The Mourinho Thread

[standup 28]

Welcome to the overreaction thread. What happened to loyalty? Pre-Abramovich we were never a win every game team, you never knew what you were going to get. If we get two decent results in the London derbies people will forger Everton. Still a team in transition.

Totally agree mate. We'll play worse than that this season and win! Do some people on here want us to sack Jose?

[kellzfresh 7,229]

I think the supposed "attractive game" is over-rated. Arsenal back in 2009 and Barcelona for me aren't even pleasing on the eye to me, i think passing the ball around in traingles isn't that good to watch and personally i love watching teams who will force opponents into submission (Chelsea 2005-2010, Madrid).

I hate this perception of good football, there's a lot more ways of good football than just tika taka.

Exactly. Look at dortmund and mourinho's 2011/2012 laliga winning madrid

Those are the perfect teams i love.

no passing around till i sleep bullshit but quick tempo and high rate counter attacking football.

I have fallen in love with dortmunds style of play, theyre fantastic. Their possession overalll average is not more than 59% but they are so entertaining with their counter attacking football and wingers who can score and pass too.

[Kojo 4,676]

In all fairness only one person has said something and he looks like an obvious troll, the only ones overreacting are yourselves.

[Tomo 21,733]

I disagree. The first two years of Barcelona under Guardiola was a beauty. I agree there is more way of good football than tiki taka but for me except Inter who was a super display of defensive intelligence, I'm not a great fan of Mourinho's brand of football.

I prefer pro-active football than reactive football, And I like triangle passing, pattern of runs, methodical build-up to create space as it needs a lot of work to perfect the spacing, the timing of the runs to mess the opposition defense..

They were back in the first two years yeah, but as their reliance on Messi goes up, the less good they are to watch, imo.

I don't have a problem with teams that want to play that way, if they like tika taka then that way should be respected, what annoy's me is when those teams look their noses down at teams that don't play the same way or similar. Like for example, the way Arsenal fans use to look their noses down at Stoke.

[sutro 1,026]

I wonder if he's the manager this squad needs?

I dont doubt mourinho as a coach, he's one of the best out there but i do wonder if he fits our squad?

With the likes of mata/ hazard, they both seems lost on the pitch with annoys me to be fair

We bought players over the past seasons for attractive attacking football, thats not realy he's style isnt it?

[CHOULO19 24,332]

I think part of the issue here is that the expectations from Jose are just too high. I'm not making excuses for him, believe me I have my criticism of him for some of the choices he's made so far, but I just think that his return was so emotional and it was built up so much by everyone that some expecting Jose to be able to instantly turn water (a group of young talented players with great potential) into wine (a cohesive team with players performing at their best).

[sutro 1,026]

I think part of the issue here is that the expectations from Jose are just too high. I'm not making excuses for him, believe me I have my criticism of him for some of the choices he's made so far, but I just think that his return was so emotional and it was built up so much by everyone that some expecting Jose to be able to instantly turn water (a group of young talented players with great potential) into wine (a cohesive team with players performing at their best).

Question is, are the expectations to high? With a coach like mourinho and our current squad?

We have squad most teams would kill for if you ask me

[Tomo 21,733]

I think part of the issue here is that the expectations from Jose are just too high. I'm not making excuses for him, believe me I have my criticism of him for some of the choices he's made so far, but I just think that his return was so emotional and it was built up so much by everyone that some expecting Jose to be able to instantly turn water (a group of young talented players with great potential) into wine (a cohesive team with players performing at their best).

We have some young players, but we aren't actually that young a squad. The average age of the team's we have put out this season is 28.

[ZanSnake 1,211]

I think part of the issue here is that the expectations from Jose are just too high. I'm not making excuses for him, believe me I have my criticism of him for some of the choices he's made so far, but I just think that his return was so emotional and it was built up so much by everyone that some expecting Jose to be able to instantly turn water (a group of young talented players with great potential) into wine (a cohesive team with players performing at their best).

Summed it up perfectly!

Making thoughts with emotion and fantasist rather then logic and realism. This squad will challenge for the title, but if we do win it, we won via a demolition like we did during Jose's second season. We will loose some, and draw some, but with each game i think the squad and Jose will learn from each result, good or bad, to strengthen the side more mentally, knowing the kind of competition that we are facing and being able to adapt with that. Will be interesting for the Man City game and the Arsenal games, the kind of approach that Jose will use will be different to Carlo, Di Matteo, etc. and that is something we will have to get use to.

[CHOULO19 24,332]

Question is, are the expectations to high? With a coach like mourinho and our current squad?

We have squad most teams would kill for if you ask me

As they should, because this squad would compete for tittles for 5-6 seasons to come with little changes needed and will only get better as time passes. But this squad is nothing like Bayern for example who have a group of players all at their peak giving the performances of their lives. The same could be said about our squad in the 2004-5 season. Bayern probably have 2 more seasons at this level before they will need to replace most of their key players atm.

We have some young players, but we aren't actually that young a squad. The average age of the team's we have put out this season is 28.

But who are the stars of the team? Around whom is the team built? Certainly not JT or Frank or Cole or even Cech but around the young attacking midfielders and at their ages you can't expect them to be consistently brilliant.

[Rubber bullets 1,183]

I think part of the issue here is that the expectations from Jose are just too high. I'm not making excuses for him, believe me I have my criticism of him for some of the choices he's made so far, but I just think that his return was so emotional and it was built up so much by everyone that some expecting Jose to be able to instantly turn water (a group of young talented players with great potential) into wine (a cohesive team with players performing at their best).

I have to disagree. In the last two years we have spent a massive amount of money, sure some players that we certainly did not need (Willian) and others that we did need but for whatever reason did not try and acquire (a central defender, a deep lying and a world class striker). But after the end of last season we seemed to have a team that could go to distance. With players like Mata, Hazard, Cesar, Ramires, David Luiz and Oscar all establishing themselves in the first 11 and have already help us win trophies (FA Cup, Champions league and Europa league) all the while developing an identity of what type of football we play. And throughout the summer Jose kept insisting that we would become a side that should be able to win the Premier league and obtain some sort of dominance from his usual cocky manner (the mocking of our Europa league title for instant). So I do think the high expectations that some people have can in some ways be justified (I certainly think that Jose has to win the Premier league this season to justify the hype and commotion he has caused.

However, judging from the first five games this season I do have serious concerns on what Jose is trying to do. Going back to the players in my previous paragraph and the identity that they were creating seems to be in complete conflict with Jose. As it seems that Jose only wants to go back to the football we played last time he was here, that being the score only 1 or 2 goals and try and play a defensive compact type of football based purely on counter attacks. Yet this type of football does not suit the squad we have, with many players preferring having the ball at their feet and playing a more attacking type of football. It even contradicts what Jose was trying to project during the summer of carrying on what we were doing last season while also using young talent. Yet so far the likes of Lampard and Terry have been a vocal point of the squad despite their age and the likes of Van Ginkel and De Bryune have not seen much playing type and Lukaku (who Jose kept bragging would play a huge part of our season) got shipped of on loan. While players like Mata and Cesar seem to have been put down the pecking order because they seem to not fit with the type of team Jose wants. Hence seeing situations like Ivanovic at right back even though he should only be playing in central defense and playing incredibly defensive football against the likes of Manchester United, even though they are have not really strengthened and don't have the influence of Ferguson, when its clear that this squad is not built for that.

While it is right to say that it still early in the season and that things do change. I do think we are seeing big contradictions between what our squad is built for and what Jose wants the squad to be.

[English Freak 456]

We have some young players, but we aren't actually that young a squad. The average age of the team's we have put out this season is 28.

The problem for us is that apart from Mata, all of our attacking midfielders are inexperienced and/or just getting used to the PL.

Hopefully once the players gel together, we'll see much better results.

[Tomo 21,733]

@Rubber bullets, Regarding the Terry and Lampard bit, JT has been playing regularly this season because he deserves too, he hasn't done that much, if anything wrong. Lampard should be playing less however.

[CHOULO19 24,332]

I have to disagree. In the last two years we have spent a massive amount of money, sure some players that we certainly did not need (Willian) and others that we did need but for whatever reason did not try and acquire (a central defender, a deep lying and a world class striker). But after the end of last season we seemed to have a team that could go to distance. With players like Mata, Hazard, Cesar, Ramires, David Luiz and Oscar all establishing themselves in the first 11 and have already help us win trophies (FA Cup, Champions league and Europa league) all the while developing an identity of what type of football we play. And throughout the summer Jose kept insisting that we would become a side that should be able to win the Premier league and obtain some sort of dominance from his usual cocky manner (the mocking of our Europa league title for instant). So I do think the high expectations that some people have can in some ways be justified (I certainly think that Jose has to win the Premier league this season to justify the hype and commotion he has caused.

However, judging from the first five games this season I do have serious concerns on what Jose is trying to do. Going back to the players in my previous paragraph and the identity that they were creating seems to be in complete conflict with Jose. As it seems that Jose only wants to go back to the football we played last time he was here, that being the score only 1 or 2 goals and try and play a defensive compact type of football based purely on counter attacks. Yet this type of football does not suit the squad we have, with many players preferring having the ball at their feet and playing a more attacking type of football. It even contradicts what Jose was trying to project during the summer of carrying on what we were doing last season while also using young talent. Yet so far the likes of Lampard and Terry have been a vocal point of the squad despite their age and the likes of Van Ginkel and De Bryune have not seen much playing type and Lukaku (who Jose kept bragging would play a huge part of our season) got shipped of on loan. While players like Mata and Cesar seem to have been put down the pecking order because they seem to not fit with the type of team Jose wants. Hence seeing situations like Ivanovic at right back even though he should only be playing in central defense and playing incredibly defensive football against the likes of Manchester United, even though they are have not really strengthened and don't have the influence of Ferguson, when its clear that this squad is not built for that.

While it is right to say that it still early in the season and that things do change. I do think we are seeing big contradictions between what our squad is built for and what Jose wants the squad to be.

I think you just proved my point with the bolded part

I don't think anyone doubts that our players are capable of putting in great performances just that they can do it with consistency with their current age and lack of experience. Even last year under rafa, we had some excellent performances, but we were never consistent. Yes we won the EL, but that's just the EL and we were expected to win it. None of the core players that you mentioned played any major part in the CL or FA cup wins. Add to that the fact they are being asked to play a whole different system than the one they had last season.

Btw, Jose never said that we will win the PL or dominate it. In fact it was always the contrary when he was asked about it. He always said that this squad is for the future and it's nothing like the squad that won the PL back to back in 2004. Like I've been saying, I expect us to challenge for the tittle but I will be (pleasantly) surprised if we actually win it. I think Jose feels the same way.

I think it's too early to judge Jose's system simply because I honestly don't think he knows what it is yet! We've played 5 games so far with four different styles, so no wonder that some players seem unsure what their role is. But Jose is a great manager, there's no doubt about that. He'll figure out the best system with the best combination but he will need time. Expecting instant success from any manager with the current squad is a bit naive if I'm honest.

[Rubber bullets 1,183]

I think you just proved my point with the bolded part

I don't think anyone doubts that our players are capable of putting in great performances just that they can do it with consistency with their current age and lack of experience. Even last year under rafa, we had some excellent performances, but we were never consistent. Yes we won the EL, but that's just the EL and we were expected to win it. None of the core players that you mentioned played any major part in the CL or FA cup wins. Add to that the fact they are being asked to play a whole different system than the one they had last season.

Btw, Jose never said that we will win the PL or dominate it. In fact it was always the contrary when he was asked about it. He always said that this squad is for the future and it's nothing like the squad that won the PL back to back in 2004. Like I've been saying, I expect us to challenge for the tittle but I will be (pleasantly) surprised if we actually win it. I think Jose feels the same way.

I think it's too early to judge Jose's system simply because I honestly don't think he knows what it is yet! We've played 5 games so far with four different styles, so no wonder that some players seem unsure what their role is. But Jose is a great manager, there's no doubt about that. He'll figure out the best system with the best combination but he will need time. Expecting instant success from any manager with the current squad is a bit naive if I'm honest.

My train and thought has always had been that the league this season should (theoretically) be for us to win. No doubt played hugely to the fact that Ferguson is no longer the manager of Manchester United, who also have not really strengthened this season (and last season won the title because so many below them were very inconsistent) while Man City seem to be in some sort of limbo along with Arsenal. To me we have a good squad that should be able (if managed correctly) win it.

[Tomo 21,733]

Btw, Jose never said that we will win the PL or dominate it. In fact it was always the contrary when he was asked about it. He always said that this squad is for the future and it's nothing like the squad that won the PL back to back in 2004. Like I've been saying, I expect us to challenge for the tittle but I will be (pleasantly) surprised if we actually win it. I think Jose feels the same way.

Ofcourse he is going to say that in public, he is probably telling players every day in Cobham that we are going to win it at Anfield.

[Tomo 21,733]

My train and thought has always had been that the league this season should (theoretically) be for us to win. No doubt played hugely to the fact that Ferguson is no longer the manager of Manchester United, who also have not really strengthened this season (and last season won the title because so many below them were very inconsistent) while Man City seem to be in some sort of limbo along with Arsenal. To me we have a good squad that should be able (if managed correctly) win it.

That's true, if we had a team to the strength of Bayern, Real or Barca in the prem, it would be very, very hard to see us winning it but our rivals for the title aren't actually all that.

United have to deal without Fergie for the first time in two and a half decades and Moyes's playing Giggs is going to hold them back. City despite all the weird hype aren't actually all that, they have an off form keeper, a Kompany injury away from being all over the place at the back and Yaya Toure is actually very inconsistent, we shouldn't be fooled by his displays against us.

[Fernando 6,488]

4 Month since he is here.

We'll be champions.

That is actually the best time to see how our current coach and team is doing cause by November/December the true nature of the squad and coaches is revealed.