Chelsea 1-1 Crystal Palace

[robsblubot 3,508]

2 hours ago, Fulham Broadway said:

Just got back.

Having caicedo and Enzo on the pitch together doesn't work.
Enzo made one decent pass all match other than that terrible. 

Still no leader(s) -another mid table finish looms

Disagree. For me it was team problem, rather than a player problem. The team is still too spaced out and that can and will be exploited by the opposition.

You could see that clearly in the second half: Caicedo and Enzo were outnumbered often as there was always a 3rd open man to receive a pass. You simply cannot defend in that situation as the game "piggy in the middle" proves.

It's easy to point fingers to individuals as many did not have outstanding games, which is also an indication it was a teamwork issue.

Many of us warned that a start from scratch would have a cost no matter the players. The good teams who have been playing together for years are flying high, which is not really surprising.

[Thor 2,392]

Hilarious to see people blaming Jackson after the game. The only one that looked threatening. 
 

And of course the lazy excuse of “that guy scores that chance”. 
 

Sure they do bud. 

[Reddish-Blue 2,347]

1 hour ago, robsblubot said:

The good teams who have been playing together for years are flying high, which is not really surprising.

Brighton have new players, new coach and they don't look like they have that many 'teamwork' issues.   Even Liverpool went away from the Klopp methods and they still look good under Slot. 

1 hour ago, robsblubot said:

It's easy to point fingers to individuals as many did not have outstanding games, which is also an indication it was a teamwork issue

The main thing is, you're playing at home to a plucky team, you get 7 shots on target and you can't score the 2nd goal that would have broken the game open. 

Palace will be just like Forest, Fulham and so many other sides that will come to the Bridge looking for that 1 goal as they know that may be enough to walk away with a point.  

As they say, there's no point having more possession if you're not going to do anything with it.  

Edited September 1 by Reddish-Blue
more info

[Vegetable 830]

1 hour ago, robsblubot said:

Many of us warned that a start from scratch would have a cost no matter the players. The good teams who have been playing together for years are flying high, which is not really surprising.

Came here to say that this reasoning must finally stop. Core of this team, apart all the time in the world in the pre-season, had at least like 15+ top-flight games together + all the training. National teams are often bunch of fellas who see each other thrice a year and have like max 4 training units to integrate 3-5 new players. And they somehow manage to do it. Meanwhile we will be repeating that the players need to learn to play together until they will all get grey hair I guess. Experience of playing together gives the 10% extra edge, but the 90% foundation is executing the tactic and basic football knowledge. This is season 3 (?) of fresh start, folks will always come and go as they do in most of football teams.

I'm getting more and more convinced that godlike ballon d'or saviors Enzo and Caicedo are about as much use as Werner (credit due, he at least put the shift in) and Havertz were, only way more expensive. 

[robsblubot 3,508]

 

1 hour ago, Reddish-Blue said:

Brighton have new players, new coach and they don't look like they have that many 'teamwork' issues.   Even Liverpool went away from the Klopp methods and they still look good under Slot. 

The main thing is, you're playing at home to a plucky team, you get 7 shots on target and you can't score the 2nd goal that would have broken the game open. 

Palace will be just like Forest, Fulham and so many other sides that will come to the Bridge looking for that 1 goal as they know that may be enough to walk away with a point.  

As they say, there's no point having more possession if you're not going to do anything with it.  

 

1 hour ago, Vegetable said:

Came here to say that this reasoning must finally stop. Core of this team, apart all the time in the world in the pre-season, had at least like 15+ top-flight games together + all the training. National teams are often bunch of fellas who see each other thrice a year and have like max 4 training units to integrate 3-5 new players. And they somehow manage to do it. Meanwhile we will be repeating that the players need to learn to play together until they will all get grey hair I guess. Experience of playing together gives the 10% extra edge, but the 90% foundation is executing the tactic and basic football knowledge. This is season 3 (?) of fresh start, folks will always come and go as they do in most of football teams.

I'm getting more and more convinced that godlike ballon d'or saviors Enzo and Caicedo are about as much use as Werner (credit due, he at least put the shift in) and Havertz were, only way more expensive. 

Well, I’ve never thought of our CMs as the best in england, much less in the world, but it’s way too much focus on a small cog vs the entire machine. It’s a team sport after all.

Disagree. There is very little that won’t change.
Poch and Maresca’s idea about how to play football couldn’t be any more different… Which is the reason he was hired.

Low block to high line. Traditional direct and quick transitions to positional game.

there is no fucking way this is done quickly. 

Edited September 1 by robsblubot

[DDA 9,690]

Just watched a short documentary on Micheal Essien.. 🥲 

Watching clips of that team.. and bloody hell… how has it come to this. 
 

i know every club has its cycle… but its such a huge drop off.

[robsblubot 3,508]

I’d point to a single tool to showcase my point about the CM pairing: heat map.

please take a team like city or arsenal, or a even Liverpool, and check the heat map of most players. Notice how many times during a match they operate in the center midfield area despite not being CMs. That’s a good team at work.

[Blue Armour 4,289]

6 hours ago, robsblubot said:

Disagree. For me it was team problem, rather than a player problem. The team is still too spaced out and that can and will be exploited by the opposition.

You could see that clearly in the second half: Caicedo and Enzo were outnumbered often as there was always a 3rd open man to receive a pass. You simply cannot defend in that situation as the game "piggy in the middle" proves.

It's easy to point fingers to individuals as many did not have outstanding games, which is also an indication it was a teamwork issue.

Many of us warned that a start from scratch would have a cost no matter the players. The good teams who have been playing together for years are flying high, which is not really surprising.

Plus in the second half, Crystal Palace did a good job of forcing Palmer to drop back too deep to receive the ball, where he would have a tougher time influencing the final third. He is our strongest (and sometimes our only) creative outlet.

IMO, it was a mistake to remove Neto, even if Mudryk wasn't terrible.

Felix was also ineffective. And Madueke dropped off. 

Hopefully with Neto & Sancho settling in, and Nkunku gaining some match sharpness, things can improve in future games 

[xPetrCechx 13,563]

🔵👀 Enzo Maresca: “Probably one thing that has to be clear: Chelsea three years ago won the Champions League… but now it is not that kind of Chelsea”.“Now, sometimes, if you don’t win it is normal”. 

[robsblubot 3,508]

10 minutes ago, Blue Armour said:

Plus in the second half, Crystal Palace did a good job of forcing Palmer to drop back too deep to receive the ball, where he would have a tougher time influencing the final third. He is our strongest (and sometimes our only) creative outlet.

IMO, it was a mistake to remove Neto, even if Mudryk wasn't terrible.

Felix was also ineffective. And Madueke dropped off. 

Hopefully with Neto & Sancho settling in, and Nkunku gaining some match sharpness, things can improve in future games 

Subbing Neto was definitely a mistake in my book, not only for the quality part but also tactically. This is what I alluded to in my heat map suggestion above: Neto will have to learn how to do what Mount used to do for us, which is to drop back and join the linkup with the CMs (he did that very well in the CL run). I think Neto has both the quality as well as the work rate for that, while Mudryk does not.

I'm unsure where Madueke can do that work; he plays so direct that he's either hot or cold, but he does not help the middle of the park a whole lot. Noni was actually both hot and cold during the match.

The CBs (entire D line) will also have to step up to make the lines more compact, which will also help the middle of the park. Poch simply played a low block, which fits his style, but it's going to be a lot different with Maresca. I sadly remember Arteta's first year at Arsenal -- hope it's not the same.

Heh Palmer is a star and everybody knows it; he will have to deal with that and the manager try to find ways for him to get the ball in good positions. I'm amazed he's still playing so well despite the tight marking.

I was totally expecting some stutter and am not surprised one bit. I wrote I few times before that expecting a continuation from last season would be a mistake given the philosophy change and that some players, who were thriving under Poch, may struggle under the new system.

[Blue Armour 4,289]

2 minutes ago, xPetrCechx said:

🔵👀 Enzo Maresca: “Probably one thing that has to be clear: Chelsea three years ago won the Champions League… but now it is not that kind of Chelsea”.“Now, sometimes, if you don’t win it is normal”. 

Wow. Maresca really calls it like it is.

No BS.

Really like that from the manager, but can't imagine it wins him too many fans up top.

[Reddish-Blue 2,347]

4 hours ago, robsblubot said:

Notice how many times during a match they operate in the center midfield area despite not being CMs. That’s a good team at work.

That's not just team work, that is actually buying or developing talent who are versatile enough to adapt to the situation of the game. 

[robsblubot 3,508]

5 minutes ago, Reddish-Blue said:

That's not just team work, that is actually buying or developing talent who are versatile enough to adapt to the situation of the game. 

yeah good point, something which Pep is particularly a master of.

Worse than changing managers often is to also change the philosophy, so the signed players under the previous manager aren't a good fit under the new one.

Edited September 2 by robsblubot

[Blue Armour 4,289]

1 minute ago, robsblubot said:

Subbing Neto was definitely a mistake in my book, not only for the quality part but also tactically. This is what I alluded to in my heat map suggestion above: Neto will have to learn how to do what Mount used to do for us, which is to drop back and join the linkup with the CMs (he did that very well in the CL run). I think Neto has both the quality as well as the work rate for that, while Mudryk does not.

I'm unsure where Madueke can do that work; he plays so direct that he's either hot or cold, but he does not help the middle of the park a whole lot. Noni was actually both hot and cold during the match.

The CBs (entire D line) will also have to step up to make the lines more compact, which will also help the middle of the park. Poch simply played a low block, which fits his style, but it's going to be a lot different with Maresca. I sadly remember Arteta's first year at Arsenal -- hope it's not the same.

Heh Palmer is a star and everybody knows it; he will have to deal with that and the manager try to find ways for him to get the ball in good positions. I'm amazed he's still playing so well despite the tight marking.

I was totally expecting some stutter and am not surprised one bit. I wrote I few times before that expecting a continuation from last season would be a mistake given the philosophy change and that some players, who were thriving under Poch, may struggle under the new system.

Good point on the CB line too.

Fofana tried to support in this game by moving up further front to support the attack, not quite Rudiger levels, but still enough to provide an extra body in attack.

The passing from the deep midfield and center back is not as ambitious enough, yet, IMO. I think Maresca might seek to improve on this 

[Reddish-Blue 2,347]

2 minutes ago, Blue Armour said:

Wow. Maresca really calls it like it is.

It is also the reality of the situation.  How many of the UCL team are still here?     Azpi, Rudiger, Christensen, Thiago, Alonso, Jorginho Kante Kovacic, Mount Havertz.   The turn over in the squad has been crazy and I honestly don't think we've actually improved in defense or midfield from that team. 

Enzo and Caicedo wouldn't be able to match the trio we had and same for the current defense against Rudiger and co. 

[robsblubot 3,508]

1 minute ago, Blue Armour said:

Good point on the CB line too.

Fofana tried to support in this game by moving up further front to support the attack, not quite Rudiger levels, but still enough to provide an extra body in attack.

The passing from the deep midfield and center back is not as ambitious enough, yet, IMO. I think Maresca might seek to improve on this 

yup noticed that and it was reassuring; just hope he keeps fit and he should improve... along with the team mechanics. It's been too long for him to play regularly like this, so it should take some time.

[Vesper 28,855]

4 hours ago, Reddish-Blue said:

How many of the UCL team are still here? 

Reece and Chilly (Kepa is on loan)

[Seymop 90]

6 hours ago, Blue Armour said:

Felix was also ineffective

This just tells everything about the total mess we are in

In 2023 Felix was lightweight and couldn’t cut it. We dump him after 6 months, but then somebody decides to spend £40 million to bring him back !!! 
 

It’s all just a shambles and  we look a joke to the rest of the world of football !!