The Mourinho Thread

[Mufassir08 2,400]

  On 05/02/2013 at 06:40, mediator said:

Mou is a big fan of A. Witsel.

He wanted him in madrid next season. If he comes back, i can see us making a bid next summer.

Next to KDB or Oscar, that could be awesome in our double pivot.

In fact, i don't think we have to sign another players. With the come back of the loanies, we should sell those who aren't chelsea materials and keep others into the squad

---------- Witsel / Mikel -- KDB / Oscar -------------

Moses / KDB -- Mata / Oscar -- Hazard / KDB -

----------------------- BA / Lukaku ----------------

Witsel would be amazing.

[Styles 9,790]

  On 04/02/2013 at 19:48, The only place to be said:

Mata is arguably the player of the season. Cole is still one of the best left-backs in the world. Hazard and Oscar have massive potential. Azpi has been a revelation at right-back. We have two of the top fifteen goalkeepers in the world, plus a ton of young talent.

Yes it's a challenge but the opportunity to build something amazing here would tempt any top coach. Some of the pessimistic shit really needs a dose of perspective.

There aren't a massive number of 'top names' around to be honest. Mourinho, Klopp and Guardiola are probably the three biggest names around right now and one turned us down, one won't leave and the other is still one of the best coaches in world football in my opinion.

You call it a marriage of convenience, I look at it as possibility being a nice slice of serendipity. This club still has Mourinho's feel to it and the fans love him, so why not go for it?

Didn't tempt Guardiola. Now it's seemingly back to Mourinho who doesn't quite fit the criteria for what has been assembled. The board are just making it up as they go along.

We're a very different club to the one Mourinho took over in 2004. Football has changed a great deal.

[The only place to be 11,313]

  On 05/02/2013 at 10:47, Styles said:

Didn't tempt Guardiola. Now it's seemingly back to Mourinho who doesn't quite fit the criteria for what has been assembled. The board are just making it up as they go along.

We're a very different club to the one Mourinho took over in 2004. Football has changed a great deal.

Then that will be Guardiola's loss. He'll go to Munich, win three titles, get to at least one final of the Champions League and then leave. The next coach will come in, do something similar and then the next one will come in and do something similar again. He's just going to be a cog in the machine and that's fair enough.

What's possible at Chelsea in the next decade is incredible. Rather than simply being the next custodian of a footballing giant, someone could come in and create one.

You say he 'doesn't quite fit the criteria for what has been assembled' at the same time as suggesting David Moyes for manager. Now I respect his achievements but having watched his Everton sides over the last ten years I don't know if I could say he fits the criteria any better. In fact Mourinho has set up his Madrid team in a way that we could quite easily play with maybe one or two additions. Ignoring the tactics he uses just look at the personnel he employs. I went over it earlier but our players and Madrid's are interchangeable in a number of areas.

  On 05/02/2013 at 03:18, sam81292 said:

Sorry but the people who keep posting "Please come home Jose!" and "Come back to where you belong!" sound like 5 year old kids begging for sweet. Sure he may bring a couple of trophies. But it will be 3-4 years max and them him leaving due to conflict with the board and even players.

Talk about making someone bigger then the club.

I'd hope he would stay longer than that if he came back. The man has won everything there is to win in Italy, he won La Liga in Madrid and he won everything in Portugal. I can't see him managing in Germany because he'd be chasing Munich (and he doesn't really fit Munich's style) and whilst Paris is a great city it's a fucking shit league. That may be harsh but it's like a boy band being big in, well France. Great you're amazingly popular......in France.

I'd love for him to come back and settle down for a decade.As I said above he took us to a new level and there is a chance to take us to an even bigger one in the next 10 years. Plus there's something to be said for getting every fan in the ground back onside and supporting the team.

[Rubber bullets 1,183]

  On 05/02/2013 at 06:07, manpe said:

3-4 years? That's an eternity! Wouldn't mind that.

Problem is that some people have this grandiose idea that he will be sticking around for possibly 15 even as long as 20 years. That's not going to happen, because about the second or third year he either starts getting bored (Porto and Inter) or gets into conflict with the board (Us and Madrid).

Also, I still find it ironically sad that people are celebrating whenever a news report comes out of him unable to get the dressing room to cooperate? Yeah because it's not like it actually shows that he is not an indestructible manager who never does anything wrong management wise.

[AndersonBLUE 819]

  On 05/02/2013 at 03:18, sam81292 said:

Sorry but the people who keep posting "Please come home Jose!" and "Come back to where you belong!" sound like 5 year old kids begging for sweet. Sure he may bring a couple of trophies. But it will be 3-4 years max and them him leaving due to conflict with the board and even players.

Talk about making someone bigger then the club.

so your the adult telling the kids not to be excited at a bit of news (if true) like this? you would be the one at the ground telling people to 'shhh!' when they start mourinho chants. do us a favor

[The only place to be 11,313]

  On 05/02/2013 at 12:34, sam81292 said:

Problem is that some people have this grandiose idea that he will be sticking around for possibly 15 even as long as 20 years. That's not going to happen, because about the second or third year he either starts getting bored (Porto and Inter) or gets into conflict with the board (Us and Madrid).

Also, I still find it ironically sad that people are celebrating whenever a news report comes out of him unable to get the dressing room to cooperate? Yeah because it's not like it actually shows that he is not an indestructible manager who never does anything wrong management wise.

So say he comes in next year - where does he go three years down the line?

Don't you also think it's possible that he might actually have changed after his experience in Madrid? He is human and capable of growth. I'm not saying it's a certainty and that he would work out here, but what are the other options on the table right now?

[Manuf 1,448]

since you all know mourinho so well why don't you just call him and ask? maybe then pass the news to us. thanks in advance.

[The only place to be 11,313]

  On 04/02/2013 at 19:52, MHL 47 said:

Answers in order of your queries: Let Jose or any competent Manager/Coach assess that. The Youth Development has been fine through to the end of the'Youth' period. I'd ask you this, how many have developed into First Team regulars at either Chelsea or any other top dozen PL clubs, I suspect you'll know the answer to this, but answer it for me anyway. You'll have your answer as to how well the 'system' is working in producing First-Team players for us. I can only think of one in the last 7-8 seasons. Therefore any 'system' we may have is worth reviewing?

If you never try, you'll never know, if Jose pisses off again after three years how much worse off do you think we'd be than we are now, with a good D of F in place, not an Arnesen or Grant or an Emenalo but a person with that has the club at heart, I'd doubt we'd be any worse place than we are now and probably alot better. There's been too many people willing to take chunks of Roman's money without offering enough back. How many of the top eight clubs in England would Emenalo get a job at, do you think he'd get the Man City job, would SAF take him on, how about Moyes at Everton, Rodgers at L'Pool, Wenger at Arsenal - Again, and I'm not having a go, tell me where he'd get the same gig. Roman's been taken for a bit of a fool in football by people he's put trust in.

I think the clubs signings have been OK, however they've missed out big-time in some key areas - a replacement for Makelele, Essien, a Right-Back and Two Forwards. So in my view they've lacked depth of vision, albeit picking up Mata (superb), Hazard and Oscar (promising), 'Dave' - the jury's still out for me.

If your desired goal is to have all squad's playing the same way then the Manager dictates the terms, not the Youth-Team Coach, tail wagging dog!

My opinion is based on what I perceive and I hear, you haven't offered your opinion yet, what's yours and why?

Answering in order....

There have been a few products that have gone on to be part of first teams squads in this country, but the youth program under Roman has only been going for 10 years. Isn't now about the time you'd expect us to be churning out the type of products we are? Don't you think that this group of youngsters holds infinitely more promise than any that have come before?

Of those clubs you mentioned, only Man City have a DoF I believe. You can't compare us to Arsenal or United because they have long-term managers who take on those roles. I think that actually might change in the future because Fergie will retire and Arsenal won't make the same mistake of giving a manager so much power. That's why they can't sack him despite a lot of fans wanting that. The two Liverpool clubs don't have one although Liverpool tried and failed with Comoli.

On to the club's signings which Emenalo has only been part of for the last few years. We haven't signed a replacement for Makelele because they haven't got round to making one yet. The closest we got was Fellani although Romeu could well be that guy. Essien's replacement is Ramires. We signed Azpilicueta to play right-back and he's done a fucking good job in his first season. Up front we have Lukaku out on loan, Ba bought in for £7.5 million and Islam Feruz in the youth team. The Torres deal fucked us big style but Roman and Ancelotti seem to get a free pass on that one.

How can a manager dictate how the whole club plays when modern football doesn't seem to allow for managers to stick around for a long-time? We take children on at this club and they could conceivably spend a DECADE playing in age-group teams. Do we change the style they play every time we get a new coach? Like it or not a DoF provides stability for the whole club when the first-team coach doesn't perform.

My opinion is that it's very easy to blame the guys in between the owner and the manager for a few reasons. Firstly, fans don't want to upset Roman because he's done so much for the club and there's always that scary 'what if?' thought in the back of their minds. They want to give coaches (present company accepted) as much support as they can because they do want stability. But most importantly, I think the majority of fans don't have a fucking clue what most of these people do. That's fair enough, it's boring and it's not well-publicised and they're not high-profile people so it's easy to see them as nothing but names on a door. I know a fair few people who work in these roles and they spend most of their time telling people no. They're not popular people and they're easy to target when things go wrong. No supporters like 'the board' at any club and if they do then it's just a respite before the next salvo of 'sack the board' chants.

With regards Emenalo in particular, he came into his position when the club was doing the wrong things. We were giving old players big money and ignoring the youth. Now we are playing catch-up to rectify the mistakes that were made 5-7 years ago in both the personnel side and the financial side. I liken it to doing repairs on a Formula One car in the middle of a race.You're still trying to win whilst patching up the chassis and it's damn-near impossible.

Despite that we have bought in some great players on decent wages and fees and also secured some thoroughly worthwhile loans for our most promising prospects. The problem with integrating them into the first-team is the same as it's always been which is why we need stability in that position.

But too often the good work done by 'the board' is ignored as people look for a quick fix or simply someone to blame.

[Rubber bullets 1,183]

  On 05/02/2013 at 12:40, AndersonBLUE said:

so your the adult telling the kids not to be excited at a bit of news (if true) like this? you would be the one at the ground telling people to 'shhh!' when they start mourinho chants. do us a favor

Silly, I'm just heading caution and wanting to be rational (something you probably lack). I just feel that people continuously yapping that Mourinho should come back "home" where he "belongs" is making him bigger then the club. Which I find squeamish.

[Rubber bullets 1,183]

  On 05/02/2013 at 12:43, The only place to be said:

So say he comes in next year - where does he go three years down the line?

Don't you also think it's possible that he might actually have changed after his experience in Madrid? He is human and capable of growth. I'm not saying it's a certainty and that he would work out here, but what are the other options on the table right now?

The problem is that some people think he never has and never can make mistakes, and that by appointing him again we are suddenly going to have years and years of nothing but prosperity under him under the idea that he should never have left in the first place (even though huge cracks were appearing between him, the boar and consequently the team) and if he had not left we would be going nothing but going up.

[AndersonBLUE 819]

  On 05/02/2013 at 13:03, sam81292 said:

Silly, I'm just heading caution and wanting to be rational (something you probably lack). I just feel that people continuously yapping that Mourinho should come back "home" where he "belongs" is making him bigger then the club. Which I find squeamish.

being rational, right, insulting people that would like to see mourinho back here. Can't you just say you would be apprehensive about him managing here again? 'Come home Jose' 'Special one' etc just another football thing just like 'super frank' is even when he plays crap but scores. and you know nothing is bigger than the club, even when he was here and winning.

[The only place to be 11,313]

  On 05/02/2013 at 13:06, sam81292 said:

The problem is that some people think he never has and never can make mistakes, and that by appointing him again we are suddenly going to have years and years of nothing but prosperity under him under the idea that he should never have left in the first place (even though huge cracks were appearing between him, the boar and consequently the team) and if he had not left we would be going nothing but going up.

Of course he made mistakes, but he's capable of learning from them isn't he?

When he took over, both he and Roman were learning what it was like to be in charge of a big club. Now they have the opportunity to come back a little older, a little wiser and build something at a club they both love. The possibilities of that are exciting, but of course there are risks.

My problem is with people dismissing it without applying the same logic to their own choices for manager.

[MHL 47 378]

  On 05/02/2013 at 13:01, The only place to be said:

Answering in order....

There have been a few products that have gone on to be part of first teams squads in this country, but the youth program under Roman has only been going for 10 years. Isn't now about the time you'd expect us to be churning out the type of products we are? Don't you think that this group of youngsters holds infinitely more promise than any that have come before?

Of those clubs you mentioned, only Man City have a DoF I believe. You can't compare us to Arsenal or United because they have long-term managers who take on those roles. I think that actually might change in the future because Fergie will retire and Arsenal won't make the same mistake of giving a manager so much power. That's why they can't sack him despite a lot of fans wanting that. The two Liverpool clubs don't have one although Liverpool tried and failed with Comoli.

On to the club's signings which Emenalo has only been part of for the last few years. We haven't signed a replacement for Makelele because they haven't got round to making one yet. The closest we got was Fellani although Romeu could well be that guy. Essien's replacement is Ramires. We signed Azpilicueta to play right-back and he's done a fucking good job in his first season. Up front we have Lukaku out on loan, Ba bought in for £7.5 million and Islam Feruz in the youth team. The Torres deal fucked us big style but Roman and Ancelotti seem to get a free pass on that one.

How can a manager dictate how the whole club plays when modern football doesn't seem to allow for managers to stick around for a long-time? We take children on at this club and they could conceivably spend a DECADE playing in age-group teams. Do we change the style they play every time we get a new coach? Like it or not a DoF provides stability for the whole club when the first-team coach doesn't perform.

My opinion is that it's very easy to blame the guys in between the owner and the manager for a few reasons. Firstly, fans don't want to upset Roman because he's done so much for the club and there's always that scary 'what if?' thought in the back of their minds. They want to give coaches (present company accepted) as much support as they can because they do want stability. But most importantly, I think the majority of fans don't have a fucking clue what most of these people do. That's fair enough, it's boring and it's not well-publicised and they're not high-profile people so it's easy to see them as nothing but names on a door. I know a fair few people who work in these roles and they spend most of their time telling people no. They're not popular people and they're easy to target when things go wrong. No supporters like 'the board' at any club and if they do then it's just a respite before the next salvo of 'sack the board' chants.

With regards Emenalo in particular, he came into his position when the club was doing the wrong things. We were giving old players big money and ignoring the youth. Now we are playing catch-up to rectify the mistakes that were made 5-7 years ago in both the personnel side and the financial side. I liken it to doing repairs on a Formula One car in the middle of a race.You're still trying to win whilst patching up the chassis and it's damn-near impossible.

Despite that we have bought in some great players on decent wages and fees and also secured some thoroughly worthwhile loans for our most promising prospects. The problem with integrating them into the first-team is the same as it's always been which is why we need stability in that position.

But too often the good work done by 'the board' is ignored as people look for a quick fix or simply someone to blame.

So in order:

You know the answer is only one, I know the answer is only one but you don't want to say so, because we both know that the point you're making isn't supported by the answer. There have been a number who've gone on to decent professional careers in lower leagues, Jack Corks gotten himself in or around the first team at Southampton but possibly won't last there long. Thus far all the investment has done for us in terms of producing players is Ryan Bertrand who's second choice left-back and second choice left-sided midfield, promising perhaps but not and won't be a first team regular for us for at least a season and a half. It's not a bell-ringing, flag waving success to my mind, especially when they've been spending big money on 'known' teenagers as well as taking kids through the age-groups. The current age group that includes players between the 'Youth-Cup', the NextGen Series and the U21 groups show some promise and Piazon and to a lesser degree Ake have at least set foot onto the pitch for the First-Team. Believe me Ake is miles away from being ready for First Team action as is Feruz, who we did not develop, we nipped in when a flaw in the FA's recruitment system allowed us to pay £300k for him at 16 years old. Saville, Swift, Baker are a few promising players but again nowhere near the standard required for our first team.

On to Emenalo, he's Technical Director not a DofF and his stated responsibilities would be taken up at the other clubs by either DofF, Managers Assistants or Technical Advisors - He'd not get a job with any of them, why hadn't his 'talent' been snapped up before? He's supposed to and I quote from the clubs statement "supports the work of the first team manager, leading the club's international and domestic scouting network, and assists in driving the technical programmes of our Academy and international youth network". What scouting was required for Mata, Hazard, Oscar, Luiz - Hardly any, known quantities. What other scouting may he have done? He may have assisted with the younger teams but we've a good selection of experienced Coaches and Neil Bath already in place, so I have my doubts as to his technical input. As you no doubt can tell I have grave reservations about his talent, to use your F1 analagy, you wouldn't have a mechanic in your Ferrari F1 team, who's only previous experience was with second-hand LDV Vans, in short he's been over-promoted and lacks the necessary experience to bridge the gap. Mike Forde is our Director of Football Operations who has no playing experience at any professional level, less than Emenalo.

Do you know who's in charge of Loanees and development of them? I do from personal knowledge and it sure isn't Emenalo.

In terms of your comments about stability etc, I can see where you're coming from but again show me where the 'model' being suggested by you has worked long-term in the top leagues in Europe, I can think of one club. Italian Clubs were being forced down the route of development because of commercial constraints, but after 2-3 seasons of frugality they again now appear to be 'chasing the dragon' with pots of money.

Applaud those who do good jobs by all means, but applaud those for whom the jury is still most definately out and who have plenty to prove - No way

[xPetrCechx 13,565]

Gazzetta Dello Sport- Conte Or Mourinho Will be the Next Chelsea Manager

http://www.gazzetta.it/Calcio/Squadre/Juventus/05-02-2013/conte-mourinho-sfida-la-panchina-chelsea-914154259556.shtml

[laura90 556]

The romantic notion that the love affair can be rekindled, after breaking up relatively long relationship (whether one sided or mutual) is always tricky . There's always a reason why parties broke up in the first place, and that reason often comes back to haunt people.

Returning to a previous partner can only ever work if both parties have matured, and recognise their contributions to the failed partnership from before. My heart and mind want Jose to return, my common sense tells me that it could get fractious once again. Would either of Roman and Mourinho concede their mistakes of the past affair? Ultimately, both possess huge egos, both felt the other took away from their respective achievements.

Jose got Valdano sacked in order to have more control at Real. Roman refuses to give control to any manager, even when it comes to squad needs. What would we need in situation like that, is Hiddink type as DOF to act as ''marriage counsellor'' between these parties. However, counselling only works if both parties commit. I know, Hiddink has retirement issues, but we would still need football knowledgeable DOF with diplomatic skills.

Even though Mourinhos successors failed to show world class manager skills, it wasn't only poor managment that got us in this mess, to think that we only need Mourinho to get us back on track. Mourinho or not Mourinho, the healing has to start from the top.

Jose would be immense to provide us space and time for real transition in the board, for hiring people who understand football on this level, some of them who had connection with Chelsea before, so have an extra motivation and to entitle them to make decisions related to football ( in cooperation with Jose).

Even if Jose chooses to leave in three years time , we would still have an option to hire promising, younger but experienced manager on these grounds.

Honestly, the only thing that will convince me that Roman may have seen the light is if he reconsititutes our board . Jose is a fantastic coach, yes, but aint miracle worker. With Jose we would have great time, however, as long as Roman surrounds himself with his business amigos and calls that a football governing board for Chelsea FC , I feel this twilight zone we are in would just hide in a corner for a while waiting to meet us again.

[Mbrooks0811 25]

Someone may have already asked this, but I'm too lazy to go through 30 pages to find out. What makes this year's speculation any more substantive than the speculation every year since he left? Or is this just because it's fun to speculate about the return of the "Special One?" (Which I agree, it is very fun)

[The only place to be 11,313]

  On 05/02/2013 at 15:23, MHL 47 said:

So in order:

You know the answer is only one, I know the answer is only one but you don't want to say so, because we both know that the point you're making isn't supported by the answer. There have been a number who've gone on to decent professional careers in lower leagues, Jack Corks gotten himself in or around the first team at Southampton but possibly won't last there long. Thus far all the investment has done for us in terms of producing players is Ryan Bertrand who's second choice left-back and second choice left-sided midfield, promising perhaps but not and won't be a first team regular for us for at least a season and a half. It's not a bell-ringing, flag waving success to my mind, especially when they've been spending big money on 'known' teenagers as well as taking kids through the age-groups. The current age group that includes players between the 'Youth-Cup', the NextGen Series and the U21 groups show some promise and Piazon and to a lesser degree Ake have at least set foot onto the pitch for the First-Team. Believe me Ake is miles away from being ready for First Team action as is Feruz, who we did not develop, we nipped in when a flaw in the FA's recruitment system allowed us to pay £300k for him at 16 years old. Saville, Swift, Baker are a few promising players but again nowhere near the standard required for our first team.

On to Emenalo, he's Technical Director not a DofF and his stated responsibilities would be taken up at the other clubs by either DofF, Managers Assistants or Technical Advisors - He'd not get a job with any of them, why hadn't his 'talent' been snapped up before? He's supposed to and I quote from the clubs statement "supports the work of the first team manager, leading the club's international and domestic scouting network, and assists in driving the technical programmes of our Academy and international youth network". What scouting was required for Mata, Hazard, Oscar, Luiz - Hardly any, known quantities. What other scouting may he have done? He may have assisted with the younger teams but we've a good selection of experienced Coaches and Neil Bath already in place, so I have my doubts as to his technical input. As you no doubt can tell I have grave reservations about his talent, to use your F1 analagy, you wouldn't have a mechanic in your Ferrari F1 team, who's only previous experience was with second-hand LDV Vans, in short he's been over-promoted and lacks the necessary experience to bridge the gap. Mike Forde is our Director of Football Operations who has no playing experience at any professional level, less than Emenalo.

Do you know who's in charge of Loanees and development of them? I do from personal knowledge and it sure isn't Emenalo.

In terms of your comments about stability etc, I can see where you're coming from but again show me where the 'model' being suggested by you has worked long-term in the top leagues in Europe, I can think of one club. Italian Clubs were being forced down the route of development because of commercial constraints, but after 2-3 seasons of frugality they again now appear to be 'chasing the dragon' with pots of money.

Applaud those who do good jobs by all means, but applaud those for whom the jury is still most definately out and who have plenty to prove - No way

I will readily admit that Terry is the only product we've produced but I wasn't going to include him because he was pre-Abramovich. I agree with what you're saying here.

You make some good points about Emenalo, yet you also suggested we go after Nevin for that role. To use your own reasoning, what other club would he get a job at? The one that he was a Chief Exec of before they went into administration? Should we be approaching him now before Fergie gets his hands on him?

My view on Emenalo is that since he's been in his position, our transfer policy has radically changed and for the better in my opinion although driven by Roman's desire to put Guardiola in place in the Summer. He doesn't have the experience that some might want but in my opinion it's way too early to come to a conclusion on the job he's done, but I do think he's being scapegoated for the mistakes made by his predecessors. He's not made the same ones so by those low standards, he's something of an improvement.

Great post btw. I think we both agree on the problems in the club, but I think we just see different root causes for them. I'm also fairly optimistic that they aren't still being made (except for the head coach position) and that we're doing things the right way now.

[xPetrCechx 13,565]

  On 05/02/2013 at 18:17, Mbrooks0811 said:

Someone may have already asked this, but I'm too lazy to go through 30 pages to find out. What makes this year's speculation any more substantive than the speculation every year since he left? Or is this just because it's fun to speculate about the return of the "Special One?" (Which I agree, it is very fun)

Because Real madrid has a poor season. Jose makes strange things like send Iker to the bench, because there are many speculation, that

he "lose" the dressing room, even from Iker's Girlfriend.

fans don't like him...