The Conte Thread

[The Skipper 20,593]

2 minutes ago, Spike said:

That's a lot of transfers.

Only 4?

[OhForAGreavsie 5,898]

Completely agree that an ambitious summer needs to be attempted, and attempted in exactly the positions @The Skipper suggests. Four top signings in one extremely competitive, and extremely expensive, window will take some doing however.

[Henrique 9,133]

On 10/03/2017 at 11:00 AM, Tautvix said:

I am just afraid that Conte may rest some players which would be a huge mistake to do. Just play our best team.

I don't think that will be a mistake, actually that will the right thing to do.

[Henrique 9,133]

5 hours ago, The Skipper said:

Only 4?

I'm glad you are not the one behind transfer market, because the team you created isn't any better than the current starting XI. lol

In my books Azpi should not be playing as a CB next season. He is doing great this season, but he is not a CB. Alonso is miles better than Moses, and I can see he becoming a better player in the future, while game after game I get more convinced that Moses is ultra limited.

I do agree we need someone else in attack and in the mid, but for CL football we should be looking more to an Arturo Vidal or Xabi Alonso kind of signing than getting a bunch of u23 from League 1. The current squad lacks European experience and is more likely to produce a PSG horror show than emulate the heroics of 11/12 season.

The core of this squad were part of the past 4 mediocre UCL seasons, and even Hazard is yet to produce a great performance in a big game in Europe, and the reason for that, imo, is the transfer policy after 2012, when it seems the club is only interest in getting u23 players.

[The Skipper 20,593]

4 hours ago, Henrique said:

I'm glad you are not the one behind transfer market, because the team you created isn't any better than the current starting XI. lol

In my books Azpi should not be playing as a CB next season. He is doing great this season, but he is not a CB. Alonso is miles better than Moses, and I can see he becoming a better player in the future, while game after game I get more convinced that Moses is ultra limited.

I do agree we need someone else in attack and in the mid, but for CL football we should be looking more to an Arturo Vidal or Xabi Alonso kind of signing than getting a bunch of u23 from League 1. The current squad lacks European experience and is more likely to produce a PSG horror show than emulate the heroics of 11/12 season.

The core of this squad were part of the past 4 mediocre UCL seasons, and even Hazard is yet to produce a great performance in a big game in Europe, and the reason for that, imo, is the transfer policy after 2012, when it seems the club is only interest in getting u23 players.

...Sorry Henrique, just sounds to me like you haven't heard or watched most of the players I mentioned so I can't take your post too seriously. Don't know how you could say that our current 11 is better than that 11 I posted up otherwise. These same players that top clubs like Utd, City, Barcelona, Bayern, PSG, Juve, Real etc. will be after next summer aren't good enough? Really?

[Henrique 9,133]

1 hour ago, The Skipper said:

...Sorry Henrique, just sounds to me like you haven't heard or watched most of the players I mentioned so I can't take your post too seriously. Don't know how you could say that our current 11 is better than that 11 I posted up otherwise. These same players that top clubs like Utd, City, Barcelona, Bayern, PSG, Juve, Real etc. will be after next summer aren't good enough? Really?

Top clubs like United and PSG...what do you mean? So, if United and PSG want Player X, so we should also want Player X, even if United is a Europa League side, and PSG is embarrassing at top level?

Its also very easy to understand why I said your starting XI is not any better than the current one: all the players you mentioned are U23 players, and this is NOT what this squad needs at moment, introducing FOUR U23 players into the starting team, and we are actually talking about a team that produced 4 mediocre UCL performances in past 4 seasons and was eliminated twice in a row by a not so special PSG team. 

The team you just posted is more likely to emulate the UCL record of the past seasons than "grow into a true European elite for the next 5 years".

Just take a look at the biggest european clubs of past 5 years: Bayern, Barcelona and Real. They all have one thing in common: they went after (or kind of) estabilished stars in top european leagues (Bale, Modric, Suarez, Robben, Lewan, Vidal), in top NT sides (Neymar), or players who had a great performance in a top tournament (James Rodriguez). To other side, all the players you pointed are young players from mid tier european leagues. Perhaps they will be great additions, but definetely not the kind of players you want if you are thinking about getting into a UCL elite.

We need more Diego Costas and less Batshuayis.

[OhForAGreavsie 5,898]

6 hours ago, Henrique said:

I don't think that will be a mistake, actually that will the right thing to do.

No, it would be a huge error. Huge.

We want to win this fantastic competition. Our club's outlook is to go for it on all fronts. Just four seasons ago we played 69 matches, almost all of them using a full strength XI. Loved it. Love my club for it. When I put my money into my club - that is how I want it spent; on players who will compete for everything, not on pathetic wimps who cry, "It's all too much for us we need a rest." If they need a rest from two games a week (which they are not actually playing), then they can sod off to Arsenal. If they need a rest from just one game a week (which is what they are playing) then they're not even worthy of a place in the Arsenal squad.

[DYC. 7,542]

To join the European elite within the next few years is a pipe dream. This team doesn't have that kind of quality. Doing a great job in the PL is fine and all but Europe is a different level and beast (especially when competing on multiple fronts). It would take world-class signings to get there.

Chelsea's star forwards can't fire the team to succes. Hazard possesses the ability of a superstar but lacks the personality. Costa has the personality but lacks the ability. It would take a great addition up top to get that CL powerhouse offence. There isn't a Robben, Ronaldo, Messi, Neymar, Suarez, Bale in this team. Sanchez is quality but a bit overrated in England for me. He's not a player who can fire a team to UCL glory. He's not that good. But he does possess enough ability and personality to possibly form a great trio with Hazard and Costa. If they were to gel and form a strong understanding together, they could be a problem in Europe. But it's definitely not a given.

But then you haven't even dealt with midfield and defence which is still lacking quality. For me, Alonso is good enough and doesn't need immediate strengthening. It's hard to find a player in that position who would be a straight upgrade. But Matic and Moses would need replacing. Moses is solid and Matic is good but you need very good players, not necessarily world-class, in those positions lacking any major flaws.

Replacing Cahill would be ideal as well but not as crucial as upgrading midfield. I'd prefer intergrating Christensen in defence. And while Azpi has done a great job in the back this season, it remains to be seen how he'll perform in the coming seasons. It's not uncommon for a player to excel one season in a new position only to see his level drop in the next season.

If that doesn't happen, we'll have to wait as a team is being built in the coming years.

[BlueLyon 9,359]

12 hours ago, The Skipper said:

We have an amazing opportunity to grow into a true European elite for the next 5 years if we get our signings right this summer. Conte has been a magnificent appointment, and I genuinely can't wait to see what he can do when he has better players in the side. It's truly incredible how he's managed to guide the team 10 points clear. Absolute winner. He's managed to do so whilst sort of integrating some of the academy guys as squad players as well. At managerial level we're truly set with one of the best. Now it's time to give him the right players.

In my opinion, we need to upgrade on 4 positions next summer. CM, LWB, RWB, RF. So essentially an upgrade on Matic/Fabregas, Alonso, Moses and Pedro. We do this successfully and we're set.

Realistically, there are a few options for us this summer. There seems to be a mix of top players and up and coming superstars available next summer from particular leagues and teams that I feel we should raid. Specifically the French league which is bursting full of talent right now.

At CM, I would look into getting Kante a partner that is a lot more complete defensively and offensively. I would rather them be more inclined towards the latter though due to Kante's defensive ability in midfield. The players I have in mind that are possibly attainable are Tolisso, Naby Keita and maybe Bakayoko. Maybe a cheeky bid for Renato Sanches who hasn't settled at Bayern at all? The pipe dream would be Verratti though.

At WB, Alonso and Moses have done very well this season as a couple but they aren't good enough if we want to be a top European side. Of course, they stay and provide crucial squad depth (which we severely lack in the position). I would look at getting in Semedo from Benfica the most, he is a top top full back. Maybe look at other options like Aurier? Cancelo? On the left, again there aren't that many exciting players available but I heard we're interested in Lemar, who plays LM at Monaco. Maybe could be converted into a LWB, would be a very interesting option. We can also possibly take a plunge on one of the best young English talents to come through recently, Ryan Sessegnon, who at 16 would need a few years to bed in but he is doing very well at Fulham at the moment and starts regularly now. Maybe Grimaldo from Benfica is an option too.

RF is where it gets fun. We have loads of options here, there are many young talents or even superstars available that we could get. Pedro is doing a magnificent job this season, close to being CPOTY for me. However, he is 31 later this year and we need to invest into that position for the future. If we could manage to steal Alexis, that would be fantastic. Bernardo Silva would be excellent too. Then you have someone like Mbappe which would be a ridiculous statement. Maybe make a huge offer for Ousmane Dembele. The sort of player we need to have there needs to have the 'Pedro profile' if anything in my opinion. You can even look at possibly getting in strikers like Lacazette or Aubameyang who could perform really well in that Pedro role, Anelka style. So someone with a goal scorers mentality when in the box and good off the ball movement.

That potentially gives us a team of:

Courtois

Azpi Luiz Christensen

Semedo Kante Tolisso Grimaldo

Mbappe Costa Hazard

That above is a truly exciting side, and should be pretty achievable next season in my opinion. Hopefully we can make even bigger signings though, you never know. The squad depth would be ridiculous as well with guys like Fabregas, Pedro, Willian, Moses, Ake etc. to call on.

Good times ahead hopefully, as long as the board and Conte don't mess up the summer transfer window. We need to spend big, because our competitors will. City and United, and Arsenal and Liverpool potentially too. The PL is going to be exciting next season. This is highly optimistic and idealistic but don't see why we can't be. We'll be champions with a lot of cash to spend.

Completely agree bar on few things; 

1.) Christensen replacing Cahill is a no go. Cahill is decently tall, powerful, scores some goals and we need him to defend corners. We already have problems in air, which Christensen will only make worse. Christensen is brilliant young CB, but not physical enough for the prem. Certainly shouldnt be starter next year, unless we would play two tall CBs next to him. To me he is still just a different version to Stones. Great on the ball, but he has that feel of uncertainity, I prefer athletic defenders over this kind Christensen, Stones or even Thiago Silva for that matter.

2.) The players you talk are way too young. Its good we build for future, but we need balance. For that CM, I would definately pick experienced midfielder like Vidal, Nainggolan, Marchisio etc. Semedo is brilliant, however for LWB I would target either Alex Sandro or Guerreiro if the former cant be bought. RW, there are plenty of options. Sanchez (althrough Im not realy convinced by him) sounds most ideal as he can provide goals, workrate, experience and european/pl proven. 

3.) 4 top players are absolute stretch. First, I dont believe we can make successful transition by bringing 4 new players at same time. IMO 3 is the max. Also, its just hard to believe we would actualy get 4 top players in just 2 months because its harder than it seems. 

For me experienced midfielder is absolute priority. Getting someone in mould of Cesc/Matic or Vidal would give us more dynamic and control. Then we should target RWB for two reasons; Moses needs backup/competition and Semedo seems absolutely perfect for that. LWB only if before mentioned players are available, if not I would not pay big amounts on short fixes. 

RW is the same. If we get someone new, either Pedro or Willian will possibly have to depart, which is harder said than done since both are still quite important here. So we should only get RW if there will be someone of great quality.

On other hand we probably need to get AM anyway since we sold Oscar, and we lack depth. I would seriously consider giving Baker some role next year and send RLC out on loan.

[The Skipper 20,593]

3 hours ago, Henrique said:

Top clubs like United and PSG...what do you mean? So, if United and PSG want Player X, so we should also want Player X, even if United is a Europa League side, and PSG is embarrassing at top level?

Its also very easy to understand why I said your starting XI is not any better than the current one: all the players you mentioned are U23 players, and this is NOT what this squad needs at moment, introducing FOUR U23 players into the starting team, and we are actually talking about a team that produced 4 mediocre UCL performances in past 4 seasons and was eliminated twice in a row by a not so special PSG team. 

The team you just posted is more likely to emulate the UCL record of the past seasons than "grow into a true European elite for the next 5 years".

Just take a look at the biggest european clubs of past 5 years: Bayern, Barcelona and Real. They all have one thing in common: they went after (or kind of) estabilished stars in top european leagues (Bale, Modric, Suarez, Robben, Lewan, Vidal), in top NT sides (Neymar), or players who had a great performance in a top tournament (James Rodriguez). To other side, all the players you pointed are young players from mid tier european leagues. Perhaps they will be great additions, but definetely not the kind of players you want if you are thinking about getting into a UCL elite.

We need more Diego Costas and less Batshuayis.

I'm not disputing any of what you said. You obviously didn't read my initial post well enough because those are the players I said we should target first. If they aren't attainable we can go for young superstars. I mentioned players like Alexis, Aubameyang, Verratti, Bernardo Silva. I just didn't do an XI with them because they are players that won't be as easily attainable. It's way more unrealistic to think we can definitely get Alexis and Verratti in for certain. The XI wasn't the most important part of what I was trying to get at.

I mentioned United and PSG because they'll more than likely be in the same position as us next transfer window, possibly fighting for the same players.

If I put this XI instead:

Courtois
Azpi Luiz Christensen
Semedo Kante Verratti A.Sandro
Alexis Costa Hazard

Would you be happier? Yes. It's a lot more unrealistic though.

[The Skipper 20,593]

1 hour ago, BlueLyon said:

Completely agree bar on few things; 

1.) Christensen replacing Cahill is a no go. Cahill is decently tall, powerful, scores some goals and we need him to defend corners. We already have problems in air, which Christensen will only make worse. Christensen is brilliant young CB, but not physical enough for the prem. Certainly shouldnt be starter next year, unless we would play two tall CBs next to him. To me he is still just a different version to Stones. Great on the ball, but he has that feel of uncertainity, I prefer athletic defenders over this kind Christensen, Stones or even Thiago Silva for that matter.

2.) The players you talk are way too young. Its good we build for future, but we need balance. For that CM, I would definately pick experienced midfielder like Vidal, Nainggolan, Marchisio etc. Semedo is brilliant, however for LWB I would target either Alex Sandro or Guerreiro if the former cant be bought. RW, there are plenty of options. Sanchez (althrough Im not realy convinced by him) sounds most ideal as he can provide goals, workrate, experience and european/pl proven. 

3.) 4 top players are absolute stretch. First, I dont believe we can make successful transition by bringing 4 new players at same time. IMO 3 is the max. Also, its just hard to believe we would actualy get 4 top players in just 2 months because its harder than it seems. 

For me experienced midfielder is absolute priority. Getting someone in mould of Cesc/Matic or Vidal would give us more dynamic and control. Then we should target RWB for two reasons; Moses needs backup/competition and Semedo seems absolutely perfect for that. LWB only if before mentioned players are available, if not I would not pay big amounts on short fixes. 

RW is the same. If we get someone new, either Pedro or Willian will possibly have to depart, which is harder said than done since both are still quite important here. So we should only get RW if there will be someone of great quality.

On other hand we probably need to get AM anyway since we sold Oscar, and we lack depth. I would seriously consider giving Baker some role next year and send RLC out on loan.

Thanks for the post. 

1. That is a valid concern indeed, and is why we need someone like Zouma to step up. I don't think we'll sell Cahill either. The centre back group is the least of our worries though, it's something we can work with. There aren't many amazing CBs out there worth spending money on that significantly improves that group. I wanted Christensen to start because he's our most talented young centre back. He does need to work on his strength big time though. We bed him in slowly next season, rotating him with Zouma and Cahill.

2 & 3. I spoke about younger players because more senior players have been discussed to death. Just wanted to show that there is a lot of elite young talent available at the moment. Ideally, I would get maybe 2 young stars and 2 more established stars. So something like Sanchez, Verratti, Alex Sandro, Semedo would be amazing for example. It's unlikely however that our window can be so perfect when there are a lot of other clubs looking to spend this season, hence why, again, I decided to perhaps pick out some younger players who'd be easier attainable.

I feel like the squad is a lot more experienced than before. We have Fabregas, Luiz, Costa, Courtois, Hazard, Pedro, Cahill who are all experienced and established players. Baker is a good shout for squad depth, for sure.

[Spike 12,049]

15 hours ago, The Skipper said:

Only 4?

In what way is four major changes to the starting XI not a lot?

[The Skipper 20,593]

28 minutes ago, Spike said:

In what way is four major changes to the starting XI not a lot?

It's necessary. United did it this season with Bailly, Mkhitaryan, Zlatan and Pogba. It's more than doable.

[Blue Colored Sky 1,807]

3 hours ago, The Skipper said:

Thanks for the post. 

1. That is a valid concern indeed, and is why we need someone like Zouma to step up. I don't think we'll sell Cahill either. The centre back group is the least of our worries though, it's something we can work with. There aren't many amazing CBs out there worth spending money on that significantly improves that group. I wanted Christensen to start because he's our most talented young centre back. He does need to work on his strength big time though. We bed him in slowly next season, rotating him with Zouma and Cahill.

2 & 3. I spoke about younger players because more senior players have been discussed to death. Just wanted to show that there is a lot of elite young talent available at the moment. Ideally, I would get maybe 2 young stars and 2 more established stars. So something like Sanchez, Verratti, Alex Sandro, Semedo would be amazing for example. It's unlikely however that our window can be so perfect when there are a lot of other clubs looking to spend this season, hence why, again, I decided to perhaps pick out some younger players who'd be easier attainable.

I feel like the squad is a lot more experienced than before. We have Fabregas, Luiz, Costa, Courtois, Hazard, Pedro, Cahill who are all experienced and established players. Baker is a good shout for squad depth, for sure.

Do you see that Chelsea are mostly linked with centre-backs since Conte arrived? I just don't see Chelsea not signing established CB. We have 3 starting CBs with average age of 29 and then there's presumably Zouma, Ake and Christensen with average age of 21. That's big gap and with JT departing I see Chelsea going after experienced player. For me it's further down the line of list of priorities but trying to predict I see centre-back arriving ahead of any other position. I think that Ake will be sold though it can be Zouma depending on home-growns in the squad. 

Also it's so hard to predict and put up the summer transfer window when all of Courtois, Fabregas, Hazard and Diego Costa can leave. Or none. 

[Milan 17,859]

£200m to keep Conte at Chelsea

http://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/sport/200m-to-keep-conte-at-chelsea-3t9slj388

[Namika 922]

Sanchez, Mendy and Bakayoko would be an amazing summer.

[Namika 922]

.

Edited March 12, 2017 by Namika
Wrong thread

[Spike 12,049]

4 hours ago, The Skipper said:

It's necessary. United did it this season with Bailly, Mkhitaryan, Zlatan and Pogba. It's more than doable.

Not exactly a great example...