players I believe that, club loyalty/retirement plans etc. aside (so let's imagine they don't care about their current club that much), we couldn't buy for £38mil: Casillas Ramos Ronaldo Benzema Ozil Alonso Higuain Valdes Fabregas Iniesta Sanchez Messi Maybe Pastore Buffon Chiellini Thiago Silva The usual Man Utd/Man City/Liverpool/Arsenal/Tottenham players Ribery Gomez Lahm Gotze Neymar L.Moura Neuer Literally anyone else in the world could potentially be ours instead of Hulk for the same amount of money, club loyalty/age aside. One final thing:- Hulk - £38mil or - Adam Johnson - £15mil Nuri Sahin - Loan Debuchy - £12mil/Anyone else around the same price or anyone decent on a free. Any squad, youth or back-up players with the final £11mil. Grand total of Johnson, Sahin (for a season), Debuchy and some extra players? Same as Hulk. Now - Which is more appetising?

Well then. Spend £15mil on A.Johnson, and with the £23mil left over from what WOULD be spend on Hulk, we could buy a deep-lying playmaker and a back-up right-back.

Adam Johnson. Free to leave Manchester City for £15mil. Top winger. Matt Jarvis. Forrest from Celtic (amazing prospect). Farfan. Turan. Cazorla. A young relatively unknown player if our scouts ACTUALLY did some scouting.

I'll be ecstatic if we don't sign Hulk. Hate it when this forum blows up when we're linked with a new player and people decide we should go for him regardless, even if they've only seen a few international games of his and maybe 3 club games. It's as if people can't understand such SIMPLE things in football. Hulk is an inside-forward who plays on the wing, and loves getting goals. He sometimes cuts in, and sometimes (but less often) hugs the touchline. If we have Hazard and Mata interchanging, whenever Hulk cuts in, there will be a complete clusterfuck in the middle and our right side will be completely exposed, while Hazard, Mata and Hulk all run into eachother. There will then be someone charging down our right flank, and Torres, as he does, will then chase down that man on our right flank as he enjoys winning back the ball, meaning we don't even have a striker in position anymore. Just because someone plays on the wing doesn't mean they're a winger. De Bruyne isn't a winger, Kakuta isn't a winger, Kalou isn't a winger, Mata isn't a winger, Hazard isn't a winger etc. What we need is someone who grew up as a small child, and had the mentality of - "I want to be a winger when I grow up! I love getting assists!". Not a Brazilian striker who didn't work out in his favoured goal-getting striker position, who was then put out wide. ALSO - It's not a case of "It's not our money, who cares if Roman spends it?". It's a case of if he spends this much on Hulk right after what's been spent on Hazard, he's less likely to want to invest again this season in other areas which need improvement more. Imagine the amount of top players, squad players or prospects we could buy with £38mil. We could buy literally any player in Ligue 1 for that amount, almost any player from the Bundesliga for that amount, any player from Serie A, (barring Thiago Silva), for that amount. Any player from La Liga, barring Barcelona and Real Madrid players, for that amount. Any player from any lower league in any country, barring Neymar, for that amount. And you guys want to spend it on HULK!? Shocking.

That Transfer News Central page spreading even more bullshit as they copy a piece of "news" from a fake Jason Cundy Twitter saying that RDM has turned down the job. How people believe that page baffles me.

While we're on the subject of Hulk though - Here's a list of better players suited to the right wing role who would be realistic purchases AND cheaper - Ayew Adam Johnson (Manchester City are probably stupid enough to sell to a rival, and he won't get any playing time there.) Cazorla (Only moved club a season or so ago, but a good bid would get him with Romeu or someone going out on loan the other way.) Our own De Bruyne Our own Ramires Matt Phillips Darko Lazovic Valbuena (Prefers to play through the centre, but is great on the wing) Gaston Ramirez James Forrest (Yes, I'm serious. Reminds me of Pat Nevin.) That'll do for now.

Don't trust TNC. All they do is copy and paste from other pages, tweak a few words and then claim it's from their 'sources'. I should know. They originally stole my own fucking page. (long story)

Here's a point everyone is missing - It wasn't Torres who made Spain look dangerous when he came on - It was the midfielders. The tactics changed the moment he got on the pitch, and from that moment on, the midfielders no longer tried to pass the ball into the box, but instead tried as many hoofed, looped and through balls as possible, while Torres just ran behind the defenders, and then wasted the shot or dwelled too long before passing.

Well, I'm not calling you a liar, but your profile says that you're 17, meaning you would be around 11/12 just as he's leaving Atletico Madrid, thus not giving you enough time to become a fan of his. Of course unless you mean you started being a big fan of his when you were around 10 years old or younger, but I've rarely heard of non-Spanish people following Atletico Madrid of all teams or any of their players at such a young age, especially considering La Liga wasn't even broadcasted outside of Spain back then I believe. Again, not accusing anyone of lying - Simply smelling something fishy. (maybe I need a shower.)

So - You've been a Torres fan boy for 5 years, you admit. 5 years ago was 2007 - the year Torres signed for Liverpool. So you've been a supporter and follower of Fernando Torres since he became Liverpool's (who we hate) star man? This is what I was meaning earlier when I mentioned in my original post to everyone "Do you support Chelsea or do you just support Torres?" or whatever it was.

How about - Sign Fellaini for around £12mil (they need the cash), and loan Romeu to Everton as an instant replacement at their end. THAT I'd be happy about. As long as Romeu gets to play.

Obviously, I'll get the 'glory hunter' title for this, but I may start following (not necessarily supporting) PSG. Love the city, love Alex and Ancelotti, love Thiago Silva, and it's simply an exciting project to follow. Rumours have it they could even sign Maicon O.o Maicon---Alex---Silva---SomeCrappyLeftBack = Wow.

To be honest, I will respect Silva if he joins PSG. Same with Lavezzi. Do you know why? They don't care about the Premier League hype, or want to battle in the El Clasico. They want to ENJOY their football again while getting paid very well. Yes, players get such a huge amount of money, but the stress of being one of the best players in a top, top, top league is huge. This will be good for football if it happens.

Messi is great, no doubt, but certainly not the best. He's far from a complete player in his position, mainly due to his lack of areal ability. Zidane, Beckenbauer, Platini (hate him), Gerd Muller, Gentile, I could go on and on. These players are truly great. I understand that Messi has an absolutely extraordinary scoring record; but that still does not make him the best. Gerd Muller is an example. His scoring record on both an international stage and at club level surpasses Messi. Zidane is simply the greatest midfielder ever, Gentile the greatest man-marker ever, Platini the 2nd greatest perhaps midfielder after Zizou, etc. You could put all these players in one team, and Messi would look like a boy amongst men (although I'm sure there would be moments of great skill thrown in there.) The players I've mentioned just really are a class above the rest. They really are spectacular. Also, when against an Italian defence, he simply doesn't score from open play. When against a solid defence like ours, he doesn't score full-stop. When it matters at an international level (no, a friendly against Brazil's "C" team like the other day doesn't count) he often flops and goes missing in the games. Not the best.

1) - He wants to be playing because no one likes to wake up in the morning and read "£50million bench warmer" as every headline. If he wanted playing time, he wouldn't have left Liverpool for us. They had less strikers than us, less competition for a starting role, and was adored by fans. 2) - I'm not even trying to be funny, but he should know by now that after what feels like 10's of thousands of messed up chances in front of goal and chances to help the TEAM, that it's complete idiocy to think that he'd get the chance to take the most important kick of our clubs recent history. He'd probably fluff the shot or have it saved. Not exactly helping the team there, is it? The only reason anyone would want to take such an important kick under such circumstances would be to try and redeem themselves, with their own personal feelings ahead of the club's. 3) - Yes, they are. Just like Torres is a 'legend' in some of the supporters eyes at this club. Although I, you, or anyone else may or may not agree with it, you cannot just say "No, they're not" or that they shouldn't be, as it's not up to us to decide. That's like telling someone not to like the colour pink because it's 'girly'. 4) - I'm pretty sure he said he wanted to stay at Liverpool, regain his fitness and lead the club to glory. *fast forward a few weeks later* ... *hands in transfer request at a club which gave him almost everything where he was adored by supporters, players and staff*. Ooo, what a nice man. Talk about loyalty and wanting to be there for the team.

SORRY FOR BEING A TOTAL COCK IN ADVANCE:- (And damaging my rep. further) Some of the fans we've picked up since January 31st, 2011; need to ask themselves - Am I a fan of Chelsea? Or just a fan of Fernando Torres? The reason I say this is because it's baffling that so many Chelsea 'supporters' seem to put blind faith in an Ex-Liverpool player who still loves the reds, regardless whether the Liverpool fans like him or not, and clearly doesn't give a F' about being here. Did you see how he reacted when he couldn't take a penalty in the shootout vs. Bayern? He didn't care about the team. He just wanted personal glory, to try and drag himself out of the sh**hole he's dragged himself into, and that same hole we were in for a while this season courtesy of Mr. Nando. Of COURSE we were going to have our legends; Cole, Lampard, Drogba (And Mata and Luiz are already legends in many of our eyes) take the penalties ahead of him! He isn't CHELSEA. He's simply a passenger who's along for the ride. (Thanks for winning that corner which lead to Drogba's goal though.) The moment any offer comes in for him, he'll jump at the chance to leave. Will you then 'support' his new club? Again, this is not aimed at ALL people who are putting faith in Torres, as the majority of you are actually Chelsea supporters. I'm just not so sure about some others. (I guess it's just sad seeing people slate players like Kalou, Bosingwa, Malouda (regardless how many bad moments they've had with us) but refuse to criticise the man with sexy blonde hair.)