🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿 Callum Hudson-Odoi

[Vesper 30,184]

1 minute ago, whats happening said:

ye ok, didnt know we have the next messi in our squad, sorry

we could have had him

Kylian Mbappe reveals details of Chelsea trial as 11-year-old starred in scoolboy win over Charlton

https://www.thesun.co.uk/sport/football/4408247/kylian-mbappe-chelsea-trial-arsenal/

[dreamcfc 182]

21 minutes ago, DDA said:

Its the perfect time to use Odoi. Intergrate a young hungry player into a new system from the start. What could be more ideal than that?? Seriously some of you guys are brainwashed by some sort of 'footballing protocoll'. 

I think your the one being brainwashed into thinking a 17 year old is going to come in and replace one of our best players of the last few years. While I rate CHO and hope he has a future here, currently he is nowhere near the level of Pedro and Willian, a few spins and an assist isn't going to change my mind either. 

We can't take risks like that if we are pushing for CL places, I get the point it would be good for him to learn from the start but personally I think it would be better for him to go out and play more games somewhere else.

Sure, if we were to make a few adjustments to our team, Willian gets sold etc he could have a spot this season but it won't be as a first choice.

[Vesper 30,184]

3 minutes ago, dreamcfc said:

You can't take risks like that if we are pushing for CL places, 
 

If this transfer window (and the whole general direction of the club for the last year) is what a club pushing for CL places looks like,then I think we must think the entire top half of the EPL table qualifies for the CL.

We have but added one new diamond to a broken bracelet that loses more lustre and links each week. We also brought in a new jewellery salesman and expect him to sell that broken bracelet for double the price the last salesman tried to and failed to do, and that was when it was in far better shape. As incentive, we are offering customers a 38 year old free box of Green candy.

[Sideshow Luiz 2,310]

7 minutes ago, Vesper said:

If this transfer window (and the whole general direction of the club for the last year) is what a club pushing for CL places looks like,then I think we must think the entire top half of the EPL table qualifies for the CL.

We have but added one new diamond to a broken bracelet that loses more lustre and links each week. We also brought in a new jewellery salesman and expect him to sell that broken bracelet for double the price the last salesman tried to and failed to do, and that was when it was in far better shape. As incentive, we are offering customers a 38 year old free box of Green candy.

The Green candy (decision) isn't THAT bad, but it kind of tastes like Butterfinger (for you non-NA members, image included)

It's home-grown, organically.  It's not going to keep, but it temporarily improves our numbers.  Causes fewer heart attacks than the Argentinian candy which is straight up bad for your health and will rot your teeth.

Last summer was a big problem.  We bought some diamonds for the bracelet, and they turned out to be fakes.  The problem you run in to with a store like ours, where you try to break even, is that you can't afford to buy any duds.  Last year we bought 6 gems.  3 of them ended up being fakes.  The jury is still out on 2 of them, and the last one is pretty good (IMO).  That's an effect that will be felt on the bottom line for years to come.

I think I've taken this analogy about as far as I can go.

[dreamcfc 182]

3 minutes ago, Vesper said:

If this transfer window (and the whole general direction of the club for the last year) is what a club pushing for CL places looks like,then I think we must think the entire top half of the EPL table qualifies for the CL.

We have but added one new diamond to a broken bracelet that loses more lustre and links each week. We also brought in a new jewellery salesman and expect him to sell that broken bracelet for double the price the last salesman tried to and failed to do, and that was when it was in far better shape. As incentive, we are offering customers a 38 year old free box of Green candy.

I don't understand your point, so your suggesting we are not a team that is competing for CL spots? 

We have so far, rejected massive bids for our best players, now you can speculate that we did it because we were trying to milk more money and our plan backfired, or you could believe that we want to keep our best players to compete for CL spots. If the club had no ambition, you really think we would be waiting for players like Kante and Hazard to return.

[Vesper 30,184]

4 minutes ago, Sideshow Luiz said:

The Green candy (decision) isn't THAT bad, but it kind of tastes like Butterfinger (for you non-NA members, image included)

It's home-grown, organically.  It's not going to keep, but it temporarily improves our numbers.  Causes fewer heart attacks than the Argentinian candy which is straight up bad for your health and will rot your teeth.

Last summer was a big problem.  We bought some diamonds for the bracelet, and they turned out to be fakes.  The problem you run in to with a store like ours, where you try to break even, is that you can't afford to buy any duds.  Last year we bought 6 gems.  3 of them ended up being fakes.  The jury is still out on 2 of them, and the last one is pretty good (IMO).  That's an effect that will be felt on the bottom line for years to come.

I think I've taken this analogy about as far as I can go.

[Vesper 30,184]

1 hour ago, dreamcfc said:

I don't understand your point, so your suggesting we are not a team that is competing for CL spots? 

We have so far, rejected massive bids for our best players, now you can speculate that we did it because we were trying to milk more money and our plan backfired, or you could believe that we want to keep our best players to compete for CL spots. If the club had no ambition, you really think we would be waiting for players like Kante and Hazard to return.

to move forward, you have to do more than just retain territory already possessed

my gran could have accomplished what we have done (not sell Hazard and Courtois and Kante, one of which we will lsoe on a free next summer, and quite possible sell the other then for £50- 100m less than we could have gotten now)

all she would have had to do was not answer the phone

Also we will have lost another  75 to 100m plus or so in combined resale value on the ageing (all the following are over 30 or next summer will be damn close to it) Alonso, Willian, Luiz, Fàbregas, Drinkwater, Pedro, Giroud and the younger Moses and bakayoko (who will never be worth more than now as long as we have them)

 

Add up the £80m courtois is worth and we will get nothing on a free or next to nothing if we sell him in January, the 50 to 100m (I split difference and call it £75m less)  we get for Hazard (IF he doesn't re-sign)  and the 75ishm in lost value from the rest

 

that's well over £200m LESS cash we will have, just for sitting on our asses (and they STILL will need to be replaced, in an even more expensive market than thsi summer's)

that's pure loss, all from poor management

That doesnt even count the £75-100m plus we lost not qualifying for the CL 

it isnt surprising that Abramovich has lost 16 billion of his £25 or so billion net worth in the last last 5 to 7 years (he is down to £8.93 billion as of Jan1, 2018), if his team building skills (both in executive suite and on the field) are any reflection

[ZanSnake 1,211]

3 minutes ago, Vesper said:

to move forward, you have to do more than just retain territory already possessed

my gran could have accomplished what we have done (not sell Hazard and Courtois and Kante, one of which we will lsoe on a free next summer, and quite possible sell the other then for £50- 100m less than we could have gotten now)

all she would have had to do was not answer the phone

Also we will have lost another  75 to 100m plus or so in combined resale value on the ageing (all the following are over 30 or next summer will be damn close to it) Alonso, Willian, Luiz, Fàbregas, Drinkwater, Pedro, Giroud and the younger Moses and bakayoko (who will never be worth more than now as long as we have them)

 

Add up the £80m courtois is worth and we will get nothing on a free or next to nothing if we sell him in January, the 50 to 100m (I split difference and call it £75m less)  we get for Hazard (IF he doesn't re-sign)  and the 75ishm in lost value from the rest

 

that's well over £200m LESS cash we will have, just for sitting on our asses (and they STILL will need to be replaced, in an even more expensive market than thsi summer's)

that's pure loss, all from poor management

That doesnt even count the £75-100m plus we lost not qualifying for the CL 

it isnt surprising that Abramovich has lost 16 billion of his £25 or so billion net work in the last last 5 to 7 years (he is down to £8.93 billion as of Jan1, 2018), if his team building skills (both in executive suite and on the field) are any reflection

To work out that many sales this season would be outrageous. To gut a squad while also bringing in a new manager as well as not have CL football - a simple must have to some players - we can't have so much change.

Plus with the whole mystery over Romans' influence over transfers, finances into the club, etc. again would make any sales and purchases hard to come by.

We still don't know how the players will be with Sarri's approach, we are still left in dark in negotiations with the two big Belgiums.

In the end, we can't quite losses as it is harder now then ever to predict the transfer window prices.

Personally I would allow Sarri to mark who he thinks is not useful to his system, sell them and then go from there. But again, we have three/four days between the WC players arrive and the end of the window so it's all shitty timings.

[blues.bridge 343]

15 minutes ago, Vesper said:

to move forward, you have to do more than just retain territory already possessed

my gran could have accomplished what we have done (not sell Hazard and Courtois and Kante, one of which we will lsoe on a free next summer, and quite possible sell the other then for £50- 100m less than we could have gotten now)

all she would have had to do was not answer the phone

Also we will have lost another  75 to 100m plus or so in combined resale value on the ageing (all the following are over 30 or next summer will be damn close to it) Alonso, Willian, Luiz, Fàbregas, Drinkwater, Pedro, Giroud and the younger Moses and bakayoko (who will never be worth more than now as long as we have them)

 

Add up the £80m courtois is worth and we will get nothing on a free or next to nothing if we sell him in January, the 50 to 100m (I split difference and call it £75m less)  we get for Hazard (IF he doesn't re-sign)  and the 75ishm in lost value from the rest

 

that's well over £200m LESS cash we will have, just for sitting on our asses (and they STILL will need to be replaced, in an even more expensive market than thsi summer's)

that's pure loss, all from poor management

That doesnt even count the £75-100m plus we lost not qualifying for the CL 

it isnt surprising that Abramovich has lost 16 billion of his £25 or so billion net work in the last last 5 to 7 years (he is down to £8.93 billion as of Jan1, 2018), if his team building skills (both in executive suite and on the field) are any reflection

Completely agree!

[DDA 9,941]

1 hour ago, dreamcfc said:

I think your the one being brainwashed into thinking a 17 year old is going to come in and replace one of our best players of the last few years. While I rate CHO and hope he has a future here, currently he is nowhere near the level of Pedro and Willian, a few spins and an assist isn't going to change my mind either. 

We can't take risks like that if we are pushing for CL places, I get the point it would be good for him to learn from the start but personally I think it would be better for him to go out and play more games somewhere else.

Sure, if we were to make a few adjustments to our team, Willian gets sold etc he could have a spot this season but it won't be as a first choice.

I am not brainwashed at all. The eyes do not lie. I can see that CHO is going to become a top, top player. He has already been our best player pre season alongside Jorginho. Those two have stood out by a country mile. He passes extremely well. Takes players on with ease and has assisted already in two games. You would rather the Brazilian afro swivveling his foot around the ball for ten centuries each and every time he gets the ball on the wing?? Pedro will drfinitely thrive in Sarris system but comon, CHO is ready to go. How can you not see this?? It really does baffle me to be honest.

[Vesper 30,184]

37 minutes ago, DDA said:

I am not brainwashed at all. The eyes do not lie. I can see that CHO is going to become a top, top player. He has already been our best player pre season alongside Jorginho. Those two have stood out by a country mile. He passes extremely well. Takes players on with ease and has assisted already in two games. You would rather the Brazilian afro swivveling his foot around the ball for ten centuries each and every time he gets the ball on the wing?? Pedro will drfinitely thrive in Sarris system but comon, CHO is ready to go. How can you not see this?? It really does baffle me to be honest.

I agree with this fine gentleman from the lovey part of England known as Kent

 

[Vesper 30,184]

1 hour ago, ZanSnake said:

To work out that many sales this season would be outrageous. To gut a squad while also bringing in a new manager as well as not have CL football - a simple must have to some players - we can't have so much change.

Plus with the whole mystery over Romans' influence over transfers, finances into the club, etc. again would make any sales and purchases hard to come by.

We still don't know how the players will be with Sarri's approach, we are still left in dark in negotiations with the two big Belgiums.

In the end, we can't quite losses as it is harder now then ever to predict the transfer window prices.

Personally I would allow Sarri to mark who he thinks is not useful to his system, sell them and then go from there. But again, we have three/four days between the WC players arrive and the end of the window so it's all shitty timings.

Its not outrageous at all. it is called future-forward basic management and pre-planning in a complex market. The hedge fund I work at has tens of billions under management, and if we started to plan mergers and acquisitions only in their targeted closing period (in football terms, the transfer window), we would soon be liquidated and sued into the abyss for financial malpractice. Look at Bayern Munich, they are brilliant, with their year over year targeting and use of pre-contract tie-ups.

You say that to lose those players I listed would cause utter chaos. What do you think we are in now? What do you think last year was? Give me a D I E G......

I am NOT suggesting we sell any of the core of the team. Ex-core perhaps, but many or all I listed are peripheral and even marginal players that we immediately or certainly within 3 to 6 months of season's end (in the case of Bakayoko for instance) knew were not going to work out to any sort of acceptable level. Drinkwater is even more egregious. He never should have been purchased, especially at the ridiculous overpricing we incurred.

Also, IF we had been doing our due diligence for the last 5 years in a timely and professional  manner(clue on professionalism, it IS NOT having Granny take the first month of the window off for a bloody holiday) this buildup of rot would never have taken place.

All those dead-weights I listed could have been methodically pre-shopped, and parcelled out as soon as the window opened for official paperwork, or at least within a couple weeks span. It is not like our legal staff cannot handle multiple contract writing once the prices and terms have been agreed. Any legal firm in The City worth its salt could handle that.

It is also literally insane to expect a 'one in only after one out' policy when you are talking about a multi-billion pound club in a highly fluid and hyper-compressed transfer window environment that the bellends at the FA have shackled all of us with. We are not in the Cock 'N Cow Sunday pub kick about league.

If the firms I have dealt with in my financial career or have come into contact with via case studies in my academic journeys had played their cards like we have (again from the business/fiduciary end especially) they would all be in receivership or administration (something that seems to permeate the football world to an amazing degree already).

We have not even filled the Technical Director position for months upon months since Emenalo left in November! Do you think any publicly traded company would leave its CFO or CEO position utterly vacant for a year??

[DDA 9,941]

1 hour ago, Vesper said:

I agree with this fine gentleman from the lovey part of England known as Kent

 

The Garden of England. 

👌

[ZanSnake 1,211]

39 minutes ago, Vesper said:

Its not outrageous at all. it is called future-forward basic management and pre-planning in a complex market. The hedge fund I work at has tens of billions under management, and if we started to plan mergers and acquisitions only in their targeted closing period (in football terms, the transfer window), we would soon be liquidated and sued into the abyss for financial malpractice. Look at Bayern Munich, they are brilliant, with their year over year targeting and use of pre-contract tie-ups.

You say that to lose those players I listed would cause utter chaos. What do you think we are in now? What do you think last year was? Give me a D I E G......

I am NOT suggesting we sell any of the core of the team. Ex-core perhaps, but many or all I listed are peripheral and even marginal players that we immediately or certainly within 3 to 6 months of season's end (in the case of Bakayoko for instance) knew were not going to work out to any sort of acceptable level. Drinkwater is even more egregious. He never should have been purchased, especially at the ridiculous overpricing we incurred.

Also, IF we had been doing our due diligence for the last 5 years in a timely and professional  manner(clue on professionalism, it IS NOT having Granny take the first month of the window off for a bloody holiday) this buildup of rot would never have taken place.

All those dead-weights I listed could have been methodically pre-shopped, and parcelled out as soon as the window opened for official paperwork, or at least within a couple weeks span. It is not like our legal staff cannot handle multiple contract writing once the prices and terms have been agreed. Any legal firm in The City worth its salt could handle that.

It is also literally insane to expect a 'one in only after one out' policy when you are talking about a multi-billion pound club in a highly fluid and hyper-compressed transfer window environment that the bellends at the FA have shackled all of us with. We are not in the Cock 'N Cow Sunday pub kick about league.

If the firms I have dealt with in my financial career or have come into contact with via case studies in my academic journeys had played their cards like we have (again from the business/fiduciary end especially) they would all be in receivership or administration (something that seems to permeate the football world to an amazing degree already).

We have not even filled the Technical Director position for months upon months since Emenalo left in November! Do you think any publicly traded company would leave its CFO or CEO position utterly vacant for a year??

We are a football club, a results based business. That relies upon certain individual workers to work within a certain structure, if we then rid of those players - some which you named are players that offer/offered big roles within the system - then we have to rely on making business to find suitable replacements.

I am not disagreeing with the implications that the players named should be sold, nor am I going by a venture of one in, one out. Just a large amount of such movement within the current atmosphere at the club wouldn't/couldn't be happening.

We are in a uncertain situation. The manager has not had time with the whole team, heck only had a few sessions before Perth. If there was future-forward planning then that situation would've been resolved. If there was any future-forward planning, the issues regarding Tibo and Hazard would have been resolved - either a sale or announcement of new contact.

The market place has been pushed into levels of extortion and unrealistic levels then it once was. Neymar, Alison, Ronaldo: transfers that have all earmarked a prestige for players to be bracketed against, and that could/is going against us.

If the level of financial backing needed for transfers isn't there from our owner - outside of other financial deals - then we are going to struggle.

The reality is that as a club, we've always been dodgy on handling our transfer windows. Relating then towards panic buys which we earn nothing from long term.

I do agree we need to think long-term, use the successful resources that we - as a business have at our disposals, the youth and academy, use them for integration into the team instead of loan move which can either reduce or inflate their prices. 

CHO is one of many players that have been naned as possible first teamers. If there is no change in relation of the system then there is no progress and it will be the same again.

We can all dream what the right way is, but based upon the history of our actions, we should know the reality. Hence why it would be outrageous - if correct word? - to expect such a change within 11 days!

[Vesper 30,184]

11 minutes ago, ZanSnake said:

We are a football club, a results based business. That relies upon certain individual workers to work within a certain structure, if we then rid of those players - some which you named are players that offer/offered big roles within the system - then we have to rely on making business to find suitable replacements.

I am not disagreeing with the implications that the players named should be sold, nor am I going by a venture of one in, one out. Just a large amount of such movement within the current atmosphere at the club wouldn't/couldn't be happening.

We are in a uncertain situation. The manager has not had time with the whole team, heck only had a few sessions before Perth. If there was future-forward planning then that situation would've been resolved. If there was any future-forward planning, the issues regarding Tibo and Hazard would have been resolved - either a sale or announcement of new contact.

The market place has been pushed into levels of extortion and unrealistic levels then it once was. Neymar, Alison, Ronaldo: transfers that have all earmarked a prestige for players to be bracketed against, and that could/is going against us.

If the level of financial backing needed for transfers isn't there from our owner - outside of other financial deals - then we are going to struggle.

The reality is that as a club, we've always been dodgy on handling our transfer windows. Relating then towards panic buys which we earn nothing from long term.

I do agree we need to think long-term, use the successful resources that we - as a business have at our disposals, the youth and academy, use them for integration into the team instead of loan move which can either reduce or inflate their prices. 

CHO is one of many players that have been naned as possible first teamers. If there is no change in relation of the system then there is no progress and it will be the same again.

We can all dream what the right way is, but based upon the history of our actions, we should know the reality. Hence why it would be outrageous - if correct word? - to expect such a change within 11 days!

I agree with most of what you say-

I so hope you do not think I am saying to sell all those NOW, in the last 11 days.

I just think the whole top of the structure is in bad shape and they do (what appears to me) to be some really shoddy work from a systemic perspective.

Half of me wishes he would sell it Jim Ratcliffe ASAP.

Not my call

[ZanSnake 1,211]

1 minute ago, Vesper said:

I agree with most of what you say-

I so hope you do not think I am saying to sell all those NOW, in the last 11 days.

I just think the whole top of the structure is in bad shape and they do (what appears to me) to be some really shoddy work from a systemic perspective.

Half of me wishes he would sell it Jim Ratcliffe ASAP.

Not my call

I don't expect all in the 11 days, and would be good to gradually get rid of a few in the next few windows.

But it is hard to see any leave without someone coming in. 

We really need some kind of shuffle. We could have used our failure for top 4 as the perfect chance to adapt and change, but doesn't look like that'll happen. Get a DoF with close links to the club, and we might be set. TBF also thought Ballack would be good in that role. Highly respected, knowledgeable about the game and is a Chelsea legend.

[Vesper 30,184]

4 minutes ago, ZanSnake said:

I don't expect all in the 11 days, and would be good to gradually get rid of a few in the next few windows.

But it is hard to see any leave without someone coming in. 

We really need some kind of shuffle. We could have used our failure for top 4 as the perfect chance to adapt and change, but doesn't look like that'll happen. Get a DoF with close links to the club, and we might be set. TBF also thought Ballack would be good in that role. Highly respected, knowledgeable about the game and is a Chelsea legend.

 

FTW

[Unionjack 7,531]

Callum Hudson-Odoi issues response to Maurizio Sarri warning

https://metro.co.uk/2018/07/29/callum-hudson-odoi-issues-response-maurizio-sarri-warning-7774596/

[Unionjack 7,531]

5 hours ago, Vesper said:

I agree with this fine gentleman from the lovey part of England known as Kent

 

Well hey hey diddle dum day!

[ZanSnake 1,211]

21 minutes ago, Unionjack said:

Callum Hudson-Odoi issues response to Maurizio Sarri warning

https://metro.co.uk/2018/07/29/callum-hudson-odoi-issues-response-maurizio-sarri-warning-7774596/

Brilliant response.

Sarri can use this well, to improve our youths mindset to being given chnacea and no demoralised from the first team by their manager like a certain club in the North.