Chelsea 1-1 Crystal Palace

[robsblubot 3,595]

I’d point to a single tool to showcase my point about the CM pairing: heat map.

please take a team like city or arsenal, or a even Liverpool, and check the heat map of most players. Notice how many times during a match they operate in the center midfield area despite not being CMs. That’s a good team at work.

[Blue Armour 4,442]

6 hours ago, robsblubot said:

Disagree. For me it was team problem, rather than a player problem. The team is still too spaced out and that can and will be exploited by the opposition.

You could see that clearly in the second half: Caicedo and Enzo were outnumbered often as there was always a 3rd open man to receive a pass. You simply cannot defend in that situation as the game "piggy in the middle" proves.

It's easy to point fingers to individuals as many did not have outstanding games, which is also an indication it was a teamwork issue.

Many of us warned that a start from scratch would have a cost no matter the players. The good teams who have been playing together for years are flying high, which is not really surprising.

Plus in the second half, Crystal Palace did a good job of forcing Palmer to drop back too deep to receive the ball, where he would have a tougher time influencing the final third. He is our strongest (and sometimes our only) creative outlet.

IMO, it was a mistake to remove Neto, even if Mudryk wasn't terrible.

Felix was also ineffective. And Madueke dropped off. 

Hopefully with Neto & Sancho settling in, and Nkunku gaining some match sharpness, things can improve in future games 

[xPetrCechx 13,571]

🔵👀 Enzo Maresca: “Probably one thing that has to be clear: Chelsea three years ago won the Champions League… but now it is not that kind of Chelsea”.“Now, sometimes, if you don’t win it is normal”. 

[robsblubot 3,595]

10 minutes ago, Blue Armour said:

Plus in the second half, Crystal Palace did a good job of forcing Palmer to drop back too deep to receive the ball, where he would have a tougher time influencing the final third. He is our strongest (and sometimes our only) creative outlet.

IMO, it was a mistake to remove Neto, even if Mudryk wasn't terrible.

Felix was also ineffective. And Madueke dropped off. 

Hopefully with Neto & Sancho settling in, and Nkunku gaining some match sharpness, things can improve in future games 

Subbing Neto was definitely a mistake in my book, not only for the quality part but also tactically. This is what I alluded to in my heat map suggestion above: Neto will have to learn how to do what Mount used to do for us, which is to drop back and join the linkup with the CMs (he did that very well in the CL run). I think Neto has both the quality as well as the work rate for that, while Mudryk does not.

I'm unsure where Madueke can do that work; he plays so direct that he's either hot or cold, but he does not help the middle of the park a whole lot. Noni was actually both hot and cold during the match.

The CBs (entire D line) will also have to step up to make the lines more compact, which will also help the middle of the park. Poch simply played a low block, which fits his style, but it's going to be a lot different with Maresca. I sadly remember Arteta's first year at Arsenal -- hope it's not the same.

Heh Palmer is a star and everybody knows it; he will have to deal with that and the manager try to find ways for him to get the ball in good positions. I'm amazed he's still playing so well despite the tight marking.

I was totally expecting some stutter and am not surprised one bit. I wrote I few times before that expecting a continuation from last season would be a mistake given the philosophy change and that some players, who were thriving under Poch, may struggle under the new system.

[Blue Armour 4,442]

2 minutes ago, xPetrCechx said:

🔵👀 Enzo Maresca: “Probably one thing that has to be clear: Chelsea three years ago won the Champions League… but now it is not that kind of Chelsea”.“Now, sometimes, if you don’t win it is normal”. 

Wow. Maresca really calls it like it is.

No BS.

Really like that from the manager, but can't imagine it wins him too many fans up top.

[Reddish-Blue 2,507]

4 hours ago, robsblubot said:

Notice how many times during a match they operate in the center midfield area despite not being CMs. That’s a good team at work.

That's not just team work, that is actually buying or developing talent who are versatile enough to adapt to the situation of the game. 

[robsblubot 3,595]

5 minutes ago, Reddish-Blue said:

That's not just team work, that is actually buying or developing talent who are versatile enough to adapt to the situation of the game. 

yeah good point, something which Pep is particularly a master of.

Worse than changing managers often is to also change the philosophy, so the signed players under the previous manager aren't a good fit under the new one.

Edited September 2, 2024 by robsblubot

[Blue Armour 4,442]

1 minute ago, robsblubot said:

Subbing Neto was definitely a mistake in my book, not only for the quality part but also tactically. This is what I alluded to in my heat map suggestion above: Neto will have to learn how to do what Mount used to do for us, which is to drop back and join the linkup with the CMs (he did that very well in the CL run). I think Neto has both the quality as well as the work rate for that, while Mudryk does not.

I'm unsure where Madueke can do that work; he plays so direct that he's either hot or cold, but he does not help the middle of the park a whole lot. Noni was actually both hot and cold during the match.

The CBs (entire D line) will also have to step up to make the lines more compact, which will also help the middle of the park. Poch simply played a low block, which fits his style, but it's going to be a lot different with Maresca. I sadly remember Arteta's first year at Arsenal -- hope it's not the same.

Heh Palmer is a star and everybody knows it; he will have to deal with that and the manager try to find ways for him to get the ball in good positions. I'm amazed he's still playing so well despite the tight marking.

I was totally expecting some stutter and am not surprised one bit. I wrote I few times before that expecting a continuation from last season would be a mistake given the philosophy change and that some players, who were thriving under Poch, may struggle under the new system.

Good point on the CB line too.

Fofana tried to support in this game by moving up further front to support the attack, not quite Rudiger levels, but still enough to provide an extra body in attack.

The passing from the deep midfield and center back is not as ambitious enough, yet, IMO. I think Maresca might seek to improve on this 

[Reddish-Blue 2,507]

2 minutes ago, Blue Armour said:

Wow. Maresca really calls it like it is.

It is also the reality of the situation.  How many of the UCL team are still here?     Azpi, Rudiger, Christensen, Thiago, Alonso, Jorginho Kante Kovacic, Mount Havertz.   The turn over in the squad has been crazy and I honestly don't think we've actually improved in defense or midfield from that team. 

Enzo and Caicedo wouldn't be able to match the trio we had and same for the current defense against Rudiger and co. 

[robsblubot 3,595]

1 minute ago, Blue Armour said:

Good point on the CB line too.

Fofana tried to support in this game by moving up further front to support the attack, not quite Rudiger levels, but still enough to provide an extra body in attack.

The passing from the deep midfield and center back is not as ambitious enough, yet, IMO. I think Maresca might seek to improve on this 

yup noticed that and it was reassuring; just hope he keeps fit and he should improve... along with the team mechanics. It's been too long for him to play regularly like this, so it should take some time.

[Vesper 30,186]

4 hours ago, Reddish-Blue said:

How many of the UCL team are still here? 

Reece and Chilly (Kepa is on loan)

[Seymop 90]

6 hours ago, Blue Armour said:

Felix was also ineffective

This just tells everything about the total mess we are in

In 2023 Felix was lightweight and couldn’t cut it. We dump him after 6 months, but then somebody decides to spend £40 million to bring him back !!! 
 

It’s all just a shambles and  we look a joke to the rest of the world of football !!

[Fulham Broadway 17,317]

14 hours ago, robsblubot said:

Disagree. For me it was team problem, rather than a player problem. The team is still too spaced out and that can and will be exploited by the opposition.

You could see that clearly in the second half: Caicedo and Enzo were outnumbered often as there was always a 3rd open man to receive a pass. You simply cannot defend in that situation as the game "piggy in the middle" proves.

It's easy to point fingers to individuals as many did not have outstanding games, which is also an indication it was a teamwork issue.

Many of us warned that a start from scratch would have a cost no matter the players. The good teams who have been playing together for years are flying high, which is not really surprising.

Maybe but its more nuanced than that. there are fundamental flaws from top down - the culture and cohesive nature of the club appear to have  fundamentally changed, to one of individualism so agree about teamwork lacking

[Reddish-Blue 2,507]

33 minutes ago, Fulham Broadway said:

the culture and cohesive nature of the club appear to have  fundamentally changed, to one of individualism so agree about teamwork lacking

Because we lack leaders on the pitch.  You need guys like Azpi, Rudiger, Terry, Cahill, A.Cole, Thiago Silva, Kante to help develop that culture. 

You don't go around spending 250 million on a midfield setup who aren't a good match for each other. 

Problem is, what happens if Enzo or Caicedo lose form, can Maresca drop them or will they continue to play due to the amount the club invested in them? 

 

[Mhsc 1,097]

15 minutes ago, Reddish-Blue said:

Problem is, what happens if Enzo or Caicedo lose form, can Maresca drop them or will they continue to play due to the amount the club invested in them? 

Is there really still a conversation to be had about this? Maresca has shown he is willing & happy to drop anyone and that he is picking players based on how they perform and how hard they work in training, not on price tags or how big their name is.

It will be interesting to see what he does when Lavia is finally back and he has that headache and a choice to make. We were a better side with him in it and wont be surprised if Enzo is dropped to the bench if he cannot improve his level quickly.