Erling Haaland

[Jase 43,479]

3 minutes ago, Azul said:

We can only hope they'll get better moving forward. However if we're going by what we're seeing right now, then it's not looking good. I know why you're trying to compare us to City and Liverpool, but they are just better at scoring than us. Before this season, Liverpool had Mane and Salah banging in goals for them with Firmino being the creative force.

Manchester City this season just have better midfielders and forwards then us, period. Not strengthening our attack and relying on the likes of Havertz, Mount, Werner etc to challenge City next season is just suicidal😂 They've not shown anything that tells me we can challenge for the title next season. Our defence has just been superb under Tuchel, we just need to fix our attack in order to challenge City who'll also sign forwards probably.

Man City and Liverpool have the benefit of their squad being together longer and are at their peak age. Ours aren't there yet but they can get there. Those 2 clubs didn't get to where they are now (excluding Liverpool's form this season) without 1-2 seasons of suffering. 

5 minutes ago, Azul said:

We have to remember that Pep and Klopp build their own squad by buying their own players. Klopp signed Salah/Mane/Firmino for example and Pep signed Mahrez/KDB/Silva/Sane etc. Who says that Tuchel is happy with his forwards at the moment? This is not his team and I'll be very surprised if he does not sign a forward, but we'll see what happens in the summer.

The funny thing is, will Tuchel even get much say in our transfers? Our past history suggests it's unlikely. Plus, he's only got an 18-month contract (no sign of us wanting to extend that yet) and part of the reason why we hired him - or why we went for a German manager - in the first place is that they are familiar/generally OK with working this setup of the board making the big decisions over transfers while he just coaches the players. 

The problem is, if we can't/don't get Haaland, then which proven goalscorer can we get? Kane is impossible (LOL). Lukaku very unlikely, unless Conte leaves and/or Inter's financial situation blows up. Other than those two alternatives, the rest aren't quite at the highest level. 

And the funny thing about us talking about all of this is that it goes out of the window if we don't qualify for the Champions League. lol

[Atomiswave 6,117]

1 hour ago, Jason said:

Mahrez/KDB/Silva/Sane etc

KDB was already at City before Pep, Pellegrini got him.

[Jase 43,479]

2 minutes ago, Atomiswave said:

KDB was already at City before Pep, Pellegrini got him.

You quoted the wrong person.

[Atomiswave 6,117]

56 minutes ago, Jason said:

You quoted the wrong person.

My bad Jason

[Azul 1,615]

3 hours ago, Jason said:

Man City and Liverpool have the benefit of their squad being together longer and are at their peak age. Ours aren't there yet but they can get there. Those 2 clubs didn't get to where they are now (excluding Liverpool's form this season) without 1-2 seasons of suffering. 

The funny thing is, will Tuchel even get much say in our transfers? Our past history suggests it's unlikely. Plus, he's only got an 18-month contract (no sign of us wanting to extend that yet) and part of the reason why we hired him - or why we went for a German manager - in the first place is that they are familiar/generally OK with working this setup of the board making the big decisions over transfers while he just coaches the players. 

The problem is, if we can't/don't get Haaland, then which proven goalscorer can we get? Kane is impossible (LOL). Lukaku very unlikely, unless Conte leaves and/or Inter's financial situation blows up. Other than those two alternatives, the rest aren't quite at the highest level. 

And the funny thing about us talking about all of this is that it goes out of the window if we don't qualify for the Champions League. lol

"Man City and Liverpool have the benefit of their squad being together longer and are at their peak age. Ours aren't there yet but they can get there. Those 2 clubs didn't get to where they are now (excluding Liverpool's form this season) without 1-2 seasons of suffering. "

I agree and I've been saying that, however they build a squad in their image as well. Tuchel has just come in, so it'd be silly to think he's ok with not adding a single forward. Pep and Klopp didn't get to where they are without signing players that fit their system. It's not just about 'suffering', but building a team in their image as well. If we don't sign a forward for next season, then I can bet my house that we are not challenging next season. In order to challenge, your attack has to have a very high output. From what we've seen so far, there is nothing to suggests we'll have killers in the box next season. We can only use what ifs and hope Tuchel does some magic. The reality is that there literally is no logical arguments for our current forwards to perform like the Man City or inform Liverpool attack next season.

"The funny thing is, will Tuchel even get much say in our transfers?"

If he finishes the season with top four, then they'll 100% back him. Just like they backed Lampard when he got us the top four. Plus it's a myth that every manager at Chelsea don't get the signings they want. Top class managers that the board can trust get backed. Look at Sarri for example, he got Jorginho, Kovacic and Higuain. Conte signed Kante, Alonso etc. He didn't get backed in his second season because he always throws tantrums at every club he goes to and also the fact that they didn't want to sign Lukaku who's an ex player. Mourinho signed Drogba, Carvalho, Ferreira, Fabregas and the list goes on. Those are all the players he specifically wanted. Lampard didn't get fully backed because the board still had some doubts on him, and rightfully so.

"The problem is, if we can't/don't get Haaland, then which proven goalscorer can we get? Kane is impossible (LOL). Lukaku very unlikely, unless Conte leaves and/or Inter's financial situation blows up. Other than those two alternatives, the rest aren't quite at the highest level. "

That is my point, we shouldn't sign a young talent if Haaland is not available for us. We should go for a proven short term fix, then see what's out there next summer. Lukaku would be the dream, but we know the board are reluctant on buying expensive ex-players.

[Jase 43,479]

17 minutes ago, Azul said:

I agree and I've been saying that, however they build a squad in their image as well. Tuchel has just come in, so it'd be silly to think he's ok with not adding a single forward. Pep and Klopp didn't get to where they are without signing players that fit their system. It's not just about 'suffering', but building a team in their image as well. If we don't sign a forward for next season, then I can bet my house that we are not challenging next season. In order to challenge, your attack has to have a very high output. From what we've seen so far, there is nothing to suggests we'll have killers in the box next season. We can only use what ifs and hope Tuchel does some magic. The reality is that there literally is no logical arguments for our current forwards to perform like the Man City or inform Liverpool attack next season.

Well, it's tough to get a clear picture because we wasted half a season playing freestyle football under Lampard and then Tuchel has come without having much time in between games to actually work with the players. It is partly enforced due to the congested schedule but all the constant chopping and changing isn't helping either.

16 minutes ago, Azul said:

If he finishes the season with top four, then they'll 100% back him. Just like they backed Lampard when he got us the top four. Plus it's a myth that every manager at Chelsea don't get the signings they want. Top class managers that the board can trust get backed. Look at Sarri for example, he got Jorginho, Kovacic and Higuain. Conte signed Kante, Alonso etc. He didn't get backed in his second season because he always throws tantrums at every club he goes to and also the fact that they didn't want to sign Lukaku who's an ex player. Mourinho signed Drogba, Carvalho, Ferreira, Fabregas and the list goes on. Those are all the players he specifically wanted. Lampard didn't get fully backed because the board still had some doubts on him, and rightfully so.

Lampard got Top 4 last season and Chilwell was supposedly the only signing that he wanted. The rest were the board's ideas. 

[Azul 1,615]

15 minutes ago, Jason said:

Well, it's tough to get a clear picture because we wasted half a season playing freestyle football under Lampard and then Tuchel has come without having much time in between games to actually work with the players. It is partly enforced due to the congested schedule but all the constant chopping and changing isn't helping either.

Lampard got Top 4 last season and Chilwell was supposedly the only signing that he wanted. The rest were the board's ideas. 

I think our forwards will get better with time ofcourse, but I think they won't become good enough to challenge for the league. I have no problems with our defence however. We need a proper striker in order to challenge, and I stand by that.

Like I said, there was doubts about Lampards pedigree as a manager. He got top four, but if you look at the context of the season then you can understand why they didn't fully back him. He got us Champions League football, but the way the team performed was not convincing enough for the board to fully back him. He didn't have the CV for the board to fully back him. Imagine he got his wish and they bought Tarkowski instead of Thiago Silva? It was the right decision at the end of the day, so I don't see your point no offense.

 

Edited March 27, 2021 by Azul

[NikkiCFC 8,286]

12 minutes ago, Jason said:

Well, it's tough to get a clear picture because we wasted half a season playing freestyle football under Lampard and then Tuchel has come without having much time in between games to actually work with the players. It is partly enforced due to the congested schedule but all the constant chopping and changing isn't helping either. 

Not only that Tuchel fixed our defense but I think he is slowly improving our underperforming attackers. 

Kai, Pulisic and Ziyech didn't do much this season under Frank. When Tuchel came here he didn't put them in lineup right away. And it was logical thing to do. They needed time. First start for Kai after a while was Everton and he was great. It was the same against Atletico. He also changed his position. 

It was the same with Ziyech. After Wolves he didn't see the pitch for long period. But last 2 games 2 goals and one was from the bench. Even Pulisic is showing signs of progress. Assist against Atletico and motm last game. 

Werner also can only become better. 

So I remain optimistic for next season with Tuchel even if we don't sign any new attacking players. 

[Jase 43,479]

22 minutes ago, Azul said:

I think our forwards will get better with time ofcourse, but I think they won't become good enough to challenge for the league. I have no problems with our defence however. We need a proper striker in order to challenge, and I stand by that.

I don't necessarily disagree with you. Am just trying to look at what we can work with - e.g. the squad that we have - if we can't sign any striker of note this summer. It's not a complete lost cause because the potential is there.

By the way, it's also kinda ironic that we talk about getting a proper striker etc and while Haaland has shown that he can score goals, it's easy to forget that he's still inexperienced at leading a big side to major trophies.

22 minutes ago, Azul said:

Like I said, there was doubts about Lampards pedigree as a manager. He got top four, but if you look at the context of the season then you can understand why they didn't fully back him. He got us Champions League football, but the way the team performed was not convincing enough for the board to fully back him. He didn't have the CV for the board to fully back him. Imagine he got his wish and they bought Tarkowski instead of Thiago Silva? It was the right decision at the end of the day, so I don't see your point no offense.

But the board not fully backing the manager is nothing new, is it? It's not just because of Lampard's lack of credentials. Conte wanted duds but he also wanted someone like Van Dijk, only for the club to deem him too expensive, for example. Mourinho wanted Pogba and Stones but got neither, another example. Right or wrong, the club will always dictate the transfers. 

[Azul 1,615]

15 minutes ago, Jason said:

I don't necessarily disagree with you. Am just trying to look at what we can work with - e.g. the squad that we have - if we can't sign any striker of note this summer. It's not a complete lost cause because the potential is there.

By the way, it's also kinda ironic that we talk about getting a proper striker etc and while Haaland has shown that he can score goals, it's easy to forget that he's still inexperienced at leading a big side to major trophies.

But the board not fully backing the manager is nothing new, is it? It's not just because of Lampard's lack of credentials. Conte wanted duds but he also wanted someone like Van Dijk, only for the club to deem him too expensive, for example. Mourinho wanted Pogba and Stones but got neither, another example. Right or wrong, the club will always dictate the transfers. 

"I don't necessarily disagree with you. Am just trying to look at what we can work with - e.g. the squad that we have - if we can't sign any striker of note this summer. It's not a complete lost cause because the potential is there."

I see where you're coming from, I hope they massively improve and that Werner shows. If Werner is in his Leipzig form, then things will look much different.

"By the way, it's also kinda ironic that we talk about getting a proper striker etc and while Haaland has shown that he can score goals, it's easy to forget that he's still inexperienced at leading a big side to major trophies."

He has not proven to be a winner that leads sides to trophies. However what he is doing is freakish. He also performs against big teams and has a UCL records, and continues to break many more records. It's just that Dortmund is a lost cause. Their defense is horrible as well as their tactical setup. He can only do so much there.

"But the board not fully backing the manager is nothing new, is it? It's not just because of Lampard's lack of credentials. Conte wanted duds but he also wanted someone like Van Dijk, only for the club to deem him too expensive, for example. Mourinho wanted Pogba and Stones but got neither, another example. Right or wrong, the club will always dictate the transfers. "

According to VVD himself, Chelsea wanted him. He declined, and joined Liverpool afterwards because of Klopp. So we were actually in for him, you can look it up. 

Chelsea didn't back Jose after his title win, because of how toxic he was. Besides why would they back someone they were about to sack? He wanted to sign Stones in January 2016, a month before he got the sack. Same with Pogba, he wanted him in the summer of 2016. He wanted to stay and get backed after his usual toxic behaviour, you know how bad it gets with him.

Edited March 27, 2021 by Azul

[Jase 43,479]

44 minutes ago, Azul said:

He has not proven to be a winner that leads sides to trophies. However what he is doing is freakish. He also performs against big teams and has a UCL records, and continues to break many more records. It's just that Dortmund is a lost cause. Their defense is horrible as well as their tactical setup. He can only do so much there.

Am not blaming Haaland for Dortmund being crap. Just saying that while he's a proven goalscorer, he's not a not a proven winner...yet. 

As for his goalscoring record, I have been wondering whether he's really one of those goalscoring freaks or whether his numbers will eventually plateau at some point because not even the likes of Messi and Ronaldo were posting such numbers at his age.

47 minutes ago, Azul said:

Chelsea didn't back Jose after his title win, because of how toxic he was. Besides why would they back someone they were about to sack? He wanted to sign Stones in January 2016, a month before he got the sack. Same with Pogba, he wanted him in the summer of 2016. He wanted to stay and get backed after his usual toxic behaviour, you know how bad it gets with him.

TBF, Mourinho only became toxic after it became clear that the board didn't want to sign the players that he wanted. He was still fine when we won the title, after we won it. Go listen to his interview in the last game of 2014/15 when we lifted the trophy. It's the same thing that made Conte just give up after his title win.

[killer1257 3,282]

He was invisible today against Turkey. Also did not score against Gibraltar.