The European Leagues & Competitions Thread V2

[kobematabryant 400]

Comparing English and German clubs in last 4 seasons of Champions league both won it once, German side had 2 more finalists, English side just one. In semifinals German side was 5 times, English side just 3, in Quarter finals German side 6 times, English side 6 times... and so on... you'll see that they're even better than English clubs. So I could ask the same thing.

Why the UEFA coefficient is so high for England?

Also Schalke was in semifinal in 2010/11 season. This season they played 1-1 on Stamford Bridge.

Also, in the last 3 years there were only two clubs from England and Germany in quarterfinals. (Chelsea, Manu, Bayern, Dortmund)

If you look in last 4 years you can add Spurs and Schalke.

If you look in last 5 years you can add Arsenal. (last 5 seasons matters for UEFA coefficient)

They get smashed sometimes, but that you can say even for Barca, Real or Bayern. Reading your post someone would say that Premier League is way above Bundesliga, and the fact is that difference between is just cca 2,5 points in coefficient. And in next 2 seasons they could even reach Premier League.

In fact, Premier League has that 2,5 points more because English clubs were better in Europa League in last 5 seasons.

Edit: Dont get me wrong, I'm not a fan of Bundesliga, I enjoy watching Premier League, but the quality gap is not even close as you want it to show.

It doesn't matter what team reached Semis and what not, but if you look at the history of the Champions League, only 2 German clubs have won it, one being obviously Munich and the other is Dortmund 1997.

That Schalke semi final doesn't mean much when they get thrashed in the semis 6-1 on agg. That 1-1 at the Bridge was a freak result.

Just look at it this way, Wolfsburg are currently ranked 2nd in their league and Everton are ranked 9th in the English League. The team that are currently 9th beat a team that is 2nd in another league in both home & AWAY, what does that tell you about the quality of the German sides?

[Term-X 7,891]

Why aren't we on the list?

https://uk.eurosport.yahoo.com/photos/the-best-football-team-buses-in-the-world-slideshow/

I remember reading Match magazine in 2004 and they once dedicated two pages to the coach Roman bought for us, all luxury..mod cons etc.

That article is only judging the outside of the coaches, i.e.. the paint work.

[dUMB 189]

It doesn't matter what team reached Semis and what not, but if you look at the history of the Champions League, only 2 German clubs have won it, one being obviously Munich and the other is Dortmund 1997.

That Schalke semi final doesn't mean much when they get thrashed in the semis 6-1 on agg. That 1-1 at the Bridge was a freak result.

Just look at it this way, Wolfsburg are currently ranked 2nd in their league and Everton are ranked 9th in the English League. The team that are currently 9th beat a team that is 2nd in another league in both home & AWAY, what does that tell you about the quality of the German sides?

And if I look at the history of the Champions League, only 3 English clubs have won it, thats just one more. (Until Chelsea it was also 2)

I watched the game against Wolfsburg yesterday and Wolfsburg was way better team on the pitch. and that are just 2 games, that doesn't mean nothing.

I could say the same when Dortmund won 2-0 against Arsenal.

You keep talking about what matters and what doesn't and about some 'freak' results. I gave you arguments and valid informations.

I saw nothing of that in your posts.

[kobematabryant 400]

And if I look at the history of the Champions League, only 3 English clubs have won it, thats just one more. (Until Chelsea it was also 2)

I watched the game against Wolfsburg yesterday and Wolfsburg was way better team on the pitch. and that are just 2 games, that doesn't mean nothing.

I could say the same when Dortmund won 2-0 against Arsenal.

You keep talking about what matters and what doesn't and about some 'freak' results. I gave you arguments and valid informations.

I saw nothing of that in your posts.

I was talking about it in the entire history, even including the European Cup. Man Utd, Nottingham Forest, Liverpool, Chelsea, Aston Villa all have won the European/Champions league. That is 5 teams. Only Dortmund & Munich have won for Germany.

Also on the point of Wolfsburg,I feel that people get the wrong idea when it comes down to attacking football and teams creating chances but not taking them. The better team on the pitch is simply the one with more goals, end of. You don't have to play attacking football to be known as a good team. Just look how we won the UCL in 2012. Everton that game were very clinical and took all their chances, they deserved the win.

The problem with Bundesliga, their overall coefficient is misleading. It doesn't take into account what Leverkusen and Schalke (3rd and 4th teams) position in the UCL. These teams are always crashing out of the UCL losing by 5+ goals by better teams. The whole UEFA coefficient thing for Germany is always going up because of ONE team's performance, which is Bayern Munich and this is enabling lesser able Europa League quality sides like Schalke, Leverkusen to compete.

[dUMB 189]

I was talking about it in the entire history, even including the European Cup. Man Utd, Nottingham Forest, Liverpool, Chelsea, Aston Villa all have won the European/Champions league. That is 5 teams. Only Dortmund & Munich have won for Germany.

Also on the point of Wolfsburg,I feel that people get the wrong idea when it comes down to attacking football and teams creating chances but not taking them. The better team on the pitch is simply the one with more goals, end of. You don't have to play attacking football to be known as a good team. Just look how we won the UCL in 2012. Everton that game were very clinical and took all their chances, they deserved the win.

The problem with Bundesliga, their overall coefficient is misleading. It doesn't take into account what Leverkusen and Schalke (3rd and 4th teams) position in the UCL. These teams are always crashing out of the UCL losing by 5+ goals by better teams. The whole UEFA coefficient thing for Germany is always going up because of ONE team's performance, which is Bayern Munich and this is enabling lesser able Europa League quality sides like Schalke, Leverkusen to compete.

Then you've forgot Hamburg (HSV) who won it in 1983.

There is no point in continuing this argument. I'll just qoute you again when we see how many clubs from Germany and England advanced to knockout stages, and later to quarter finals.

p.s. I agree with you that Premier League has more quality, but the gap between is not that big, especially not in the last few years...

[kobematabryant 400]

Then you've forgot Hamburg (HSV) who won it in 1983.

There is no point in continuing this argument. I'll just qoute you again when we see how many clubs from Germany and England advanced to knockout stages, and later to quarter finals.

p.s. I agree with you that Premier League has more quality, but the gap between is not that big, especially not in the last few years...

OK then, that's 3 German sides, still less than other leagues. Fair enough, you can quote all you want in the future stages of the UCL this season.

When it comes down to German and English sides advancing to knockout stages, I think it'd be the same. Arsenal, Liverpool, Chelsea for England, don't see City going through. Leverkusen, Dortmund, Munich advancing for Germany. We'll see where Arsenal and Liverpool get up to. I can assure you, Leverkusen will crash out 2nd round and Dortmund may make Quarters at most. Munich on the other hand will crash out in the Semis.

[iseah100 5,612]

"Abusive behavior"

[stroey 2,525]

Ballon d'or finalists:

Messi, Ronaldo, Neuer

[kobematabryant 400]

Ballon d'or finalists:

Messi, Ronaldo, Neuer

Why is Neuer even on the list?

[kobematabryant 400]

Hope Neuer doesn't win the Ballon D'or, it'd be an insult to greats like Lev Yashin. The only damn keeper to win the Balon D'or!

[iseah100 5,612]

Hope Neuer doesn't win the Ballon D'or, it'd be an insult to greats like Lev Yashin. The only damn keeper to win the Balon D'or!

Why? Neuer was a fucking beast this year, and who besides him should be nominated? Suarez wasn't even shortlisted. I think he's just there for the same reason names like Xavi, Iniesta, etc were there. Messi and Ronaldo are the only ones in contention.

[illmatic 901]

Neuer not even was the best goalkeeper in the year.

[kobematabryant 400]

Why? Neuer was a fucking beast this year, and who besides him should be nominated? Suarez wasn't even shortlisted. I think he's just there for the same reason names like Xavi, Iniesta, etc were there. Messi and Ronaldo are the only ones in contention.

WTF, Neuer wasn't even the best GK in the WC. Keylor Navas was far better than him. Neuer did not have the most amount of clean sheets either. On what basis was he nominated for Ballon D'Or? Look at this:

http://static.sportskeeda.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/01/xwcek6q-2094158.png

Shall I name you who else should've been shortlisted? Robben, Zlatan, Suarez.

[kobematabryant 400]

If Neuer is nominated for Ballon D'or, then why isn't our Courtois nominated? Conceded far less goals for Atletico, far less in the Champions league and even conceded less open play goals at the WC (counted up to Quarters).

[CHOULO19 24,332]

If Neuer is nominated for Ballon D'or, then why isn't our Courtois nominated? Conceded far less goals for Atletico, far less in the Champions league and even conceded less open play goals at the WC (counted up to Quarters).

Because in the real world Neuer is on a completely different level to any keeper in the world at the moment.

I never know what the criteria is for the Ballon D'or. If it is for the best player regardless of what his team won or how many he scored but based purely and completely on ability then Messi should have won the past 5 or 6 and should pick up this one as well. But I guess that doesn't 'sell'.

[kobematabryant 400]

Because in the real world Neuer is on a completely different level to any keeper in the world at the moment.

I never know what the criteria is for the Ballon D'or. If it is for the best player regardless of what his team won or how many he scored but based purely and completely on ability then Messi should have won the past 5 or 6 and should pick up this one as well. But I guess that doesn't 'sell'.

What do you mean by "different level to any keeper"? Are you talking about sweeper keeper styled play?

[CHOULO19 24,332]

What do you mean by "different level to any keeper"? Are you talking about sweeper keeper styled play?

That's obviously a huge bonus because he has incredible technical ability and reading of the game for a goalkeeper, but even if you take his keeping skills alone, he's the best in the world.

[Magic Lamps 11,677]

That's obviously a huge bonus because he incredible technical ability and reading of the game for a game, but even if you take his keeping skills alone, he's the best in the world.

But that only works because Neuer this year had incredible luck. Usually he has 2 or 3 mega blunders that cost a goal per season because of his advantageous style of play.

Being a regular observer of both IMO there are only a few major differences in quality between our own Tibo and Neuer. First obviously Neuer is more prepared to storm out of his goal for long balls and as a consequence often is found further up. But if that is a necessary advantage I don't know because not everytime he comes out of his goal is really necessary + I don't remember Tibo conceding once only because he did not chase a long ball....

Secondly Neuer usually parries over the bar or around the post instead of letting it bounce just in front of him. He concedes more corners but is not forced to further saves.

In terms of reflexes and box control, Tibo is even a tad better than Neuer. Though Neuer's kicking and ability on the ballin general is better.

The season he has had would make him deserve that Ballon D'or. We all know it will be Ronaldo. But what is that award still worth, when the player who actually had the best season of all is not even nominated.