Closed Chelsea 2-2 Juventus

[Sheva. 5,373]

I'm just confused...

Last 2 years we had some serious problems with creativity. Mata, Oscar, Hazard, Moses and Marin came in. All have great quality.

Now, our defense is beeing a big issue. We need to change formation right away or buy players on DM that fit the role (since we are low on this particular position).

We correct one end and the other start to collapse...

Lmao exactly. But it's going to take time for everything to be perfect, but when it eventually is, wow.

[Hutcho 8,443]

I'm just confused...

Last 2 years we had some serious problems with creativity. Mata, Oscar, Hazard, Moses and Marin came in. All have great quality.

Now, our defense is beeing a big issue. We need to change formation right away or buy players on DM that fit the role (since we are low on this particular position).

We correct one end and the other start to collapse...

TBF most of the time it has been the exact same team as last year without didier and with hazard. Our defence wasn't great last year for the most part. It was in champions league but not in the premier league so i see it a bit more of an extension of the problem. Can't wait to see oscar hazard and mata all in the same team... Moses deserves a start as well, torres wasn't as bad as he was against QPR but he still wasn't good enough. Danny can create some stuff for himself and he defiantely deserves to start if he is fit. Not huge problems yet but they could develop into them, so i would like to see some more positive intent vs stoke... And against them lot we should get a shit load of fouls.

[kellzfresh 7,229]

I told you all that oscar is good enough to start..... he benches both ganso and lucas moura and is as good as mata and even a better finisher. He should start every game for this peformance, maybe it will knock some sense into poor peformers.

Mikel is just a fish, why did he give a stupid pass like that?

Hazard played well.

Torres has a terrible ball control and no strength or desire to win balls. I wouldnt mind seeing moses or sturridge in attack because torres loses the ball too much and spoils the link up play. This gives the opposition the ball easily.

Why dimatteo thinks ramires is a right winger is beyond me. He cannot cross or make the right decision at the right time.

Lampard should not play 90mins for us again he should be subbed early.

Terry tried to play offside instead of tracking him.

At least oscar has proved he is a starter as i commented before

[chelseawise 115]

I thought we played very well. In fact it was our best game for quite some time, including our lucky final games in champions league.

Here are some obvious flaws that need instant corrections:

1) What the hell is Ryan Bertrand's role. He is a good player for the future at left back, nothing more than that.

2) Someone needs to tell RDM that Obi Mikel does not belong in this team. He should be sold.

3) Give Torres maximum 5 more starts, if he does not improve bench him, and let him sulk.

4) Give start to Mosses, he is a great player

5) Give Piazon a chance.

My Ideal Starting 11

PC

IV DL JT AC

RAMIREZ LAMPARD

MOSS MATA HAZARD

STURIDGE

[Magic Lamps 11,692]

One thing, I wanna see Cesar Azpilicueta vs Stoke. Ivanovic is a great defender but he is not necessarily a great footballer. He is rock solid but his technique is average and his crossing is simply woeful. Exactly in this game Hazard became useless playing on the right because, Ivanovic could not feed him. Cesar offers way more possibilities in terms of attacking

[Rmpr 8,977]

TBF most of the time it has been the exact same team as last year without didier and with hazard. Our defence wasn't great last year for the most part. It was in champions league but not in the premier league so i see it a bit more of an extension of the problem. Can't wait to see oscar hazard and mata all in the same team... Moses deserves a start as well, torres wasn't as bad as he was against QPR but he still wasn't good enough. Danny can create some stuff for himself and he defiantely deserves to start if he is fit. Not huge problems yet but they could develop into them, so i would like to see some more positive intent vs stoke... And against them lot we should get a shit load of fouls.

Yes, I guess you are right. But it was not only no Didier Legend Drogba and plus Hazard, some nice attacking players came (Moses, Marin, Pscar) that will make a difference.

[kellzfresh 7,229]

A few points I have to make.

If Oscar hasn't given himself a reason to start I don't know what else will make RDM see that he should. First goal took a favorable touch but the second goal was, mwah! beautiful, goal of beauty, rounded pirlo and gave buffon 0 chance. He also did a lovely job of keeping pirlo quiet, the minute he came off pirlo had more breathing room. I would have given him a solid A or A+

Ramires is no winger, while his turn of pace was good for some instances in the match once he gets into that final third he does not deliver, he does not cross overly well and his shot leaves something to be desired. Is this not why we got Moses, I just do not understand di matteo's insistence on either using Ramires on the wing or Bertrand. I just don't know what Robby sees in Bertrand, when he came on, chelsea lost control of the match.

Cahill needs to start more often. I feel much much more confident about our defense when Cahill and Terry start. Cahill does not seem to have those lapses in concentration that Luiz has and he always seems to be keen not to let one in. At times in the match Luiz was either going after balls he had no chance of winning or just switched off. I really wish Cahill would play alongside Terry more often. They were outstanding last season playing together.

Also, why in Heaven's name did we get Cesar if we are not going to use him? If Azpilicueta was played that would allow Ivanovic to play his natural role as a CB. Ivanovic rarely goes foward to help attack and made hazard look bad on the right.

After selling both essien and meriles, i have no answer to how we resolve the double pivot unless we change to 4-3-3.

Sigh, hope RDM makes some changes and at least starts Oscar and or Moses alongside Mata and Hazard. Hopefully we can return to winning ways against Stoke.

[kellzfresh 7,229]

A few points I have to make.

If Oscar hasn't given himself a reason to start I don't know what else will make RDM see that he should. First goal took a favorable touch but the second goal was, mwah! beautiful, goal of beauty, rounded pirlo and gave buffon 0 chance. He also did a lovely job of keeping pirlo quiet, the minute he came off pirlo had more breathing room. I would have given him a solid A or A+

Ramires is no winger, while his turn of pace was good for some instances in the match once he gets into that final third he does not deliver, he does not cross overly well and his shot leaves something to be desired. Is this not why we got Moses, I just do not understand di matteo's insistence on either using Ramires on the wing or Bertrand. I just don't know what Robby sees in Bertrand, when he came on, chelsea lost control of the match.

Cahill needs to start more often. I feel much much more confident about our defense when Cahill and Terry start. Cahill does not seem to have those lapses in concentration that Luiz has and he always seems to be keen not to let one in. At times in the match Luiz was either going after balls he had no chance of winning or just switched off. I really wish Cahill would play alongside Terry more often. They were outstanding last season playing together.

Also, why in Heaven's name did we get Cesar if we are not going to use him? If Azpilicueta was played that would allow Ivanovic to play his natural role as a CB. Ivanovic rarely goes foward to help attack and made hazard look bad on the right.

After selling both essien and meriles, i have no answer to how we resolve the double pivot unless we change to 4-3-3.

Sigh, hope RDM makes some changes and at least starts Oscar and or Moses alongside Mata and Hazard. Hopefully we can return to winning ways against Stoke.

[johnske64 14]

Mikel MOTM from Juventus's perspective.

Ivanovic cannot cross.

Ramires can't keep the ball for more than 2 seconds.

Torres MIA. Can't score a goal against a top team if his life depended on it.

Luiz is careless with his tackles.

Bosingwa is to blame.

[robsblubot 3,595]

His runs worked well. He made fewer of them than usual and when he did make them, there was a reason, they opened up the attack and had Ramires spotted him, he would have had a goal on one of them. It may take him a little time to get back to 100%, but I thought he was clearly one Chelsea's best players today (Oscar, Hazard, Cole being the others and Mata for his brief spell as well.) It just bothers me how Lampard has become such a scapegoat that people can't even admit when he plays well. (It takes about 5 good games from Mikel for many people to admit he isn't awful although after his poor pass today, it will probably take another 10 good games.)

I'm sorry, but concerning Lampard, my standards appear to be much higher than yours. I expect far more from him than what he did today. I expect far more from him than connecting sideway passes. He's a CM. He needs to defend well also attack. He needs to assist and shoot at goal, which he hasn't been doing. He certainly did not do any of that today.

BTW, I'm far more concerned about Mikel's positioning, or lack thereof, than his occasional erratic passing.

[communicate 2,703]

One thing, I wanna see Cesar Azpilicueta vs Stoke. Ivanovic is a great defender but he is not necessarily a great footballer. He is rock solid but his technique is average and his crossing is simply woeful. Exactly in this game Hazard became useless playing on the right because, Ivanovic could not feed him. Cesar offers way more possibilities in terms of attacking

Not against stoke, Iva is arguably our best player in the air

[KonohasOrangeFlash 2,607]

2 points dropped as far as I'm concerned. Allowed their midfield too much space. The team's lack of pressing (in what should be an obvious situation to press in) is mind boggling. We can't lose in the return match at Turin.

Oscar was great. That second goal (especially his first touch) was the stuff of a genius and one of the most beautiful and pure goals you'll ever see. To think that was a goal from a 21 year old kid making his Champions League debut.

The formation change was a good tactic by RDM. His decision to exclude Mata was questionable but paid off big time. Plus Mata got even more rest, so that's another positive. Hazard was quiet. Although the link up with Mata when he came on looked encouraging.

All in all, a tad disappointing. We need to play a lot better in Turin.

[Rowan_Osborn 58]

2 points dropped as far as I'm concerned. Allowed their midfield too much space. The team's lack of pressing (in what should be an obvious situation to press in) is mind boggling. We can't lose in the return match at Turin.

Oscar was great. That second goal (especially his first touch) was the stuff of a genius and one of the most beautiful and pure goals you'll ever see. To think that was a goal from a 21 year old kid making his Champions League debut.

The formation change was a good tactic by RDM. His decision to exclude Mata was questionable but paid off big time. Plus Mata got even more rest, so that's another positive. Hazard was quiet. Although the link up with Mata when he came on looked encouraging.

All in all, a tad disappointing. We need to play a lot better in Turin.

Before the game i would of taken a draw. However as we went 2-0 up i was disappointed that we let it slip, especially as it was due to errors not really good play. We should still progress to the next round comfortably and after all that is all that is really required of the group stages. However if this was the knockout rounds i would be very disappointed with a 2-2 draw at home.

[Emmanuelpee 12]

The insistence of ramires on the right wing position MIGHT be the downfall of RDM...why Rambo? Even oscar,mata and hazard combination will be far far more terrific...or atleast give Moses a run out...now we have natural wingers unlike last season when we have 2 depend on Rammy

[Rowan_Osborn 58]

The insistence of ramires on the right wing position MIGHT be the downfall of RDM...why Rambo? Even oscar,mata and hazard combination will be far far more terrific...or atleast give Moses a run out...now we have natural wingers unlike last season when we have 2 depend on Rammy

The only reason i can see is that he doesn't want to drop either Lampard or Ramires but wants to play 4-2-3-1 and the only way to facilitate both is to play Rami as a right winger. I might be the only one to think this, but i wouldn't be disappointed if he were to play Lamps right wing. It suits his more natural attacking mentality and if the rest of the three was made up of Mata and Hazard then there can be plenty of interchangeability. Also he can do a job defensively.

[Emmanuelpee 12]

The only reason i can see is that he doesn't want to drop either Lampard or Ramires but wants to play 4-2-3-1 and the only way to facilitate both is to play Rami as a right winger. I might be the only one to think this, but i wouldn't be disappointed if he were to play Lamps right wing. It suits his more natural attacking mentality and if the rest of the three was made up of Mata and Hazard then there can be plenty of interchangeability. Also he can do a job defensively.

When oscar can perform very well in that position...ramires and lampard should be used interchangly next to mikel...based on performance

[Rowan_Osborn 58]

When oscar can perform very well in that position...ramires and lampard should be used interchangly next to mikel...based on performance

I agree and would play Oscar myself, however i was only suggesting a reason as to why RDM plays Ramires as a right winger. I would like us to play Brazil's 4-2-1-3 formation as this would allow Ramires and Oscar to play where they do for their country and i believe a front three of Mata, Torres and Hazard would be very effective and they can interchange with Oscar to add fluidity.

[TorontoChelsea 4,064]

I'm sorry, but concerning Lampard, my standards appear to be much higher than yours. I expect far more from him than what he did today. I expect far more from him than connecting sideway passes. He's a CM. He needs to defend well also attack. He needs to assist and shoot at goal, which he hasn't been doing. He certainly did not do any of that today.

BTW, I'm far more concerned about Mikel's positioning, or lack thereof, than his occasional erratic passing.

This is exactly the problem with the expectations of Lampard. Somehow, he is supposed to function as a defensive midfielder covering for Mikel and the back four and also be helping to lead our attack and scoring and assisting on goals while also not making a lot of runs while also not being too static. Those are all criticisms I've seen of Lampard in the past few days. It's just madness. There isn't a player in the history of the game who could do that. They'd have to run like 50 miles a game at Olympic sprinter-like speeds without tiring. Lampard is not going to get a lot of assists or goals from play. The deep-lying midfielder just doesn't. Xabi Alonso gets about 5-6 assists most seasons and a couple of goals. Same with Modric. Same with Pirlo (except last season where he had 13 assists). The job of the deep-lying playmaker is to open up play with their vision and accurate passing. They are rarely the guy who makes the pass before the goal, though they are often the player who makes the pass right before that. They have to be able to make long passes and short passes in tight areas. They have to have defensive discipline while being able to make smart runs. They have to be the outlet for the defenders to start the transition to attack. Lampard's game today was excellent and if he plays like that all season, he will be a very good deep lying midfielder for us. People have to accept what the deep-lyiing midfield position is or they inevitably be disappointed by everyone who plays there.

According to whoscored.com, Lampard had a 92% passing rate including 9 for 9 on long balls. He had the second most passes on the team (66 to 64 to Cole who had...ho hum, another great game).59 for 64 in passing especially for a non defender is simply incredible.

[blue_swaggin_96 96]

be happy, manure could barely beat a turkish team @ home, we dominated a good portion of this game, the italian champions.

[Strike 7,490]

don't see the point of dumping it long to torres. the defenders ipass the ball back to cech whenever they are closed down and cech dumps it long for the opposition to gather the ball. plus, it doesn't help when luiz is also dumping the ball long every now and then. better to pass it along the ground and create space/openings