Jorginho

[MoroccanBlue 5,197]

8 minutes ago, Jason said:

Pardon me if I don't care about international football. Only care about how players do for us.

You were curious to know how Jorginho fairs as a player when he isn't 'Constricted to Sarri's football'. I showed you an example how he works well for the national side playing in a double pivot. Being one of Italy's more consistent performers. 

We get it. You don't like him. But save it with the confirmation bias. 

[Jase 43,479]

Just now, MoroccanBlue said:

You were curious to know how Jorginho fairs as a player when he isn't 'Constricted to Sarri's football'. I showed you an example how he works well for the national side playing in a double pivot. Being one of Italy's more consistent performers. 

There have been/are players who do better for their national team than their club. Just because you said he does well for Italy, I have to take your word for it?

5 minutes ago, MoroccanBlue said:

We get it. You don't like him. But save it with the confirmation bias. 

Not even sure where you're going with this or why you're getting worked up. Jorginho has mostly been associated with Sarriball in recent years. So is it wrong to just wonder how he'll fare outside of it?

For the record, I have never liked or disliked Sarri. Just found his tactics and approach to be one dimensional and even restrictive. And yeah, I know you don't agree with this. So, whatever...

[MoroccanBlue 5,197]

1 minute ago, Jason said:

There have been/are players who do better for their national team than their club. Just because you said he does well for Italy, I have to take your word for it?

Not even sure where you're going with this or why you're getting worked up. Jorginho has mostly been associated with Sarriball in recent years. So is it wrong to just wonder how he'll fare outside of it?

For the record, I have never liked or disliked Sarri. Just found his tactics and approach to be one dimensional and even restrictive. And yeah, I know you don't agree with this. So, whatever...

You've implied, on multiple occasions, that Jorginho relies on Sarri's system. 

I've showed you, that he's been one of the national team's most consistent performers these past couple years, playing in a double pivot under Mancini's philosophy. Don't take my word for it, actually watch Italy or hear what actual Italians have to say about him. 1st name on the team sheet for some. 

To completely disregard it as evidence as you did, just furthur shows your confirmation bias. 

[Jase 43,479]

11 minutes ago, MoroccanBlue said:

You've implied, on multiple occasions, that Jorginho relies on Sarri's system. 

You interpret whatever you want, however you want. My point was/is I'm simply intrigue to see how will Jorginho fare outside Sarri's system FOR US, especially when he's been playing in that for so long AT CLUB LEVEL. Stated it from the beginning. Not sure how that got translated to 'Jorginho relies on Sarri's system'. 

19 minutes ago, MoroccanBlue said:

To completely disregard it as evidence as you did, just furthur shows your confirmation bias. 

Not sure if it's confirmation bias or you just like getting worked up and having a go at anyone who sees your Sarri in bad light...

[Spike 12,049]

Sarriball is a stupid term.

[OneMoSalah 8,614]

 

On 17/06/2019 at 5:56 PM, Jason said:

Pardon me if I don't care about international football. Only care about how players do for us.

Reslly dont get your whole opinion about the NT thing.

There was uproar on here when England gave CHO his debut against the Czech Republic (I think) which he did well in, playing in a different team/system before Sarri gave him his PL one making people feel he had to start using him much more bla bla bla (would have imagined you would of shared that opinion)... yet someone cant say anything about how Jorginho does for Italy? Playing in a different system? With different players? Because it doesnt matter with regards to how they do at club level? 

Usually very good players are gonna be very good players for their club and for their NT because they are very good. Jorginho has been good for us recently and good for Italy in the last batch of games. Everybody wins. Same with any of the players. If you can play well for Italy, Brazil, England etc you have no real excuse for not playing well at Chelsea. And vice versa.

[Jase 43,479]

Just now, OneMoSalah said:

 

Reslly dont get your whole opinion about the NT thing.

There was uproar on here when England gave CHO his debut against the Czech Republic (I think) which he did well in, playing in a different team/system before Sarri gave him his PL one meaning he had to start ebery week bla bla bla... yet someone cant say anything about how Jorginho does for Italy? Playing in a different system? With different players? Why does it matter 😂 Usually very good players are gonna be very good players for their club and for their NT because they are very good. Jorginho has been good for us recently and good for Italy in the last batch of games.

For starters, I don't even know why people got annoyed with my initial post. Basically said am curious to see how will Jorginho fare outside Sarriball aka under the new manager (after all, the new manager will have his own ideas etc, different from Sarri, Mancini). Yes, he might do well for Italy but (this isn't a slight on him or anything) we have seen players do well for the NT team but not for the club and I only care about Chelsea here, I want to see Jorginho do well for us. There are worse opinions on him from others out there...

[OneMoSalah 8,614]

Just now, Jason said:

For starters, I don't even know why people got annoyed with my initial post. Basically said am curious to see how will Jorginho fare outside Sarriball aka under the new manager (after all, the new manager will have his own ideas etc, different from Sarri, Mancini). Yes, he might do well for Italy but (this isn't a slight on him or anything) we have seen players do well for the NT team but not for the club and I only care about Chelsea here, I want to see Jorginho do well for us. There are worse opinions on him from others out there...

I agree but I just dont get why you think the NT things not considered important regarding how a player can do for a club when the England game Callum played definitely added fuel to the fire about him not being played more often. Fair enough its not overly important and sure players can do better/worse at club/country but the majority of the very good players seem to be able to do both and I would consider Jorgi a very good player.

Like you also said you want to see him outside of a Sarri system and I am sure he will be able to do well too. Certainly hope so, he has had his first year here, has a chance to go into this season knowing what to expect so lets hope regardless of manager, formation, he can continue playing good like he did the last 15 games of the season. Think he has improved defensively a lot. If we continue with possession orientated football then he has to be crucial to it because we dont have players in a similar mould to him now having lost Cesc.

Still gutted Sarri never used Kante - Jorginho - Cesc. The fact Cesc could alternative with Jorginho or be found in more advanced postions by him could have been excellent. Maybe lightweight but again we used Kovacic with Jorginho and Kante and is he really much more stronger than Cesc? Oh well we will never know.

[the wes 7,212]

Jorginho agent not ruling out Chelsea midfielder following Sarri to Juventus

https://www.goal.com/en/news/jorginho-agent-not-ruling-out-following-sarri-to-juventus/1vewiohmm9f4v1u4gfifjf42iw

[Vesper 27,310]

9 hours ago, the wes said:

Jorginho agent not ruling out Chelsea midfielder following Sarri to Juventus

https://www.goal.com/en/news/jorginho-agent-not-ruling-out-following-sarri-to-juventus/1vewiohmm9f4v1u4gfifjf42iw

unless they offer insane cash, I do not see this happening, as we are so light in the MF

[the wes 7,212]

48 minutes ago, Vesper said:

unless they offer insane cash, I do not see this happening, as we are so light in the MF

I can't see juventus going for him 2bh pjanic can do the jorginho role for sarri 

[Jase 43,479]

 

[Milan 17,835]

Lamps on Jorginho -

Quote

“Jorginho is a fantastic player. The one thing that has struck me about him from working with him in the last week and a bit is not just his quality on the ball, I saw that last year. We know all about his comfort on the ball and bravery to receive the ball in any area. It is not something that’s normal to receive the ball in tight areas and deal with the ball and keep doing it constantly.

“But his attitude in training has been first class. He’s a driver of a session. He’s a voice. He runs, he pushes people around him, he drags people up when he doesn’t feel they’re working as much as he might want. I’ve loved seeing that. So in terms of first impressions, working with him for 10 days, I can’t ask for any more. I’m delighted to have him.”

 

Quote

“Jorginho became a conversation last year. I’ve been there. As a player, sometimes things are out of your control and the conversation carries on very quickly without you. He played in one position and the manager had faith in him and it became something that was talked about, possibly too much.

“But I’m a new manager. I have new ideas. We might be more adaptable in the way we play. I might ask different things of Jorginho, of N’Golo Kante, of Ross Barkley — of anybody. I’m not stuck in a conversation from last year. I’m looking at a player who has very much impressed me over the last 10 days.”

 

[Jase 43,479]

'Sarri wasn't my friend': Jorginho opens up on relationship with ex-Chelsea boss and says he hopes to play with more freedom under Frank Lampard after praising new formation

[Superblue 6,331]

1 hour ago, Jason said:

'Sarri wasn't my friend': Jorginho opens up on relationship with ex-Chelsea boss and says he hopes to play with more freedom under Frank Lampard after praising new formation

He got a real bad rub of the green last season being so closely affiliated with Sarri and I hope this season is a fresh start for him without that 'baggage'. If Lampard perseveres with this formation I think it will actually benefit all of our main midfielders - Jorginho, Kante and Kovacic all benefit from playing in the '2' and Barkley and Mount both benefit playing further up field.

I firmly believe if Jorginho had moved to City like expected last season everybody would have been full of praise for him and us fans would have been moaning why we couldn't snap him up with Sarri joining as manager. We're lucky to have some serious talent in our ranks in midfield and lots of different skill-sets which should mesh well. The area of the pitch I'm least concerned with next season (unless they all get injured and we're left playing Bakayoko and Drinkwater together).

[Jase 43,479]

10 hours ago, Superblue_1986 said:

He got a real bad rub of the green last season being so closely affiliated with Sarri and I hope this season is a fresh start for him without that 'baggage'. If Lampard perseveres with this formation I think it will actually benefit all of our main midfielders - Jorginho, Kante and Kovacic all benefit from playing in the '2' and Barkley and Mount both benefit playing further up field.

I firmly believe if Jorginho had moved to City like expected last season everybody would have been full of praise for him and us fans would have been moaning why we couldn't snap him up with Sarri joining as manager. We're lucky to have some serious talent in our ranks in midfield and lots of different skill-sets which should mesh well. The area of the pitch I'm least concerned with next season (unless they all get injured and we're left playing Bakayoko and Drinkwater together).

TBH, I don't think Sarri helped matters last season. He absolved Jorginho of any blame, poor performances etc and threw others under the bus instead. Jorginho might not be close to Sarri but Sarri's comments certainly reeked of favoritism. 

[OneMoSalah 8,614]

1 hour ago, Jason said:

TBH, I don't think Sarri helped matters last season. He absolved Jorginho of any blame, poor performances etc and threw others under the bus instead. Jorginho might not be close to Sarri but Sarri's comments certainly reeked of favoritism. 

Still regardless, there were individuals who were continuously coming for him for no other reason at times, which when your evaluating a player or criticising a player for nothing to do with his on the field performances, is really pathetic. Even when he wasn't performing good because he was Sarri's "favourite" or someone who people would see as the main figure head of that Sarri ball etc he was being criticised when there were players who played a lot worse or turned it on and off when they wanted. I am sure the fans boo'd him at a few of the games too. In my eyes, nobody else was held to the same sort of circumstances or standards last season, which if your going to judge 1 player that way, you'd may as well judge them all that way or not at all. I think everyone seen towards the end of the season that there is definitely a player there and I must admit I am excited to see how he does under Lampard.

[Superblue 6,331]

2 hours ago, Jason said:

TBH, I don't think Sarri helped matters last season. He absolved Jorginho of any blame, poor performances etc and threw others under the bus instead. Jorginho might not be close to Sarri but Sarri's comments certainly reeked of favoritism. 

Sarri definitely didn't help matters but the media were largely at fault. So many journalists and more worryingly 'pundits' (and I use that term extremely loosely) moaned about Chelsea not playing Kante in Jorginho's position and it became an extra vehicle with which fans could vent their anger at Sarri.

Kante wouldn't have worked in that position last season under Sarri, it would not have played to his strengths but most of the British pundits are so brutally archaic and simple in their analysis that they just assume Kante is the best player to play deep because he's the best midfielder at the club at doing the defensive work. 

I'm not sure whether 4-2-3-1 is Lampard's preferred formation but instead of having a rigid idea of formation and style he wants to impose on the team, it appears he has observed what he has at his disposal and is looking for a way to play to the strengths of the majority involved which is highly promising.