Jase

Mourinho was definitely right about our poor defensive organization and lack of coherent pressing (I seriously hope Lampard sorts this out soon, because this issue has been apparent since pre-season) but he was definitely talking BS about Lampard playing youth in the match. I mean, it's so on the brand of Mourinho to talk down youth players and not criticize experience. We had only 3 players who you would consider young or inexperience at Premier League level in the game - Mount, Abraham and Pulisic. There were still 8-9 experienced players out there, who given all their experience let the team down more by not leading the team and making stupid mistakes defensively. Would putting out an XI with all experienced players have made the difference? We have suffered bad, heavy losses with an experienced lineup - Bournemouth and Man City away last season are prime examples. It's not as if Lampard had 8 youth players out there and only 3 experienced fellas! The defeat came down to more on bad mistakes, from the experienced players no less, than Lampard playing the young players. It's so easy to criticize someone for playing the youth when results go wrong. Only have to look at what Klopp and Pochettino have done. They played them (e.g. Dele Alli, Trent Alexander Arnold) through thick and thin and are reaping the rewards right now.

At least we have gotten one big away fixture out of the way... Between now and early November, we will face only one of the big sides in the league - Liverpool in September. So, one would hope that we will pick up wins during that period.

Being established doesn't mean being better. On paper, yes but let's not forget that Mourinho hasn't been able to set his teams properly in big games for years now and if you remember with Conte, he set us up to lose only 1-0 at Man City last year and set us not to even bothered tackle them at all. The team's structure is definitely not solid yet but it's kinda hard to say for certain that we should have been more pragmatic today. If it was City, Liverpool or Spurs, then I would definitely say we need to be pragmatic but this isn't a great United side. Took the game to them and created a number of chances, had Abraham gotten at the end of that Azpi cross, had we not hit the woodwork in the first half, the game could have been completely different. The individual mistakes made matters worse and United's 2nd and 4th goals probably shouldn't have been counted as well - the former for a foul and the latter was a head injury treatment on Zouma (two United players were apparently trying to stop play).

Think Zouma will do well in a defensive system, just not in an attacking one.

My point is both Barkley and Mount had been used as the No.10 in pre-season and both did well. I wasn't surprised to see Lampard picked Mount given they have worked together last season, in the Championship or not. He started with both and they operated like wingers instead of No.10, which certainly doesn't get the best out of them, certainly not Barkley. Lampard's team selection was fine today, IMO. I mean it only had 2 players you would consider young or inexperience at this level - Mount and Abraham (plus Pulisic after he came on) and there were 9 other experienced players out there. It was hardly inexperience. If anything, you might argue Lampard's approach play was a tad too aggressive and not being a little pragmatic, if you like and that the senior players let the team down with poor mistakes/decisions.

Regarding Barkley, it feels like Lampard shoehorned him into the XI because of his pre-season form. Ended up playing wide left, which isn't his best position. Could have just gone with Pulisic-Mount-Pedro from the start.

I don't think you'll find a Chelsea fan who will disagree with you on that but not sure what the constant complaining is gonna achieve...

This is classic Mourinho... https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11661/11782848/jose-mourinho-hails-rock-harry-maguire-after-man-united-win

FUCKING WHINERS!

In a normal circumstance, I'd say "BRING ON THE SUPER CUP!". But after today's result, this feels like an unnecessary distraction and Liverpool are not ideal opponents to be playing next.

Liverpool 2-2 Chelsea PRE/POST-MATCH DISCUSSION, LIVE CHAT AND ANALYSIS 2019 UEFA Super Cup 14th August, Wednesday, 2019 Vodafone Park 20:00 Kick Off (UK time)

Some people are so on the brand here, only popping up when we suffer shit results. Can't wait for two more in particular to show up...

@Atomiswave @Vesper How many times are we going to see you two moan about the poor transfers made, board's bad decisions, transfer ban etc? Like Lampard alluded to, it is what it is. Can only work with what we have and no point focusing on what can't be changed.

Like I said in the match thread, Azpi needs to be given competition or at the very least, rotated with someone (aka James). He has played so many games over the past few years that it might well have contributed to his drop in performance level.

Like others, I want to say that there are some positives to take from this match but we gotta make them count by picking up results in the coming games. If we don't, then hell is gonna break loose.

Had a number of good opportunities but didn't take them. Was the better side. Hit the woodwork twice. Committed defensive disasters (thanks a lot Zouma, Azpi). Two fouls in two of their goals (one a potential head injury). Deflection in their fourth. Ended up with a 4-0 loss. Not sure what to make of today's game at all. Almost as flabbergasted as some of the horror shows from last season.

We basically got OUT-Arsenal-ED.