MUTU

Look, I'm done here. I was fine taking all the shit that's been thrown at me during my stay here, just because I support a different club than yours, because I could handle it. But being accused of the one being condescending and taking shots at Vesper, really? In my country, you say the things she said in public (including on a forum) gets you arrested and taken to court. And yes, I live in the EU. And no, I'm not kidding. But I'm the one taking the shots and being condescending. Right. Perhaps @Sideshow Luiz should rename himself to DoubleStandards Luiz.

A serious one. It's a thin line between success and failure at such a precarious age. Look at Renato Sanches, he was playing regularly and performing well as an 18 year old for Benfica, and impressing in the Champions League and EURO 2016, but some matches on the bench for Bayern later and he flopped at Swansea. The 2016 Golden Boy Award winner. At Swansea.

The basic figures are at the best of my knowledge and from the sources I could find. I understand what you mean about inflation, but when people talk about some transfer record being broken, they just use the total amount without inflation. Bayern are bidding to take the played in January. If they fail, and come back to get him in summer instead, I bet you that the bid will be lower than the one they're making for January. As I said, when you talk about records, the tendency is to ignore inflation. Wow, showing your true colours are you? You are wishing incredibly bad things to several people and entities just because your board would have sold Hazard without getting an adequate replacement. Like that would be Bayern's or CHO's fault. Really, shame on you, your post is filthy and disgusting, and I won't discuss further things with you. These are the kind of posts that would get you banned on my forum, and we are a veeeery lenient forum. I really hope they're not tolerated here either.

Is this a trick question or a serious one? Let me assume it's the latter... players develop fastest around the age of 18, when playing time is an absolute necessity. CHO not being played at all until Summer could be the difference between him becoming a top player and a total flop. In fact, if he's not played at all until summer I wouldn't even want him for £5m. It's make-or-break time for him, and he wants to have a great career. Is Chelsea ready to allow him to become a top player or not? How many of your top 20 players of all time can you name who were not playing regular football at the age of 18?

I disagree because I'm seeing a 3rd scenario which would be: CHO: "I want to sign a contract with Bayern and leave ASAP!" Chelsea: "We'll let you sign a contract for Bayern IF AND ONLY IF you come back on loan until the end of the season. Otherwise, no deal!" CHO: "Hmm... I REALLY want to play for Bayern, but I'm still worried that I'm not going to be played enough. The sooner I leave the better, because I don't trust you to play me, so I'll have to sit out till summer, I guess" Chelsea: "We are going to play you, promise! We want you to stay because we really need you!" Bayern: "We need him too, but we really want him and if summer is the only way we can take him, we'll just have to wait. But we also don't trust you will play him, so prove it. If you don't play him, you pay a compensation fee." Chelsea: "OK, deal!"

Awesome list! However I was talking about £35m at the time of sale, not including 19 year olds, and not including inflation. For example, Cassano was £25.65m, and he was 19. Anderson was around £20m, and he was 19. Marquinhos was around £28m, and he was 19. And so forth. Out of the list, the <=18 year olds are: - Rooney (£25.6m) - Renato Sanches (£31.50m) - Luke Shaw (£30m) - Vinicius Junior (£54.90m) - Kylian Mbappe (£121.50m) - Rodrygo (£40.50m) This means that Chelsea refused the 4th highest figure for a player aged 18 or under.

The answer to your question is easy. Imagine a hypothetical scenario (which I find quite possible) where the only way Chelsea would accept a winter sale would be if CHO is loaned back... and if that is the only way he's going to move to Bayern, then the three parties may agree, but two (Bayern and CHO) would need assurances that Chelsea would indeed be playing CHO. That's where the non-playing clause comes in.

I was imagining a Pulisic-style buy-and-loan-back (you keeping him since you're claiming you need him), but if you claim you need him and don't play him... well, then it'd be fair that you'd pay up for stalling a Bayern player's career. Like, wouldn't you be pissed off if Pulisic was always in the stands till the end of the season?

... a lot of BS faith in his ability, IMO. When you have Coman and Gnabry not starting because Ribery and Robben kick up a fuss whenever they're benched or subbed out and the coach is almost scared of benching them... and also with the MULTIPLE daily dose hype from staff or players about new signing Alphonso Davies, he'd be lucky if he's even 5th choice for Bayern this season. Next season he'd be in a better situation. That said, Bayern's wingers are far more injury prone, so a 5th choice winger for Bayern is probably equal to a 3rd choice winger for Chelsea

Give the full context to that though mate... It was related to Bayern buying CHO in winter and loaning him back to Chelsea until the end of the season (like what you did with Pulisic), and Chelsea would have to pay Bayern (not CHO) for not playing the player... only fair because by not playing the guy he's not going to reach his potential and Bayern would end up suffering in the end. The non-playing fee gives a form of compensation to the owning club (which would be Bayern in this case) and allows the player (CHO) to have more trust in that he's going to be played.

Haha, think better than gold I don't know particularly about Max Bielefeld, but in general Sky Deutschland are highly reliable and don't have a reputation of just making stuff up. In general, the German press is far, far more reliable than the English one anyway... even tabloids like BILD are considered reliable.

I understand why you must feel lost, because I feel lost about it. Either I really expressed myself poorly or I don't know, but I never suggested that. At least definitely not intentionally.

A top reporter for Sky Deutschland In metal terms, that'd be somewhere between platinum and rhodium. But he's discussing topics that are usually leaked more from the owning club's side, i.e. I would expect something like this to be leaked to the English press first.

Hey that happens on BayernForum as well, no need to apologise for it, it's standard human behaviour. Same argument holds on statistics They're only good when they sustain our argument.

You're misunderstanding me. You're looking so hard for signs of me trolling that you may easily misinterpret me. I get it, I'm a Bayern fan on a Chelsea forum, so I understand I may not be the most popular guy around here. But hear me out. I'm not saying these to show arrogance or claim that you should accept our bids just because we're Bayern. On the contrary, I'm trying to tell you that what you guys have managed to pull off, rejecting 4 consecutive Bayern bids... that's something that has never happened, at least not public and not that I'm aware of. I didn't make my post clear enough: it's praise for what you've managed to so far, and even if we do get our man (which I still think is happening and which I still don't approve of personally) it still reflects well on your board, simply because this doesn't usually happen.

Or maybe we're all living inside the Matrix and this world is not real... ... at some point you need to draw a line. I've drawn mine, and I'm totally convinced CHO wants to join Bayern. You aren't, and I accept your view. Plus, this might come out as downright arrogant, and I assure you it really isn't my intention, but Bayern have NEVER wanted a player so much, had a transfer saga go on for so long and with such intensity, bid so many times for a player and not gotten him at the end. Never. I'd be REALLY surprised by Chelsea's hardness/stubbornness if CHO is not a Bayern player by 1st September 2019 at the latest. Lately we have had many transfers happening where we'd only learn about them a few hours before they're made official. When Bayern want their man, they either get their man or they're outbid. This CHO case here... it just doesn't ever happen with our club. We're all quite surprised really.

Because if *I* like a Chelsea post, it's one thing. If Messi likes a Chelsea post, it's another thing. But if someone you're really trying hard to buy, publicly talking about the interest, and he's returning the favour by liking your posts... that is another thing altogether. He didn't just stumble on the posts and liked randomly. He's sending a message there. He's showing in no uncertain terms that he does want to join Bayern. He's just stopped short of blurting it out loud in some interview.

How many of these players have you made 4 separate transfer bids for, though?

And by watching him 'like' multiple Hummels posts or the announcement of Bayern signing Pavard (by the way, cost less than what we bid for CHO) on his official, verified, personal Instagram account.

If by "us" you mean CHO, who's the only one who seems to have gained something, then yes. However, I'm pretty sure that CHO is wondering that if the window closes before he has a chance to move to Bayern, would he be getting the playing time he was getting before Bayern's interest or after Bayern's interest? At least, if I was CHO, that'd be what would keep me awake at night. The difference is quite notable, I'm sure you'll agree.

If you want to talk facts, tell me how many Premier League minutes CHO played in before Bayern knocked on Chelsea's door.

Refer to all newspaper reports. You can choose to not believe them, sure, however it seems pretty clear he wants to move because he doesn't feel he'll get enough playing time at Chelsea as opposed to Bayern.

Because your staff already convinced him that it won't work with you guys.

We're not trying to sign them because we don't want to weaken the opposition Really, the reason is that we're rebuilding and want to build for the future not for now. We want to build wings that are set for over a decade.