Roy didn't really want Cole

[Madmax 9,219]

When asked if he would have pursued Cole if he had arrived at Anfield earlier, Hodgson replied: "It's a difficult one for me to answer. I was involved in the discussion with him, but the initiative and the desire to take Joe did come from Christian perhaps more so than myself because I wasn't in the position to say these are the players we should be targeting as I hadn't been offered the job at that point.

"I played my part in persuading him it was a good move, but I made it clear I couldn't promise him a certain position. I made it very clear Steven Gerrard was staying, and the competition for the one spot, if it was the one spot he wanted, was going to be very tough.

"He's not so much a player I can really take responsibility for. I'd have to share the responsibility for Joe, less so than for people like [Christian] Poulsen, [Raul] Meireles and [Paul] Konchesky, who are players I was quite happy to bring to the club."

Cole has endured a tough first six months to his Liverpool career, earning a red card on his league debut, and he is yet to open his domestic account for the Reds. For a player that has never been blessed with pace or a quality left foot, there are suggestions that Hodgson is playing Cole out of position on the left wing, but the Liverpool manager insists the problem is with the player himself.

"I think he has got to do it on the field of play," Hodgson said in The Times. "With all the best will in the world, people can be in support or not in support, some will say he's not doing it, and some will say he's unlucky because he's not playing in the right position.

"But I don't have any truck with that. Joe is a midfield player, and what's the right position for a midfield player? Gerrard has played all over midfield for as long as I can remember.

"You'll have to ask him what isn't working. If he says the only place he can play is behind the striker, he is limiting his chances of playing here. We also have Gerrard and Meireles who can play in that position, and we also have a situation where at the moment quite often we are playing with two strikers.

"I would be sad to hear him saying something like that, because he would be suggesting he can't do what he has done so often in the past for England and Chelsea, which is playing in a different position.

"Joe has to come to terms with the fact that he has come here after an unsuccessful period at Chelsea with high hopes of taking Liverpool by storm and unfortunately it's not happened. That's life. He should have great confidence in his ability as he is a very good footballer. As far as I am concerned, everything he has to say should be said on that patch of green grass.

"He should be convincing me and everyone watching that this is a player who can help Liverpool win things. And I think you couldn't say that has been the case so far."

soccernet

[LDN Blue 7,903]

LOL I think it's a bit harsh to say Roy didn't want him. I think anyone at the time (us included) would have loved Joe to be part of their team, when he's on form he's truly magnificent, he's got pace, control and a decent finish (for example, vs Sweden).

I do feel slightly sorry for him. He left to seek more first team football, and with the way things are going it seems he's not going to get it at Liverpool. I really don't mind if we try and get a loan deal for him to bring him back, Liverpool do have a habit for buying players and selling them back to their original clubs (just ask Robbie Keane LMAO)

"Joe has to come to terms with the fact that he has come here after an unsuccessful period at Chelsea"

Oh Roy.. You truly are deluded. Joe had his peak at Chelsea, if anyone's to blame for his "unsuccessful period" now, it's Liverpool

[Madmax 9,219]

LOL I think it's a bit harsh to say Roy didn't want him. That's what he said - he takes less responsibility for signing Joe than he does for the likes of Meireles. Mind he could mean that they got Cole before Roy was appointed, in which case, fair dos.

I think anyone at the time (us included) would have loved Joe to be part of their team Well I didn't.

when he's on form he's truly magnificent, he's got pace, control and a decent finish (for example, vs Sweden). One swallow doesn't make a summer ... it's true he is silky at times, but we can't afford to wait 15 games for him to have one great spell of 30 mins. People flay Kalou for his consistency, then why not Cole? Just because he is English?

I do feel slightly sorry for him. He left to seek more first team football, and with the way things are going it seems he's not going to get it at Liverpool. I don't feel an ounce of sympathy for him, he's getting what he asked for. IMO Joe thinks overrates himself. Demonstrated that by asking for a six figure sum here. He left for the money, not football.

I really don't mind if we try and get a loan deal for him to bring him back, Liverpool do have a habit for buying players and selling them back to their original clubs (just ask Robbie Keane LMAO) Oh no please, keep him away

[LDN Blue 7,903]

Well I think you have to be a bit fair on him. In Jan 09 he'd suffered a very serious cruciate ligament damage in his knee, he didn't really make an appearance after that until November-ish and by then it was very hard for him to break through as it was. He was hardly ever given a start and when he did appear it was off the bench with a mere 10-15minutes to go. 2008 was his best year (in my opinion) for Chelsea. He'd been fantastic all season, he'd played and performed better than even Lampard. But he did have to miss the whole season after because of a knee injury. I always said, he deserved more chances than he got, but Carlo was unwilling, what else was he to do?

I don't feel an ounce of sympathy for him, he's getting what he asked for. IMO Joe thinks overrates himself. Demonstrated that by asking for a six figure sum here. He left for the money, not football.

Well how do you know that? From what I've read he left for more game time, which I actually understand. Nobody wants to be a bench warmer, especially someone who's as good as Joe Cole. Yes going to Liverpool wasn't the best move but to say he left for money is absurd, especially when (at the time) Liverpool were in as much debt as they were. He left to play more games, it's the reason he didn't sign a new contract.

[Madmax 9,219]

Well I think you have to be a bit fair on him. In Jan 09 he'd suffered a very serious cruciate ligament damage in his knee, he didn't really make an appearance after that until November-ish and by then it was very hard for him to break through as it was. He was hardly ever given a start and when he did appear it was off the bench with a mere 10-15minutes to go. 2008 was his best year (in my opinion) for Chelsea. He'd been fantastic all season, he'd played and performed better than even Lampard. But he did have to miss the whole season after because of a knee injury. I always said, he deserved more chances than he got, but Carlo was unwilling, what else was he to do?

Agreed he didn't get many chances, but you also have to wonder why. I don't believe Carlo had anything against him, thus it boiling down to the point that he didn't see anything in Joe which convinced him of his supposed reserves of brilliance. Didn't he say something afterwards about Joe lacking in intelligence on the pitch? You can be the best dribbler in the world, and you can do stepovers for fun in training, but it means horseshit if you don't know whom to pass to out there on the pitch.

Well how do you know that? From what I've read he left for more game time, which I actually understand. Nobody wants to be a bench warmer, especially someone who's as good as Joe Cole. Yes going to Liverpool wasn't the best move but to say he left for money is absurd, especially when (at the time) Liverpool were in as much debt as they were. He left to play more games, it's the reason he didn't sign a new contract.

He allegedly turned down contract offers from Man United, Arsenal and Tottenham in the summer, yet chose Liverpool. Why? To play in the Europa League? He gets a 100k a week at Liverpool, something everybody understands he isn't worth. Look at his performances now to know why. Carlo kept saying the whole of last season that Cole will sign a new contract and that everybody wants him to stay. JT and Lampard said the same, but he didn't. Because under the cost cutting measures Roman refused to cave in to his demands of a higher wage than what he was on at that time.

[LDN Blue 7,903]

He allegedly turned down contract offers from Man United, Arsenal and Tottenham in the summer, yet chose Liverpool. Why? To play in the Europa League? He gets a 100k a week at Liverpool, something everybody understands he isn't worth. Look at his performances now to know why. Carlo kept saying the whole of last season that Cole will sign a new contract and that everybody wants him to stay. JT and Lampard said the same, but he didn't. Because under the cost cutting measures Roman refused to cave in to his demands of a higher wage than what he was on at that time.

Actually, ManUtd said they were not interested. Fergie said so himself. As for Tottenham, Arsenal and Liverpool, they each offered the same wage. It's obvious why he turned down Arsenal and Tottenham, they all have great players, much like we do. Liverpool were a club who were in trouble, they were looking for any players who could offer them a way out and Joe was the man, he was guaranteed first team football there. Most would make the same choice really. Just look at Michael Owen, he went to ManUtd but does he play? (when fit?) nope. Aston Villa were willing to take him, even Liverpool but he went on record to say he'd rather sit on United's bench. Disgraceful really.

And in regards to Carlo's opinion, well.. Ask Ballack what he thinks about Carlo's influence on contract discussions.

On your point of his intelligence, I strongly urge you watch Joe's performances in a Chelsea shirt prior to his knee injuries, you'll see a player who showed great intelligence on the pitch.. His awareness to pick out a pass was something we enjoyed. And let's be honest, is José Mourinho (one of the best managers in the world right now & a great admirer of Cole) going to endorse a player who's not intelligent?

I personally was heart broken when Joe left. He's a legend in this club, much like Wilkins who left us for ManUtd as a player. When he comes back to Stamford Bridge with Liverpool he deserves nothing but a standing ovation for his part in our first ever Premier League title in 2005 & again in 2006.

[Madmax 9,219]

Actually, ManUtd said they were not interested. Fergie said so himself. As for Tottenham, Arsenal and Liverpool, they each offered the same wage. It's obvious why he turned down Arsenal and Tottenham, they all have great players, much like we do. Liverpool were a club who were in trouble, they were looking for any players who could offer them a way out and Joe was the man, he was guaranteed first team football there. I do recall Ferguson saying he'd love Cole to be at United, though I wouldn't be able to find you quotes. Word at the time was Arsenal offered him something in the region of 60k, Tottenham were a bit more generous but none could match Pool's 100l offer. Logical choice? You bet.

And in regards to Carlo's opinion, well.. Ask Ballack what he thinks about Carlo's influence on contract discussions. Well nothing Carlo can do when the player in question decides to run down his contract. He wanted to keep both, but it seems to me he's more saddened by Ballack's departure.

On your point of his intelligence, I strongly urge you watch Joe's performances in a Chelsea shirt prior to his knee injuries, you'll see a player who showed great intelligence on the pitch.. His awareness to pick out a pass was something we enjoyed. And let's be honest, is José Mourinho (one of the best managers in the world right now & a great admirer of Cole) going to endorse a player who's not intelligent? Why I have watched him for a long time, including the seasons you mentioned. He was better then, I agree, but what you do in the last match is what counts, not what you did 4 years back. And for me, I'd rather believe Carlo when he says that in his opinion a particular player doesn't really have a lot of intelligence on the pitch.

IMO Cole right now is no better than Kalou, yet I expect not many to agree, homegrown players and fan favourites are usually favoured by the majority, regardless of actual performance.

[LDN Blue 7,903]

Can't agree/disagree about the payment and all that since it was never made public, just rumoured. It is true his wage demand was rather high but the point is still the same, for his career a move to Liverpool was better than Arsenal and Tottenham because it was easier to get game time at Liverpool. Right now that club is in a position where it can only go up (hopefully), it's a perfect time for Joey to show his real potential on the pitch.

He's more saddened? Perhaps. But only because he played Ballack more than he did Cole. But the fact Carlo wanted to keep Joe at Chelsea shows he IS a great player, I don't believe his over rated, I just think he's hit by bad luck (with his injuries). In the period he was injured, a lot changed, players established themselves and Cole simply could not breakthrough.

Carlo's comment about Joe being less intelligent than Yossi (in my honest opinion) was a charade. I think he only said that to justify his awful transfer of Benayoun. Joe Cole or Yossi Benayoun? You don't even have to be English to know that Joe is much better than Yossi.

You keep referring to the fact people only rate Cole because he's English and homegrown. That though hasn't crossed my mind at all. You can't say Cole is on level with Kalou because he hasn't been given enough time to show his real potential (which we've seen). The key words you've used is "right now".. People are slated for saying Ramires isn't that great and in reply we say "give him time" "let him adapt". Why can't we do the same for Joe. I keep coming back to his knee injury because it's important! He was given the amount of time, say, Sturridge gets given today. Barely any. It's still too early to judge him at Liverpool because he's yet to settle with red cards and injuries hampering his time to settle. I say the same about Ramires, let's give him time to settle in and show us how good he is JUST like Cole. Nothing to do with nationality, just being fair.

[Kostas 1,468]

Actually, ManUtd said they were not interested. Fergie said so himself. As for Tottenham, Arsenal and Liverpool, they each offered the same wage. It's obvious why he turned down Arsenal and Tottenham, they all have great players, much like we do. Liverpool were a club who were in trouble, they were looking for any players who could offer them a way out and Joe was the man, he was guaranteed first team football there. Most would make the same choice really. Just look at Michael Owen, he went to ManUtd but does he play? (when fit?) nope. Aston Villa were willing to take him, even Liverpool but he went on record to say he'd rather sit on United's bench. Disgraceful really.

And in regards to Carlo's opinion, well.. Ask Ballack what he thinks about Carlo's influence on contract discussions.

On your point of his intelligence, I strongly urge you watch Joe's performances in a Chelsea shirt prior to his knee injuries, you'll see a player who showed great intelligence on the pitch.. His awareness to pick out a pass was something we enjoyed. And let's be honest, is José Mourinho (one of the best managers in the world right now & a great admirer of Cole) going to endorse a player who's not intelligent?

I personally was heart broken when Joe left. He's a legend in this club, much like Wilkins who left us for ManUtd as a player. When he comes back to Stamford Bridge with Liverpool he deserves nothing but a standing ovation for his part in our first ever Premier League title in 2005 & again in 2006.

Most of these arguments were tackled here when he joined Liverpool. I tried to defend his choice back then but there's really no defending him now that he failed to become a regular starter in bloody Liverpool.

Off the top of my head I remember that Tottenham and Arsenal weren't able to match Livepools offer and Mourinho has criticized Cole for being tactical naive.

As for him not getting his chances, one can see that there's something wrong when you fail to espablish yourself under numerous top class coaches (Ranieri, Mourinho, Grant, Scolari, Hiddink, Ancelotti, Capello, Hodgson)

There's nothing wrong with trying to resurrect your career but Joey crossed the line from his first Liverpool interviews, to me he's nothing more than an overhyped English football player who could dribble, there are many ex-Chelsea players who deserve applause much more than he does.

[Madmax 9,219]

Can't agree/disagree about the payment and all that since it was never made public, just rumoured. It is true his wage demand was rather high but the point is still the same, for his career a move to Liverpool was better than Arsenal and Tottenham because it was easier to get game time at Liverpool. Right now that club is in a position where it can only go up (hopefully), it's a perfect time for Joey to show his real potential on the pitch.

Sigh. Agree to disagree.

He's more saddened? Perhaps. But only because he played Ballack more than he did Cole. But the fact Carlo wanted to keep Joe at Chelsea shows he IS a great player, I don't believe his over rated, I just think he's hit by bad luck (with his injuries). In the period he was injured, a lot changed, players established themselves and Cole simply could not breakthrough.

Disagree. You don't have to be a 'great' player to be in the team. You've got to be a hard worker, have a good attitude and know how to use your limited attributes. Is Kalou a great player? No. Does he try and try even though he's practically shit technically? Yes. Hence he's in the team. Not ''I'll do a cute stepover, then lose the ball and not bother tracking back" Cole. You yourself admit Cole couldn't breakthrough. Yes he was hampered by injuries, but to put all of his decline down to that injury is being too soft on him. He was fully fit by this time last year. If he still can't get picked ahead of Kalou who's slagged off mercilessly by everyone, that just says it all.

Carlo's comment about Joe being less intelligent than Yossi (in my honest opinion) was a charade. I think he only said that to justify his awful transfer of Benayoun. Joe Cole or Yossi Benayoun? You don't even have to be English to know that Joe is much better than Yossi.

How is the Yossi transfer 'awful'? Joe Cole was better than Yossi, his last two seasons have showed him up to be average. And Yossi's mightily under-rated, whether by fans or the media. English or otherwise.

You keep referring to the fact people only rate Cole because he's English and homegrown. That though hasn't crossed my mind at all. You can't say Cole is on level with Kalou because he hasn't been given enough time to show his real potential (which we've seen). The key words you've used is "right now".. People are slated for saying Ramires isn't that great and in reply we say "give him time" "let him adapt". Why can't we do the same for Joe. I keep coming back to his knee injury because it's important! He was given the amount of time, say, Sturridge gets given today. Barely any. It's still too early to judge him at Liverpool because he's yet to settle with red cards and injuries hampering his time to settle. I say the same about Ramires, let's give him time to settle in and show us how good he is JUST like Cole. Nothing to do with nationality, just being fair.

How much time does Joe Cole need? He can't be compared to Ramires at all. Cole has played in England all his life, 9 of those years in the top flight, 7 of them with 1 team. Ramires has changed countries twice in two years!

[LDN Blue 7,903]

Most of these arguments were tackled here when he joined Liverpool. I tried to defend his choice but there's really no defending him now that he failed to become a regular starter in bloody Liverpool.

Off the top of my I remember that Tottenham and Arsenal weren't able to match Livepools offer and Mourinho has criticized Cole for being tactical naive.

As for him not getting his chances, one can see that there's something wrong when you fail to espablish yourself under numerous top class coaches (Ranieri, Mourinho, Grant, Scolari, Hiddink, Ancelotti, Capello, Hodgson)

He's only failed to become a regular starter because he's just come back from an injury (so I believe?)

As for the managers, I seem to remember Ranieri, Mourinho and Grant love to play him. Not sure about Scolari and Hiddink, but I think he was injured during their tenures (which were brief so.. ). Though it is worrying he didn't make an impression on Capello (despite calls from Gerrard and Terry to get him game time)

[Kostas 1,468]

As for the managers, I seem to remember Ranieri, Mourinho and Grant love to play him.

03/04 Games started for Chelsea - 25

04/05 Games started for Chelsea - 34

05/06 Games started for Chelsea - 34

06/07 Games started for Chelsea - 14

Can't really blame you because my memory failed me too on Cole's career.

[LDN Blue 7,903]

How much time does Joe Cole need? He can't be compared to Ramires at all. Cole has played in England all his life, 9 of those years in the top flight, 7 of them with 1 team. Ramires has changed countries twice in two years!

Agreed on that then

LOL am I the only one who still believes Joe Cole is not as bad as people make him out to be. The line about him not being a hard worker is beyond me, he gave it everything last season when he got his chances, he got a vital goal against United, he got some assists too. Never stopped running. The comparison of Joe Cole to Kalou is ridiculous, Joe Cole's proved he's technically better, he's faster, his passes are better placed. You're right though, he's failed to demonstrate this in the last 2 season, I really hope 2011 marks a new time for him. I guarantee you, if he has an injury free year we'll see that touch and flare we once cheered through at Stamford Bridge.

The last 2 season? He hasn't actually had a full season to establish himself. So okay, I will strike that comment then, but on form.. Between Bena and Joe, Cole wins hands down. We won't really know that for a while now with Yossi out till April.

Yes 9 years in top flight football, 7 or 8 of those were fantastic. You've said so yourself, those years (especially 07/08) were his best.. I think there's much more to him than what we've witnessed in the last 2 seasons. Like I said, I hope by 2011 he'll re capture that form.

[LDN Blue 7,903]

03/04 Games started for Chelsea - 25

04/05 Games started for Chelsea - 34

05/06 Games started for Chelsea - 34

06/07 Games started for Chelsea - 14

Can't really blame you because my memory failed me too on Cole's career.

Surely those can't be right? According to wikipedia, in all competitions:

03/04 - 50

04/05 - 46

05/06 - 46

06/07 - 24

07/08 - 54

08/09 - 19

09/10 - 39 (< though most of those were late substitute appearances)

[zolayes 14,489]

Most of these arguments were tackled here when he joined Liverpool. I tried to defend his choice back then but there's really no defending him now that he failed to become a regular starter in bloody Liverpool.

Off the top of my head I remember that Tottenham and Arsenal weren't able to match Livepools offer and Mourinho has criticized Cole for being tactical naive.

As for him not getting his chances, one can see that there's something wrong when you fail to espablish yourself under numerous top class coaches (Ranieri, Mourinho, Grant, Scolari, Hiddink, Ancelotti, Capello, Hodgson)

There's nothing wrong with trying to resurrect your career but Joey crossed the line from his first Liverpool interviews, to me he's nothing more than an overhyped English football player who could dribble, there are many ex-Chelsea players who deserve applause much more than he does.

agree.

I lost patience with Joe when he turned down a new contract,,In the last few years did little of note ..oh yes the winner against Manure ,,but delivered far too infrequently..

the love in with Scumpool fans hasnt helped with his image either

[eldo 868]

LDN Joe is not the player you think he is.

[Badboy 1,526]

Joe cole has flattered to deceive all throught his career.

[LDN Blue 7,903]

LDN Joe is not the player you think he is.

I, personally, believe Chelsea fans are just bitter he chose to leave

But I do understand this view :chelsea2: