Best Defenders in Chelsea history

[theoteho 6]

carvalho JT and cole

[jmarlow 458]

for me Carvalho is the best defender in Premier League history!

[TorontoChelsea 4,064]

for me Carvalho is the best defender in Premier League history!

Carvalho was fantastic but I think people forget how often he was hurt. He only played more than 40 games once in 6 seasons. By comparison, Terry has played more than 40 games 9 times. If you're talking about the best of the best, you have to not only look at quality but at quantity and Carvalho only played 135 games in the Premier League. Terry has played 373,

[bombayblue™ 55]

Carvalho and Desailly for me

Carvalho and Desailly are both better defenders than John Terry but Terry alongwith his leadership qualities makes for a better pick in a team.

[BleedsBlue 1,549]

Didier Drogba

[bombayblue™ 55]

Carvalho was fantastic but I think people forget how often he was hurt. He only played more than 40 games once in 6 seasons. By comparison, Terry has played more than 40 games 9 times. If you're talking about the best of the best, you have to not only look at quality but at quantity and Carvalho only played 135 games in the Premier League. Terry has played 373,

Desailly only played 156 in the PL and was an automatic choices as captain, quite like JT.

Carvalho on the other hand had to break Gallas' partnership with JT and has had to compete with top defenders like Alex and Ivanovic for the chance to partner JT.

JT over the time Carvalho was here played 195 games in the PL, that's just 10 more games every season after being an automatic choice.

So I don't agree that judging the player on his number of games makes sense,

[TorontoChelsea 4,064]

Desailly only played 156 in the PL and was an automatic choices as captain, quite like JT.

Carvalho on the other hand had to break Gallas' partnership with JT and has had to compete with top defenders like Alex and Ivanovic for the chance to partner JT.

JT over the time Carvalho was here played 195 games in the PL, that's just 10 more games every season after being an automatic choice.

So I don't agree that judging the player on his number of games makes sense,

We're talking about overall career, so you absolutely have to talk about total games. Carvalho was fantastic, but he played the equivalent of only 3.5 seasons in the Premier League. Terry has played almost 10. Longevity matters a great deal.

[bombayblue™ 55]

We're talking about overall career, so you absolutely have to talk about total games. Carvalho was fantastic, but he played the equivalent of only 3.5 seasons in the Premier League. Terry has played almost 10. Longevity matters a great deal.

The topic seems to be about best defenders in Chelsea history, which at face value would suggest judging on abilities rather than longevity.

Surely, if we were to go by your logic, Ron Harris would be the best defender we've ever had and also make Eddie Mcreadie with 410 appearances a better Left Back than Ashley Cole at 261.

[TorontoChelsea 4,064]

The topic seems to be about best defenders in Chelsea history, which at face value would suggest judging on abilities rather than longevity.

Surely, if we were to go by your logic, Ron Harris would be the best defender we've ever had and also make Eddie Mcreadie with 410 appearances a better Left Back than Ashley Cole at 261.

No, because it's a combination of quality and quantity. Cole is world-class and Mcreadie was not even close. I think that Carvalho was probably better than Terry when he played, but just and it is certainly not clear cut. There is something in the moneyball world of statistics that applies across every sport that can help explain player value. It's called WAR or Wins Above Replacement. In others words, if you replaced a certain player with a league average player, how many wins would that cost you or give you. So, lets's say that Terry was worth 3 wins/per 38 games over a replacement player. That would mean that he'd have given Chelsea about 30 wins over the course of his career. In order for Carvalho to have the same value as Terry for their career's, he would have had be worth around 8.5 wins/38games for Chelsea. You can argue that Carvalho was better than Terry, but you can't argue he was 3 times better. Being an average player for a long time is of little value to a club, but Terry has been one of the best defenders in the world for a decade.

[bombayblue™ 55]

No, because it's a combination of quality and quantity. Cole is world-class and Mcreadie was not even close. I think that Carvalho was probably better than Terry when he played, but just and it is certainly not clear cut. There is something in the moneyball world of statistics that applies across every sport that can help explain player value. It's called WAR or Wins Above Replacement. In others words, if you replaced a certain player with a league average player, how many wins would that cost you or give you. So, lets's say that Terry was worth 3 wins/per 38 games over a replacement player. That would mean that he'd have given Chelsea about 30 wins over the course of his career. In order for Carvalho to have the same value as Terry for their career's, he would have had be worth around 8.5 wins/38games for Chelsea. You can argue that Carvalho was better than Terry, but you can't argue he was 3 times better. Being an average player for a long time is of little value to a club, but Terry has been one of the best defenders in the world for a decade.

Look where Moneyball got Liverpool.

On a serious note, I agree with what you say to a certain extent, but where does it end? If you intend to judge players from all perspectives over all the concerned factors, surely you'd want to account for the team they played for as well. Would Desailly have done better in this team, or would Carvalho and Terry push him to the bench without the armband.

Again, if the question is who is of more worth Terry would be ahead of Carvalho.

But I doubt that's the question, for me it was about ability.

[zolayes 14,489]

EASY solution play 3 5 2

back 3 ricci marcel jt

ash at left wing back in 5 midfield

[Duppy Conqueror 1,494]

for street/prison yard football: Ron Harris,Steve Wicks,Mick Droy,Doug Rougvie. .

for the pro`s. Dan,Riccy,JT,Cole.

i really liked Frank the beef. thought he really played solid as a CB but his passing of especially long balls was superb so many times

. anyone remember the Chelsea 4- Derby 0 game when Zola scored his only hat trick of his career?..in that game Frank hit a 40 yard diagonal to Zola,it floated with perfect weight on the ball over his right shoulder ,as it did Zola hadn`t seemed to be watching it but as it fell he trapped it perfectly between his studs and the ground then in one fluid movement rolled it off to a team mate.it was an insane piece of skill to the point that i can`t remember any of the goals in Zola`s hat trick but the millimetre perfect pass from Frank was sublime too.just incredible skill from both players. even my manc mate who was in town and went to the game with me stood up and applauded.

i`m not gonna argue about that being our best era of Chelsea during my thirty odd years watching the Chels but for things like that,the get a goal out of nothing.attacking flair and football genius.it is IMHO. it don`t matter how many titles we win over what we won back then.i will never forget those years with those players. don`t want to derail thread tho so best get back to those defenders.

Marcel was superb of course and like Frank unlucky not to get my vote but when you consider how good Gallas was too before the stereotypical frenchness came out in him. imho we definately have had the best batch CB`s overall when you look back over 20 years of the Prem. in the top 10 CB list we should have atleast 4 possibly 5 players on that list.

[amirhm74 3]

i think that jt is the best defender at all...for the next few years david luiz can be the best defender in chelsea.i like his playing method and his style too

we have the best defender in the world who can help us to be the best team of history

viva chelsea :X