Sarri But Not Sarri Thread

[Fernando 6,376]

4 hours ago, Jason said:

Is that more of hope than anything else? You've gone from backing Sarri to wanting him out to now backing him again.  

Sarri has shown nothing this season to suggest that he deserves to stay on for a second season (can't be bothered to mention the reasons again). Having a full pre-season with the first team would help but really, that is just a convenient excuse. Was that getting thrown around when we had that unbeaten run up till November? How often do you see people throw around this pre-season excuse when things go wrong? Half of the pre-season is usually spent travelling around and managers don't often get to train the players properly anyway. If you want proper full time, get knocked out of Europe and the cup competitions early!

Speaking of Europe and cup competitions, I really don't get why you brought that up as some sort of distractions. We as a club want to be as successful as possible, want to win as many trophies as possible and now you're lamenting the fact that we have had to play so many games? 

Sarri did have an OKAY record in the big away games with Napoli but playing away at Man City, Man United, Liverpool, Arsenal, Tottenham is completely different than going to Juventus, Inter, Milan, Roma etc. 

I don't get what's the point of giving Sarri until October (or whatever month) just to see whether we are improving or going backwards when nothing this season has suggested that things will get better under him. It'll be worse if that transfer ban sticks, he can't buy his own players and he's stuck with the same set of players that he can't get the best out of. Also let's say if we sack Sarri in October, new manager comes in and does not do well immediately, then are you going to use the pre-season as an excuse again? If we're to sack Sarri, we're better off just doing it after the season and give the new manager proper time for squad planning, pre-season training etc rather than waste more time with Sarri and whatever uncertainty that will follow with him. Otherwise, we'll just become like Arsenal - stick with a manager who we all know isn't going to work and basically just left praying that things will come good. 

I wanted him gone after he was not playing youth and still playing crap. 

Now he's playing youth, and I'm okay with everything now. 

I always wanted a manager to play youth. No one has done what Sarri is doing for RLC. And if CHO stays I'm sure he will get better and more opportunity next season. 

Andreas....I don't know I'm not sold on him. I much rather get Ake back and have him then Andreas. Andreas for some reason I don't know does not fill me with confidence. But we shall see what happens to him next season. 

[Jase 43,479]

15 minutes ago, Tomo said:

 

Means F all if Sarri is gonna stick around. 

[OneMoSalah 8,614]

1 minute ago, Jason said:

Means F all if Sarri is gonna stick around. 

I get your not keen on Sarri but who is gonna replace him?

And realistically speaking because we arent going to appoint Joachim Low, Didier Deschamps or whatever other fantasy international coach some people think we could going off this forum at times and we have no chance for the likes of a Pochettino, Max Allegri or even a guy like Julian Naglesmann who is going Leipzig.

Laurent Blanc? Roberto Martinez? David Moyes? Eddie Howe? Javi Gracia? Nuno? 

Id rather Sarri got a second season that any of those. Lets be honest, changing manager is a bad idea, we changed Conte for Sarri, which was probably a very bad move looking at the level of coaches they are in comparison but still poor recruitment, bad results and whatever fuckd his 2nd year here. People couldnt stand Mourinhos last season, couldnt stand Contes last and now cant stand Sarri in his first....

[Jase 43,479]

13 minutes ago, OneMoSalah said:

I get your not keen on Sarri but who is gonna replace him?

And realistically speaking because we arent going to appoint Joachim Low, Didier Deschamps or whatever other fantasy international coach some people think we could going off this forum at times and we have no chance for the likes of a Pochettino, Max Allegri or even a guy like Julian Naglesmann who is going Leipzig.

Laurent Blanc? Roberto Martinez? David Moyes? Eddie Howe? Javi Gracia? Nuno?

Nuno. Hasenhuttl. Hell, might not even hurt to just hire an upcoming manager like Lampard since we've hired successful managers and somewhat less managers but are philosophers and gotten nowhere with both.

16 minutes ago, OneMoSalah said:

Id rather Sarri got a second season that any of those. Lets be honest, changing manager is a bad idea, we changed Conte for Sarri, which was probably a very bad move looking at the level of coaches they are in comparison but still poor recruitment, bad results and whatever fuckd his 2nd year here. People couldnt stand Mourinhos last season, couldnt stand Contes last and now cant stand Sarri in his first....

Changing manager isn't great but sticking with Sarri isn't great either based on what we've seen this season. I would be willing to see Sarri stay if there has been progression, a promise that things will get better next season. But nope. We've been going from one disaster to another or if not, looking like idiots out there and Sarri has shown himself to be clueless in different things.

[MoroccanBlue 5,199]

14 minutes ago, Jason said:

Nuno. Hasenhuttl. Hell, might not even hurt to just hire an upcoming manager like Lampard since we've hired successful managers and somewhat less managers but are philosophers and gotten nowhere with both.

Changing manager isn't great but sticking with Sarri isn't great either based on what we've seen this season. I would be willing to see Sarri stay if there has been progression, a promise that things will get better next season. But nope. We've been going from one disaster to another or if not, looking like idiots out there and Sarri has shown himself to be clueless in different things.

The same Nuno who's football can't break down sides that sit back or Hasenhuttl who's never managed a top side nor won any trophy in his life? Two traits you have absolutely murdered Sarri on. You expect us to take you seriously?  I pray Lampard stays well clear from managing us and ruin his legacy given how impatient our 'fans' are. 

Face it. There isn't a better manager out there than Sarri let alone checks off all the boxes our fans want in a manager. 

[Jase 43,479]

23 minutes ago, MoroccanBlue said:

The same Nuno who's football can't break down sides that sit back or Hasenhuttl who's never managed a top side nor won any trophy in his life? Two traits you have absolutely murdered Sarri on. You expect us to take you seriously?  I pray Lampard stays well clear from managing us and ruin his legacy given how impatient our 'fans' are. 

Please, do share where exactly have I criticized Sarri for his failure to break down defensive sides or the fact that he's never won trophies in his career.  Could care less about managers winning trophies when the most important thing is showing progression and improvement with the team. 

23 minutes ago, MoroccanBlue said:

Face it. There isn't a better manager out there than Sarri let alone checks off all the boxes our fans want in a manager. 

I think it says a lot about Sarribots that their best argument on why the club should keep him is by countering any opposing argument. No proper reasons, convincing points as to why we should keep Sarri, nothing based on what Sarri has done at the club. No wonder people hardly take those idiotic Sarribots seriously... 

[Antonio8 736]

8 minutes ago, Jason said:

Please, do share where exactly have I criticized Sarri for his failure to break down defensive sides or the fact that he's never won trophies in his career.  Could care less about managers win trophies when the most important thing is showing progression and improvement with the team. 

that's true, i.e. both di matteo and conte won trophies, but with no great progress in the squad and the board fired them both 

[MoroccanBlue 5,199]

8 minutes ago, Jason said:

Please, do share where exactly have I criticized Sarri for his failure to break down defensive sides or the fact that he's never won trophies in his career.  Could care less about managers win trophies when the most important thing is showing progression and improvement with the team. 

I think it says a lot about Sarribots that their best argument on why the club should keep him is by countering any opposing argument. No proper reasons, convincing points as to why we should keep Sarri, nothing based on what Sarri has done at the club. No wonder people hardly take those idiotic Sarribots seriously... 

Behave. You honestly think my reaction towards you has nothing to do with your constant moaning of Sarri's football? Fair play you aren't using the never won trophies argument, however if you do a mere member content search with the word 'Sarri', there is all the evidence you need.

You've continuously complained how is brand of football is boring and does nothing in the final third, yet you want a manager like Nuno who is notoriously known for setting up his teams in a conservative manner. So much so that when he faces teams who set up the same way, he struggles. Again, how do you expect us to take you seriously? 

The Sarri Out brigade want him gone but offer no real solutions. 

 

[Jase 43,479]

13 minutes ago, MoroccanBlue said:

Behave. You honestly think my reaction towards you has nothing to do with your constant moaning of Sarri's football? Fair play you aren't using the never won trophies argument, however if you do a mere member content search with the word 'Sarri', there is all the evidence you need.

Scary...

13 minutes ago, MoroccanBlue said:

You've continuously complained how is brand of football is boring and does nothing in the final third, yet you want a manager like Nuno who is notoriously known for setting up his teams in a conservative manner. So much so that when he faces teams who set up the same way, he struggles.

Think that's something subjective rather than objective. And speaking of conservative, it would be nice to have a manager who knows how/when to be conservative rather than just go play an open game and get slapped 4-0, 6-0 or suffer one humiliating defeat after another. 

20 minutes ago, MoroccanBlue said:

The Sarri Out brigade want him gone but offer no real solutions.

At least the 'Sarri Out' brigade look at solutions. The Sarribots only counter arguments and offer no convincing arguments as to why we should keep him.

[MoroccanBlue 5,199]

28 minutes ago, Jason said:

Scary...

Think that's something subjective rather than objective. And speaking of conservative,

Subjective? They have 24 points out of a possible 57 against teams in the bottom half? Nuno has a specific style in his football, and It's blatantly obvious it struggles against opponents who sit back. Something you heavily criticised Sarri's football on, yet you want Nuno as a manager? Make total sense. 

28 minutes ago, Jason said:

, it would be nice to have a manager who knows how/when to be conservative rather than just go play an open game and get slapped 4-0, 6-0 or suffer one humiliating defeat after another. 

So you would rather the Conte approach? Absolute cowardice football instead of going at it?

Hmm, different tune here. 

 

28 minutes ago, Jason said:

At least the 'Sarri Out' brigade look at solutions. The Sarribots only counter arguments and offer no convincing arguments as to why we should keep him.

The Sarri Out brigade offer nothing but fallacy after fallacy after fallacy, as you have just beautifully done. Inconsistencies everywhere. 

You want something done but offer no real solutions. 

 

[Antonio8 736]

42 minutes ago, MoroccanBlue said:

So you would rather the Conte approach? Absolute cowardice football instead of going at it?

Conte approach was not "cowardice football" he simply adapted himself to the players' characteristics, that are to score in counter attack or throught long ball to number 9

sarri is trying to build game, with possession football, but

1) he lacks two wingers able to go without the ball (like sterling and sane are for example).  hazard is too in love with the ball, and willian or pedro or CHO are not so costant in their performances 

2) he lacks two FB able to play both offensive and defensive phase (alonso able only in the offensive one, azpi only in the defensive one) 

3)  the midfield with RLC kante and jorginho is ok, but there are no adequate changes on the bench 

4) he is obliged to play with david luiz as CB (with only chris on the bench) 

 

[Fernando 6,376]

3 minutes ago, Mana said:

Yep, we sure played 'cowardice football' when we won the title.

That's not what you said in the second season when we had to suffer without the ball against City....

[Jase 43,479]

1 hour ago, MoroccanBlue said:

Subjective? They have 24 points out of a possible 57 against teams in the bottom half? Nuno has a specific style in his football, and It's blatantly obvious it struggles against opponents who sit back. Something you heavily criticised Sarri's football on, yet you want Nuno as a manager? Make total sense. 

 

1 hour ago, MoroccanBlue said:

So you would rather the Conte approach? Absolute cowardice football instead of going at it?

Hmm, different tune here. 

Great job in generalizing Conte's overall approach based on one criticism on a particular match...

The point is finding a middle ground, a good balance between being defensive and offensive. Conte, for that City game at least, took it to the extreme on the defensive side of things while Sarri, more often than not, takes too much to the opposite side. That's why we're never solid defensively under Sarri and there's always a looseness about us, there's always a feeling that we will concede. 

And for the record, while I did criticize Conte's football at times last season, I was never overly dissatisfied with it as much as I am now. Conte's style was generally fine and he was doing fine up until he decided to embark on his moan-fest and make everything terrible. His style certainly wasn't the main reason people wanted Conte gone.

[OneMoSalah 8,614]

2 hours ago, Jason said:

Nuno. Hasenhuttl. Hell, might not even hurt to just hire an upcoming manager like Lampard since we've hired successful managers and somewhat less managers but are philosophers and gotten nowhere with both.

Changing manager isn't great but sticking with Sarri isn't great either based on what we've seen this season. I would be willing to see Sarri stay if there has been progression, a promise that things will get better next season. But nope. We've been going from one disaster to another or if not, looking like idiots out there and Sarri has shown himself to be clueless in different things.

Nuno and Hasenhuttle. I think they would be an ever bigger risk than Sarri was. Decent up and coming managers in terms of building their reputations in England but I think with the incredible demand and pressures here theyd be out of their league. I do have high hopes for Hasenhuttle though, even at Leipzig he showed promise but in my eyes, he needs to do another full season in the PL and take Southampton to the sort of level Pochettino did, with a very exciting team, bringing so many players on to a better level. Poch led them to 8th , highest PL finish theyve ever had and had managed to get I dont know how many players in the England set up (Shaw, Lallana, Clyne, Jay Rodriguez, Lambert) and even now theirs a stat that he has worked with 15 of the last 30 players to make their England debut in the last however long. Hassenhuttl has got a bit to prove over here still, hes doing well but I still think Marco Silva should be the reminder that a decent half a season doesnt mean anything or thst you can cut it at a higher level.

Regarding Sarri I hope has discovered this season that managing Napoli and Chelsea are two completely different things too so I would expect next season to be better, for him to be more demanding and get a better, consistent season than what we had this one.

Lampard isnt anywhere near ready for us yet, he still needs time to build his reputation and Derby are one of those clubs youve no idea what they will do regarding their managers, I mean they sacked Paul Clement who had them 2nd a couple of seasons ago and have had a lot of different managers in recent times. Ex players dont always make hugely successful coaches, even regarding Zola as an assistant here, before he was an assistant his coaching career is hardly that good. So Frank definitely still needs time to build his coaching reputation and gain experience. He has the right personality from being a top player but I would say he still has to forge himself a reputation from doing it at the likes of a Derby and then kick on from there and go to the PL in some capacity.

Did you think this season would have gone smoothly when he was appointed in the summer? I think it was always going to be a huge ask for him to come in, make an instant change and get everything working so well. Regardless of how superior Klopp and Pep are to Sarri, they did not have instant success in England like Conte or Pellegrini did in their first seasons because it is very rare that managers come in first season and win trophies in the PL these days because the money and calibre of top teams around is huge. No doubt, Klopp is a fantastic coach, was a big fan of watching his Dortmund teams but it has taken him huge amounts of time to get that team that good. They finished 8th the year he came in, 4th the next year and 4th last year. How many trophies? Have Liverpool really been that successful under him in the same way we were successful in the period of 10-15 years ago? Not even gonna speak about Pep his career speaks for itself despite whst people think of him he is up there.

We will finish 5th this year more than likely, have already been in a cup final and have the chance to be in another. As bad as our season seems, in terms of a reference point its probably decent enough for Sarri, someone who has never won anything, had to change formations, a way of playing, deal with a squad that lacks in areas compared to City, United, Arsenal, Spurs, Liverpool.

With this pending transfer ban, it makes next season difficult but I think another season, proper full pre season this time (maybe not a huge problem but there was a lot of uncertainty this summer with the whole Conte situation) I have plenty of optimism that next sesson will be different. Also I think we will see more of Ruben, Callum, hopefully Reece James will also get a chance. Its not much to go off but who knows next season could be very different, I think Klopp and Pep even adjusted their ways slightly after their first year in the PL. Sarri as stubborn as he is maybe he will too a bit, because as you and many have said before it can be infuriating but I think he has to stick to his guns and go with his gut to implement his identity on the team before making any tweaks. I wouldn't even say we are playing anything like his Napoli side did in his second or third season, so theres still massive potential if we can get to that level.

Anyway. Signings are needed regardless of whoever the manager is. Ban or no ban, 4 or 5 good players would make a huge difference.

[Jase 43,479]

Just now, OneMoSalah said:

Did you think this season would have gone smoothly when he was appointed in the summer? I think it was always going to be a huge ask for him to come in, make an instant change and get everything working so well. Regardless of how superior Klopp and Pep are to Sarri, they did not have instant success in England like Conte or Pellegrini did in their first seasons because it is very rare that managers come in first season and win trophies in the PL these days because the money and calibre of top teams around is huge. No doubt, Klopp is a fantastic coach, was a big fan of watching his Dortmund teams but it has taken him huge amounts of time to get that team that good. They finished 8th the year he came in, 4th the next year and 4th last year. How many trophies? Have Liverpool really been that successful under him in the same way we were successful in the period of 10-15 years ago? Not even gonna speak about Pep his career speaks for itself despite whst people think of him he is up there.

No, I didn't expect the season to be smooth sailing but I don't think there is anything wrong with expecting some form of progression or improvement under Sarri. With Pep, with Klopp in their first season, you could see what they were trying to do, you could see they were willing to adapt, make tactical tweaks etc but with Sarri, it's been very messy and it's hard to say that 'yes, things will get better' with all the BS-ness he's pulled off this season. And this is what I keep coming back to when people say Sarri should stay on for a second season. People either counter opposing arguments or in this case, use examples of other managers to justify sticking with Sarri. WHAT ABOUT WHAT HE'S DONE THIS SEASON? What has Sarri done this season to deserve a second season, especially after countless of embarrassments in 2019 alone?!

[Atomiswave 6,072]

To me its safe to say Sarii has been a disaster on every front. Name one good thing he has done? Sure the squad is not up to par, but its still decent enough to play much better. Tactically he is horrible, I always thought Italians were astute tacticians, he definitely aint. Too freaking stubborn.....his 2 love childs gone bad. A pre-season will not rid us of all this. A badly flawed motivator, yes every team needs a motivator, you are deluding yourself if you think its not needed. For all the good managers we have sacked for much much less this clueless board decides to stick with this one......our stock has fallen thanks to the board and only getting worse with Sarii.

[Atomiswave 6,072]

3 minutes ago, Jason said:

No, I didn't expect the season to be smooth sailing but I don't think there is anything wrong with expecting some form of progression or improvement under Sarri. With Pep, with Klopp in their first season, you could see what they were trying to do, you could see they were willing to adapt, make tactical tweaks etc but with Sarri, it's been very messy and it's hard to say that 'yes, things will get better' with all the BS-ness he's pulled off this season. And this is what I keep coming back to when people say Sarri should stay on for a second season. People either counter opposing arguments or in this case, use examples of other managers to justify sticking with Sarri. WHAT ABOUT WHAT HE'S DONE THIS SEASON? What has Sarri done this season to deserve a second season, especially after countless of embarrassments in 2019 alone?!

For sure.....those 2 have a track record, they have won before, you could see what they were doing, you could see progress, willing to mix it up and to change tactics, formations etc. Any supporter can right now tell you how will setup and play, what subs and when. He is like an open book.....pure delight for any manager we are playing against. If we somehow defeat Frankfurt, Emery will have us for dinner.

[Antonio8 736]

7 minutes ago, Jason said:

No, I didn't expect the season to be smooth sailing but I don't think there is anything wrong with expecting some form of progression or improvement under Sarri. With Pep, with Klopp in their first season, you could see what they were trying to do, you could see they were willing to adapt, make tactical tweaks etc but with Sarri, it's been very messy and it's hard to say that 'yes, things will get better' with all the BS-ness he's pulled off this season. And this is what I keep coming back to when people say Sarri should stay on for a second season. People either counter opposing arguments or in this case, use examples of other managers to justify sticking with Sarri. WHAT ABOUT WHAT HE'S DONE THIS SEASON? What has Sarri done this season to deserve a second season, especially after countless of embarrassments in 2019 alone?!

you have to wait the end of the season to answer that, maybe he will reach the targets maybe not