The Benitez Thread

[The only place to be 11,313]

It's not the gloryhunters who are singing those songs, those are people who have supported this club through thick and thin, who love it more than any manager, player or owner. He's not right, where has that come from now ?

How do you know that? I've seen teenage lads singing such songs. I've also seen blokes who have supported the club for decades rolling their eyes at these songs.

[Stingray 9,441]

He's got a point about people having an agenda too. You can see that in this thread where people were preparing the chants before his first game, and I criticised that at the time. I didn't want him before he got the job (like most fans) and I didn't want him to stay one second longer than he has too (like most fans), but in between those two times it served our own long-term needs to support him or at least not give him stick.

But people were already bowling out of Fulham Broadway with their little chants and their print-outs of 'Rafa Out'. Now they'll say they just care about the club, but booing the manager wasn't in the best interests of the club in my opinion. The atmosphere has been toxic, not because of Rafa but because of the reaction to Rafa.

1% of life is what happens to you - 99% is how you react to it and when you expect someone to fail then it can become a self-fulfilling prophecy.

The thing is, I'm not sure if these fans are happy or sad that we're in the state we're in now. There are people in life who enjoy having something to moan about and they certainly have that now.

Yes you have a right to voice an opinion once you've forked over that money that you worked hard for (or didn't - no judging) but to me that isn't fun. Going to a football match with the intention of criticising the manager of the team before he's taken charge of his first game (because there is surely no doubt that's what some fans did) isn't fun to me. It isn't entertaining. It isn't what I wanted to do when my dad first took me to see Chelsea. It isn't what he had in mind has a fun day out when he went to the box office on his lunch breaks to get tickets and I simply can't fathom the logic of the fans who tried to make the atmosphere at the Bridge as toxic as they could. Yes they did it for the manager's benefit, but there are players on the pitch who DO hear it, there are fans in the stadium who DO hear it and don't like it and there are fans around the world who DO watch it and must think what the fuck are we actually trying to achieve.

Any fan with half a brain knew that Rafa wasn't going before summer unless results got so bad there'd be no other choice. They've very nearly got that now.

Where's the champagne?

Amen to that.

[Bosnian Blue 2,471]

How do you know that? I've seen teenage lads singing such songs. I've also seen blokes who have supported the club for decades rolling their eyes at these songs.

By reading their opinions, simple.

Maybe they were too old to sing. Seriously now, that could've been the case but I assure you there are plenty of people (starting from TC) who were there for the club when we were shit and they think the same.

[MHL 47 378]

He's got a point about people having an agenda too. You can see that in this thread where people were preparing the chants before his first game, and I criticised that at the time. I didn't want him before he got the job (like most fans) and I didn't want him to stay one second longer than he has too (like most fans), but in between those two times it served our own long-term needs to support him or at least not give him stick.

But people were already bowling out of Fulham Broadway with their little chants and their print-outs of 'Rafa Out'. Now they'll say they just care about the club, but booing the manager wasn't in the best interests of the club in my opinion. The atmosphere has been toxic, not because of Rafa but because of the reaction to Rafa.

1% of life is what happens to you - 99% is how you react to it and when you expect someone to fail then it can become a self-fulfilling prophecy.

The thing is, I'm not sure if these fans are happy or sad that we're in the state we're in now. There are people in life who enjoy having something to moan about and they certainly have that now.

Yes you have a right to voice an opinion once you've forked over that money that you worked hard for (or didn't - no judging) but to me that isn't fun. Going to a football match with the intention of criticising the manager of the team before he's taken charge of his first game (because there is surely no doubt that's what some fans did) isn't fun to me. It isn't entertaining. It isn't what I wanted to do when my dad first took me to see Chelsea. It isn't what he had in mind has a fun day out when he went to the box office on his lunch breaks to get tickets and I simply can't fathom the logic of the fans who tried to make the atmosphere at the Bridge as toxic as they could. Yes they did it for the manager's benefit, but there are players on the pitch who DO hear it, there are fans in the stadium who DO hear it and don't like it and there are fans around the world who DO watch it and must think what the fuck are we actually trying to achieve.

Any fan with half a brain knew that Rafa wasn't going before summer unless results got so bad there'd be no other choice. They've very nearly got that now.

Where's the champagne?

Perhaps he's reaping what he sowed, what he's ended up with is a result of the 'cause and effect' of his comments about the players, fans and the club when he was at Liverpool - Some won't see past that.

You'll know from our discussions that I never rated his ability, the rest of it I didn't like but could live with if he'd put us in a comfortable league position and got us looking like a solid unit again, he hasn't on either count.

He's turned out to be not as good as he thinks he is and with that diatribe last night has just proved what a manipulative and cunning individual he is, personally I wouldn't pay him in shirt buttons now.

As for my champers, it's on ice and with a bit of luck will be getting 'popped' this evening.

Heck I'd even accept Grant for the remainder of the season now. At least he has the sense to know who to rely on, he's a bit of a liability football wise, but he may be able to get good advice in that respect.

[The only place to be 11,313]

By reading their opinions, simple.

Maybe they were too old to sing. Seriously now, that could've been the case but I assure you there are plenty of people (starting from TC) who were there for the club when we were shit and they think the same.

They've not been too old to sing in the past. You making generalisations when you don't really have any clue what you're talking about isn't all that helpful.

The amazing thing to me is how completely fucking stupid the main chant against Rafa is.

We don't care about Rafa,

He don't care about us,

All we care about is Chelsea FC.

Now ignoring the fact that it's got a piss-poor tune, it makes no fucking sense to sing it. The lyrics (such that they are) imply that he may well be coach, but we don't care. All we care about is this club. But singing it and creating a shit atmosphere actively works against the club doesn't it? For those who sing it - do you feel like it drives the club forward? Does it give you the goosebumps that singing Ten Men Went To Mow or Over Land and Sea gives you?

Perhaps he's reaping what he sowed, what he's ended up with is a result of the 'cause and effect' of his comments about the players, fans and the club when he was at Liverpool - Some won't see past that.

You'll know from our discussions that I never rated his ability, the rest of it I didn't like but could live with if he'd put us in a comfortable league position and got us looking like a solid unit again, he hasn't on either count.

He's turned out to be not as good as he thinks he is and with that diatribe last night has just proved what a manipulative and cunning individual he is, personally I wouldn't pay him in shirt buttons now.

As for my champers, it's on ice and with a bit of luck will be getting 'popped' this evening.

Heck I'd even accept Grant for the remainder of the season now. At least he has the sense to know who to rely on, he's a bit of a liability football wise, but he may be able to get good advice in that respect.

And that's the same feeling I had. I didn't want him one second longer than he had to be here, but I wasn't going to boo him before he took charge of his first second of a game because that wasn't in the team's best interests in my opinion. But people turned up with their signs. They actually printed these things out to create a protest environment rather than focusing on supporting the team.

He may well be reaping what he sowed, but so are some of our fans. They wanted him gone, and there was only one way that was going to happen. I'm sure they'll now disavow any part in it.

And the opposition fans who say they're too cowardly to call for Roman's head because of his money.....it's harder and harder everyday to disprove that.

[We Hate Scouse 10,287]

How do you know that? I've seen teenage lads singing such songs. I've also seen blokes who have supported the club for decades rolling their eyes at these songs.

So all teenagers are glory hunters? Let be guess we didnt witness the hard times so we wouldn't know?

Fantastic.

I know a lot of teenagers and also people who have been going for decades that sing these songs. Many away and European regulars. Don't tend to get many glory hunters travelling 6 hours by coach to Middlesbrough on a cold Wednesday night.

[CHOULO19 24,332]

Tbh, I agree with most of what he said there, but if it gets him sacked, I'm a happy man!

[The only place to be 11,313]

So all teenagers are glory hunters? Let be guess we didnt witness the hard times so we wouldn't know?

Fantastic.

I know a lot of teenagers and also people who have been going for decades that sing these songs. Many away and European regulars. Don't tend to get many glory hunters travelling 6 hours by coach to Middlesbrough on a cold Wednesday night.

Calm down. He said they were fans who supported the club through thick and thin and people of our age (although I'm slightly older than you) have had very little 'thin' in our time supporting the club. In fact in my years it's been very much Kardashian on the thickness scale.

My point is that it's not tenure of support that determines who sings these songs, but mentality. Different people react to different things in life based on their attitude.

My attitude was shitty at first, but I decided I didn't care about Rafa - all I cared about was Chelsea so I choose to sing songs which support the club and don't single specific people out for criticism or abuse. That's MY choice. Others have made different ones.

[Buffalo talks Blue 85]

What doesn't he has a problem with.. the fans, the players and now the term 'interim?'

[Bosnian Blue 2,471]

Nobody criticizes you for not chanting or having a different opinion, so why do you do that to us ?

I hate him, but above all I love this club. And 'We hate scouse' answered the other part.

You didn't care about him, then you shouldn't care at all who is the manager because results are everything. It can be FSW, it can be Roman, it can be Justin Bieber...

[Fulham Broadway 16,952]

To the 2000 last night.....If this turns out to be the tipping point for FSW I will be eternally grateful
to the 2000 who voiced their opinion last night, its a hell of a long way to go on a school night, and I salute you.

Rafa last night what a fool. By saying the club made a massive mistake making him interim manager not only alienates himself even more from the fans and the club but his lawyers, and agent when he signed the Interim Contract

PS WHS and Liquidator and someone else one here who i forget are teenagers/young and are regular attenders, know the history and forked out hard earned cash over land and sea

[English Freak 456]

Don't see anything wrong with what Benitez said in the press conference.

He's never been able to handle the English media to begin with.

[Jase 43,479]

Have to say, it's feels as if a burden has been lifted off completely after listening to what Benitez said yesterday.

Anyway, do agree with Benitez when he said the fans should be supporting the team more, and not chanting and booing him all the time. However, Benitez's self-denials, constant yapping about facts, facts & facts, poor squad management and not getting results didn't help. Benitez flogged certain players to death(i.e Mata) and then rested players(i.e Hazard) for whatever reason when there is no need to. He made some bewildering team selections, substitutions & change things very late in games when it should have been done so earlier. Not forgetting Benitez's failure to react to problems on the pitch and change things around when needed. Always wait till we're losing! It should also be noted that not all the problems we have now is Benitez's fault as the board and players are to be blamed as well. But it is ludicrous of Benitez yesterday to basically suggest nothing is his fault right now and is the fault of everyone else!

[The only place to be 11,313]

To the 2000 last night.....If this turns out to be the tipping point for FSW I will be eternally grateful

to the 2000 who voiced their opinion last night, its a hell of a long way to go on a school night, and I salute you.

Rafa last night what a fool. By saying the club made a massive mistake making him interim manager not only alienates himself even more from the fans and the club but his lawyers, and agent when he signed the Interim Contract

PS WHS and Liquidator and someone else one here who i forget are teenagers/young and are regular attenders, know the history and forked out hard earned cash over land and sea

And I addressed that. Anyone under the age of about 30 hasn't had to support this club through thick and thin because there's been very little thin. Do you disagree with that?

The fans who have booed him since day one can't be so thick that they didn't realise that the only way he was going to get sacked before the summer was if the results were so bad there was no other choice. I'm not going to say they wanted us to be in the position we are or that they wanted the team to do badly, but the chants against Rafa don't help the team IN MY OPINION. If you think they do then that's your choice.

But choosing to sing them is based on your attitude to adversity. We were put in a shit position when he was hired and every single supporter at home and away had a choice on how to react to that.

[MHL 47 378]

They've not been too old to sing in the past. You making generalisations when you don't really have any clue what you're talking about isn't all that helpful.

The amazing thing to me is how completely fucking stupid the main chant against Rafa is.

We don't care about Rafa,

He don't care about us,

All we care about is Chelsea FC.

Now ignoring the fact that it's got a piss-poor tune, it makes no fucking sense to sing it. The lyrics (such that they are) imply that he may well be coach, but we don't care. All we care about is this club. But singing it and creating a shit atmosphere actively works against the club doesn't it? For those who sing it - do you feel like it drives the club forward? Does it give you the goosebumps that singing Ten Men Went To Mow or Over Land and Sea gives you?

And that's the same feeling I had. I didn't want him one second longer than he had to be here, but I wasn't going to boo him before he took charge of his first second of a game because that wasn't in the team's best interests in my opinion. But people turned up with their signs. They actually printed these things out to create a protest environment rather than focusing on supporting the team.

He may well be reaping what he sowed, but so are some of our fans. They wanted him gone, and there was only one way that was going to happen. I'm sure they'll now disavow any part in it.

And the opposition fans who say they're too cowardly to call for Roman's head because of his money.....it's harder and harder everyday to disprove that.

Each to their own I suppose, I don't ever boo the players (by god we've had some poor ones) or a manager, this one now is a different matter, by now I mean after last night, last night wasn't a 'cry for help' or a'cry to arms' it was a calculated and pre-meditated speech designed to take blame away from him.

Do I blame him for coming here, no I don't, I think he would have been better advised to have shown a some public contriteness about his previously made comments, that may have calmed an inflammatory situation down a bit. His persona didn't allow him to do that. Look, he's made his bed and now he'll have to lie in it, the more I think about it the more I believe he's got something else lined up.

The oppo fans giving out stick for us not calling out Roman is simply the politics of envy, do you think Man City fans will criticise Mansoor. Anyway, not bothered about what they think really.

[MHL 47 378]

What doesn't he has a problem with.. the fans, the players and now the term 'interim?'

Himself

[The only place to be 11,313]

Have to say, it's feels as if a burden has been lifted off completely after listening to what Benitez said yesterday.

Anyway, do agree with Benitez when he said the fans should be supporting the team more, and not chanting and booing him all the time. However, Benitez's self-denials, constant yapping about facts, facts & facts, poor squad management and not getting results didn't help. Benitez flogged certain players to death(i.e Mata) and then rested players(i.e Hazard) for whatever reason when there is no need to. He made some bewildering team selections, substitutions & change

things very late in games when it should have been done so earlier. Not forgetting Benitez's failure to react to problems on the pitch and change things around when needed. Always wait till we're losing! It should also be noted that not all the problems we have now is Benitez's fault as the board and players are to be blamed as well. But it is ludicrous of Benitez yesterday to basically suggest nothing is his fault right now and is the fault of everyone else!

Agree with most of this. The whole thing felt somewhat cathartic, but it all came out in an uncontrolled manner. He should have addressed these issues more honestly as they came up rather than in the rehearsed, stilted manner he has done. He just doesn't seem to do well with pressure.

He should have been more honest and blunt when he got the job, he should have been more honest when the chants started and he should've been more honest when criticising it if he felt that was the right thing to do. Doing it last night was just stupid, but it's all out in the open now so we can move forward in some way.

Each to their own I suppose, I don't ever boo the players (by god we've had some poor ones) or a manager, this one now is a different matter, by now I mean after last night, last night wasn't a 'cry for help' or a'cry to arms' it was a calculated and pre-meditated speech designed to take blame away from him.

Do I blame him for coming here, no I don't, I think he would have been better advised to have shown a some public contriteness about his previously made comments, that may have calmed an inflammatory situation down a bit. His persona didn't allow him to do that. Look, he's made his bed and now he'll have to lie in it, the more I think about it the more I believe he's got something else lined up.

The oppo fans giving out stick for us not calling out Roman is simply the politics of envy, do you think Man City fans will criticise Mansoor. Anyway, not bothered about what they think really.

I think he handled himself poorly and should've addressed this stuff earlier and in a more honest fashion.

But in regards the chanting, do the players differentiate between the negativity directed at the coach from stuff that might be aimed at them? Look at it from their point of view - they spend their working weeks with this guy and then for maybe 90 minutes a week their exposed to the crowd who may well be chanting abuse at their boss (interim he may be). Does that help their performance? Are we creating the best possible atmosphere to support the players or to force Rafa out of his position?

He spoke about people with an agenda and I know you've said the results would've helped him, but there were clearly people going to the games who were going to boo regardless. It's hard to argue with him on that point.

And City fans may not criticise Mansoor, but they haven't called for Mancini's head, or any of the staff in between him and the owner. They haven't been put in that position yet so I'm not saying they wouldn't, but at this club, on this very forum people have called for almost everyone at the club to be sacked except one man - the man we all understand made this decision, made the Torres decision, made the Ancelotti decision etc. (although some have said he should go).

It's a fair point to raise if you disagree with so many of the things going on at this club, but he gets very little stick.

[Stingray 9,441]

Is there a poll out yet on the exact hour he gets sacked today?