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the wes

Tiemoué Bakayoko

Started by the wes,

1,065 posts in this topic
53 minutes ago, BoyBlue96 said:

This is a Conte player. Exactly the type of defensive midfielder he loves to play in a 3-4-3 or 3-5-2 formation. Very strong and will bring much energy to our midfield. I think that's what Antonio is looking out for for the eventual change to 3-5-2. 2 strong DM's, think N'Golo, Matic and this guy and then a box to box midfielder like Nainggolan or even better Verratti.

Isn't AS Monaco full of young talented players? I watched the UCL games against Spurs and what a wonderfull club. Thomas Lemar. This Bakayoko.
I prefer Bakayoko and Sidibe over James.

People who rage over this guy because of Chalobah... don't think Nate is being favoured much by Conte.

 

Reminds me a bit off Michael Essien. As much as Kanté reminds me of Makelele. 

You recon 3:5:2 would work in PL tho? Without wingers (not that in 3:4:3 we have natural wingers, but still), it would be quite difficult against some teams. If we intend to play 3:5:2, we would definately need two absolutely brilliant attacking wingbacks to add width. Moses and Alonso are good in current setup, because they get supported by Eden and Pedro, but if they were alone, I think quality of our attack from wings would drop.

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17 hours ago, Chelsea Legend 11 said:

Why go after Bakayoko? Because he provides energy, technique and ball winning ability to a team that have thrived up until this point on these exact qualities. We're in for the title, if anything happens to either Kante or Matic we're screwed that loss/losses becomes marginal if we are able to acquire a like for like substitute in Bakayoko. Remember we're not just losing Mikel its also Oscar. No one we get in January is going to be an automatic starter, what we need are options should players form drop. We can address your want for a prime Vidal(if that even exists) in the Summer.

And as far as his progress goes how does minimal playing time in a 4 month period stall a 22 yr olds career? If it doesn't work out he goes on loan next year to get more time. Its about challenging yourself at the highest level, that's when you begin to understand how far you need to go and how hard you need to work... Moses is a perfect example of this. 

Well maybe it could work. But his passing is realy average. Essien and Yaya both had brilliant passing abilities and great tecnhique. Essien not to that extent as Yaya, but he was still very composed passer. Bakayoko even tho he is young, his passing is worse than Matic. Apart from that he is top player and well, if Conte wants him then so be it.

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15 minutes ago, BlueLyon said:

You recon 3:5:2 would work in PL tho? Without wingers (not that in 3:4:3 we have natural wingers, but still), it would be quite difficult against some teams. If we intend to play 3:5:2, we would definately need two absolutely brilliant attacking wingbacks to add width. Moses and Alonso are good in current setup, because they get supported by Eden and Pedro, but if they were alone, I think quality of our attack from wings would drop.

It worked for Italy on the EURO 2016 against other teams with different formations.

If you have the right players, every formation will fit.

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2 hours ago, BlueLyon said:

Well maybe it could work. But his passing is realy average. Essien and Yaya both had brilliant passing abilities and great tecnhique. Essien not to that extent as Yaya, but he was still very composed passer. Bakayoko even tho he is young, his passing is worse than Matic. Apart from that he is top player and well, if Conte wants him then so be it.

Who would you go for? 

Our midfield options are Kante, Matic, Fabregas, Mikel and Chalobah. It might seem like a lot of options, but keep in mind that Mikel is leaving in January while Chalobah is unlikely to offer the same level as the remaining three in any way. That leaves us with Kante, Matic and Fabregas. Fabregas is not really suited to our way of playing, and is more of a tactical option at this point. To play the way Conte intends, we basically need Kante and Matic out of our current players, and for all we know one of them might do their knee in on Monday. 

In other words, not buying a CM in January will jeopardize any potential title chase, as it is likely to go the whole way and every margin matters. So, if we can agree on this, who would you buy? I'm not trying to be rude or anything, Im just honestly curious as I see people complain about Badelj, Bakayoko and Nainggolan, but not provide any alternatives. This does not necessarily extend to you, but I just want to know who people see us go for. 

Nainggolan is pursued by us. That much is clear. If you compare him to Bakayoko, then Radja is statistically the worse defender, has worse technique and is worse in the air. As much as I would like to dismiss the aerial statistics, it is actually very relevant, and Bakayoko is a monster in that department. Look how many goals from set pieces we see in the PL. Radja is however the better passer and better shooter, but is that enough? 
My only concern with Bakayoko is his passing ability. He seems ok with the simple ones, but nothing more than that. Is that something he can develop? I do not think it is something you can vastly improve, but considering it seems to be his only clear weakness, even a small improvement would translate into a top class player. 

I am honestly torn here. Radja is a short term purchase, likely to last us 3-4 seasons. That is enough to justify a pretty large transfer fee for me, but the question is whether he is what we need. The CM scene right now seems to be better than in a long time. We have Bakayoko, Fabinho, Tolisso, Weigl (new contract though), Keita & Kessie in the market outside of the top tier. It is likely that a few of them will leave their clubs in the summer, and I would prefer us grabbing one of them rather than buy someone much older. Furthermore, I think that the midfield is at least acceptable without that super passing ability as long as we can find someone on the RW that is at least close to the level of Hazard & Costa. 

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We're not linked to the guy at all, I'm sure we'll never be, but I'd much rather go for Kevin Kampl. He's for the most part consistent, and like Essien was he can be your best defensive player on the day, then your best attacking player the next. Failing that, Franco Vazquez has been the best midfielder in La Liga for me this season, and nobody from Seville would turn down a move to us. He's more attacking oriented but again, he has those days where he intercepts & tackles more than everyone else.

I want to say 'Enough kids' before we turn into Arsenal.

I would take Schneiderlin too, as a back-up player. Just because he's been mismanaged at United doesn't mean the qualities he showed at Southampton are magically gone.

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Seems to be linked with alot of good teams right now so must be something good about him I admit to not knowing owt about him apart from couple of youtube vids.  But at 22 I would question whether hes that much better than Chalobah. Now I'm not sure whetrher Conte has full faith in him nut I think Chalohah could be very good with right training.

Now if hes not exceptionally better than Chalobah then I think we should leave it and buy one that is. Not just to bring out on occasions. But  bring in 1st team starters and use current ones for depth.

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4 hours ago, BlueLyon said:

Well maybe it could work. But his passing is realy average. Essien and Yaya both had brilliant passing abilities and great tecnhique. Essien not to that extent as Yaya, but he was still very composed passer. Bakayoko even tho he is young, his passing is worse than Matic. Apart from that he is top player and well, if Conte wants him then so be it.

Yes Essien and Yaya were world class midfielders I don't get the comparison?

Bakayoko is likely gonna be a squad guy with a chance to replace Matic because the other things he does on the pitch are way better than Nemanja.

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On 22.12.2016 at 4:57 PM, Tomo said:

Chalobah is never going to be more than a O Shea style squad player, abandoning signing's because of Nate would be insane.

I always say the same, I don't care about our young players as long as we buy clear world-class player/talent. I'm all for buying Busquets to block Nate's path. But this guy is marginally better copy of Chalobah and lacks experience. So 30m€ for a project who still needs few years to develop? Stick with Chalobah and spend on something we don't have. It can be even youngster as long as good one who offers something new.

 

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32 minutes ago, Chelsea Legend 11 said:

Yes Essien and Yaya were world class midfielders I don't get the comparison?

Bakayoko is likely gonna be a squad guy with a chance to replace Matic because the other things he does on the pitch are way better than Nemanja.

I meant that Bakayoko passing is likely not gonna get him spot in top team. He is Mikel-level at that and regardless if he is brilliant tackler, your DM needs to be sound technicaly. Both Essien and Yaya were that, but Bakayoko is not (because some pointed out that he is similar).

So if he is only going to be back up, why not just have Matic for back up and buy a top midfielder to play next to Kante? (not in january but in summer obv.)

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25 minutes ago, Chelsea Legend 11 said:

Yes Essien and Yaya were world class midfielders I don't get the comparison?

Bakayoko is likely gonna be a squad guy with a chance to replace Matic because the other things he does on the pitch are way better than Nemanja.

Is it just good squad guys we should be looking at or ones to go into the 1st team as starters?

Dont know about you but I'd dearly like to see us buy a couple of world class players to show that we are serious in making a move on Europe.

Yes I understand we arent in Europe YET and we aren't nor never been a club like Mounure that attracts these players but we do have a few quid and money talks.

Im not saying buy them for the sake of buying them but in a couple of key positions buying class IMHO

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3 minutes ago, BlueLyon said:

I meant that Bakayoko passing is likely not gonna get him spot in top team. He is Mikel-level at that and regardless if he is brilliant tackler, your DM needs to be sound technicaly. Both Essien and Yaya were that, but Bakayoko is not (because some pointed out that he is similar).

So if he is only going to be back up, why not just have Matic for back up and buy a top midfielder to play next to Kante? (not in january but in summer obv.)

Because we're short in numbers right now. We need a like for like right now we're playing for the title... Does that mean nothing to you?

I think you need to watch Bakayoko a little closer he's better than Matic in terms of technique. And while he's not gonna wow you with his passing game he is very good at retaining possession and getting it out from his feet quickly. Definitely not Mikel....

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2 minutes ago, Blue Colored Sky said:

I always say the same, I don't care about our young players as long as we buy clear world-class player/talent. But this guy is marginally better copy of Chalobah and lacks experience. So 30m€ for a project who still needs few years to develop? Stick tick with Chalobah and spend on something we don't have. It can be even youngster as long as good one who offers something new.

Interesting. One is a bench player who has started like 15 games during the last three seasons including this one, and the other is a starter at CL-playing Monaco and a strong factor in their recent performances. You would think that there more than a "marginal" difference between them. 

Let us just be real for a moment. On what basis are you comparing the two players? Chalobah has done almost nothing since his great season at Watford. Bakayoko might not be world-class right now, but to call him marginally better than Chalobah is not fair. He is comparable on every level to Matic, and I would not really consider Matic "marginally" better than Chalobah. 

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15 minutes ago, Unionjack said:

Is it just good squad guys we should be looking at or ones to go into the 1st team as starters?

Dont know about you but I'd dearly like to see us buy a couple of world class players to show that we are serious in making a move on Europe.

Yes I understand we arent in Europe YET and we aren't nor never been a club like Mounure that attracts these players but we do have a few quid and money talks.

Im not saying buy them for the sake of buying them but in a couple of key positions buying class IMHO

So who do you have in mind? Will any old world class player do?

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Found this on Youtube Bakayoko vs. PSG in which he was directly up against Marco Verratti. I can see why we are considering him based on this performance.... Very combative.

 

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1 minute ago, Chelsea Legend 11 said:

So who do you have in mind? Will any old world class player do?

lol I wouldn't mind a couple of them. A RW to upgrade Willian, a CB to replace Cahil and a strong hard fast creative CM if we could magic one up lol. And a LWB if its my Santas list  while I'm at it.

But its who we could tempt?. Its easy to say get so n so  but reality is a hard knock. Even as Chelsea supporters we cant all agree on 1 single player, either that we have or that we need.

So I just say my opinion what I think we need in general and leave the names to everyone else.

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26 minutes ago, Rekin said:

Interesting. One is a bench player who has started like 15 games during the last three seasons including this one, and the other is a starter at CL-playing Monaco and a strong factor in their recent performances. You would think that there more than a "marginal" difference between them. 

Let us just be real for a moment. On what basis are you comparing the two players? Chalobah has done almost nothing since his great season at Watford. Bakayoko might not be world-class right now, but to call him marginally better than Chalobah is not fair. He is comparable on every level to Matic, and I would not really consider Matic "marginally" better than Chalobah. 

Who's this guy Bakayoko even? 

In other thread I said that within first 2 minutes of YouTube clips I can say if there's something wrong with the player - and he is such case. I start looking at him, on the videos that supposedly should make him look good and he looks so poor on the ball, his technique is average. Seriously, how can we contemplate buying such player for our title push? This is the guy that solidify us in the front seat?  Guy who can't make opening pass? 

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13 minutes ago, Chelsea Legend 11 said:

Found this on Youtube Bakayoko vs. PSG in which he was directly up against Marco Verratti. I can see why we are considering him based on this performance.... Very combative.

 

I have seen this video before and I agree. Bakayoko is similar to Matic in terms of skill set, but more dynamic. He drives the ball forward a lot more, and I feel that it is what we need. He also has better pace to recover should we lose possession. 

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2 minutes ago, Blue Colored Sky said:

Who's this guy Bakayoko even? 

In other thread I said that within first 2 minutes of YouTube clips I can say if there's something wrong with the player - and he is such case. I start looking at him, on the videos that supposedly should make him look good and he looks so poor on the ball, his technique is average. Seriously, how can we contemplate buying such player for our title push? This is the guy that solidify us in the front seat?  Guy who can't make opening pass? 

you're embarrassing yourself.

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2 minutes ago, Blue Colored Sky said:

Who's this guy Bakayoko even? 

In other thread I said that within first 2 minutes of YouTube clips I can say if there's something wrong with the player - and he is such case. I start looking at him, on the videos that supposedly should make him look good and he looks so poor on the ball, his technique is average. Seriously, how can we contemplate buying such player for our title push? This is the guy that solidify us in the front seat?  Guy who can't make opening pass? 

Who is he? What kind of an answer do you expect? He is a central midfielder playing for Monaco. 

Let us get one thing straight, I quoted you on the comparison with Chalobah. Something I see you did not reply to in your answer.
Regarding his abilities, I both agree and disagree with you. He looks clumsy, the way Yaya can look clumsy sometimes. He is simply a big dude, which rarely provides an aesthetically pleasant appearance when controlling a ball. If you look at what he does with the ball though, he is very capable in combining his strength and technique to get past players. Again, his skill set is similar to Matic, and I suspect he will be the better of the two very soon. 

When you say his technique is average, who are you comparing with? I have already agreed that he is a poor passer, and I do not recall saying that he is our best option. I simply think that when people say "he isnt good enough", there is a certain standard associated with their expectations for the position. It would be interesting to know which players live up to this standard. Otherwise every discussion is just "nah, he is too average". Does average means Mikel? Does it mean Matic? 

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54 minutes ago, Chelsea Legend 11 said:

Because we're short in numbers right now. We need a like for like right now we're playing for the title... Does that mean nothing to you?

I think you need to watch Bakayoko a little closer he's better than Matic in terms of technique. And while he's not gonna wow you with his passing game he is very good at retaining possession and getting it out from his feet quickly. Definitely not Mikel....

Dont get me wrong, he is good talent, I love watching Monaco, but right now we need to fix other areas first and then seek for backups in DM area. 

Anyway I hear he would only arrive in summer anyway so its likely he wont be helping us win title.

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