Juan Mata

[Korea 734]

Honestly United would be quite a good fit for Mata. An attack line of RVP and Ronney with Mata just behind them would be lethal and they have midfielders to do the protection and dirty work. But Moyes may need to change his way a little bit.

I disagree, Kagawa doesn't get any minutes with United and Rooney is technically their #10. Mata would be forced to play winger and United always had pacy wingers (Ronaldo, Giggs, Nani, Valencia, even Young)....

The best team would of been Tottenham, but that boat has passed.

[LDN Blue 7,903]

I disagree, Kagawa doesn't get any minutes with United and Rooney is technically their #10. Mata would be forced to play winger and United always had pacy wingers (Ronaldo, Giggs, Nani, Valencia, even Young)....

The best team would of been Tottenham, but that boat has passed.

Definitely agree with you there. Kagawa is their most technically gifted player and he would really do a lot for them creatively. Fortunately, for us, Moyes doesn't see this from any point of view.

[Tomo 21,733]

Definitely agree with you there. Kagawa is their most technically gifted player and he would really do a lot for them creatively. Fortunately, for us, Moyes doesn't see this from any point of view.

Moyes is a dinosaur, at Everton he kept playing Phil Neville while the likes of Ross Barkely are sitting on the bench. Expect Nani, Kagawa and Zaha to be unused sub's, while Valencia, Young and Fellaini hog the game time.

[Barbara 15,149]

That's the part where i don't agree. In terms of creativity, he is way behind Mata. When Oscar creates, it's for him to take a shoot. But for the rest, he is a harder worker.

I disagree. There had been at least 4 passes where he put someone inside the box in the match against Fulham. I mean, Mata is definitely way more creative, but two things need to be said: 1) Oscar is capable of creating chances for others and he does 2) slowly, but consistently he's closing the gap between them.

I'm the first one to say I don't think he'll ever be creative as Mata because Mata is special, the way he sees the game and the way he makes it happen is something special, so imo Oscar will never reach that level, but he'll decrease the gap between them, as he's been doing. Compare both of his seasons or compare him in Chelsea and in Brazil NT and you can say he has some creativity on him. He has the normal amount + the ceiling, Mata is out of this world, so it's not fair to compare them.

For example, imo Özil (who in two matches has 4 assists - and more than I can count clear chances created that Arsenal players didn't capitalize) is very creative, but he doesn't have the special vision Mata does. Özil is extremely technical (more than Mata imo - but then again no surprise seeing who had been molding for three years), but Mata is more gifted. It's like one had to work more to be as lethal as he is and the other is more gifted.

Mata does give me the impression of being a lazy guy though - not in the pitch or in the trainings, but he doesn't seem like the guy that works that hard to improve his game (I mean effort, extra training, determination). He relies a lot on his natural abilities. I could be wrong because I don't watch the trainings, but based on his posture in the pitch and how he doesn't put any effort at all to get out of his way to defend, to press, to recover the ball, how he doesn't challenge himself at all when he has an off day, one can assume that he expects to improve by only sharpening his abilities with practice (in matches) and experience, not necessarily effort and hard work. See how Hazard has reacted much more positively about the work-rate and defending responsibilities. It's easier for Eden because he's bigger, stronger and faster, but you can see him putting a lot of effort on that, whereas I always see Mata as the guy relying on his gifts and going from there. It's not criticism at all, it's my take of his personality. He isn't a clutch kind of player - never will be - and sometimes clutch and extra effort is what gets you to places, no matter how gifted you are and the biggest example of that will always be Cristiano Ronaldo for me.

[polo 18]

bye bye Mata and ty for all , Oscar is the better option

[DJames 729]

Doesn't always have to win it this season. He can always go to another PL team and win it.

Don't jink it!!!! It's Chelsea only ?

[Magic Lamps 11,677]

To me it seems very unfair to Mata that he is being asked to prove himself & against Swindon.

I have never thought Mata would be in a position at Chelsea where he is literally fighting for his future.

It must be heartbreaking, everything is going brilliant, awards galore, then totally unwanted for no reason. Makes me sad, god knows how he feels.

I have no sympathy for Mata at all in this case. I like him, he is an amazing player and should defnitely feature more. He might have been player of the season twice but in fairly average squads. Mata prospers when the team plays for him. But in big matches, we can't do this, because he is not good enough. Drogba and Lampard used to win us the big matches when they were our best players. Mata can't do this. Ok he won us games vs Spuds and Utd. But come on. those were not vintage sides either. When Drogs&Lamps where in charge we were up there with the best, we could dominate the best ManU of all times, we beat Barcelona on various occasions, we slaughtered Bayern Munich. All other teams where way below us. With Mata in charge as our star player we did not really win those 3 titles courtesy of him. We defended, had Drogs&the old core + some decent share of luck. Still Mata assisted in all three finals. And here is my point.

Playing for Mata sets a ceiling for the team. We will win against most teams in the league but we are still way below those teams who got similar players to Mata just much much better. but we can play with Mata as one of our best players when he adapts. Mourinho wants him to do so. It is not some ludicrous conspiracy aka "Mou hates Spaniards" . Mata is only a bit part player for Spain. Xavi, Iniesta are better. Mata is a better attacker than both. a big part of the two barca player's game is that when they can not only hold the ball extremely well with their agility but they also can get it back immediately. When tehy lose the ball the close down the defender . mata never does this. Even Silva play over Mata for Spain. Just because he is that bit more physical and energetic to defend with the team. No Spain AM is a particularly good tackler. But they are good defensively cos their intelligent defensive movement always pressurizes the opponent. Mata can be offensively brilliant and defensively leisure at good teams like Valencia and the Chelsea of the last two years. But in Mou's title aspiring Chelsea he can't.

[BlueSunshine 672]

Kagawa is their most technically gifted player and he would really do a lot for them creatively. Fortunately, for us, Moyes doesn't see this from any point of view.

Manure fans could say the same thing about Jose and Mata...

[BlueLyon 9,359]

He deserves what he shows on the pitch. NOBODY should get preferential treatment based on what they did in the past. That is not how a club should run.

I said nothing about that he should start the games even if he is in bad form but what I said was that he should get more support from FANS because he deserves it as he held the club for two years. Learn that there is more than just trophies and good performances. Mata did a lot to our club in past two years and that is why he should have support. Period.

He is one of main reasons why we actualy got more popular among other fans. He is basicaly only player besides Lamps that no fan hates from our team. He made Chelsea play better, nicer football in last couple seasons, brought much needed creativity.

There is something called respect and loyalty. That is one hard thing to learn and show. Everyone can support man who is on top. What is harder is to support someone who is on bottom. Then you are true fan. Stop with no one is bigger than club bs. Mata is not bigger than club no one is, but he deserves some support right now.

Your first line just proves that you are cold trophy want fan with no real care to players. With Mata we might not play best atm, but he is still our player and give him some support. Should we have proper midfield and wingers who actualy defend and go back, then it would work with Mata. But jose bought Willian who is just another flair guy. He brought Etoo who gives shit in defensive duties. Should he buy Cavani, Vidal or Di Maria who are work horses, we would put balance with Mata lack of work. Ozil is same type of player but he still worked well at Rm and Arsenal. Its Jose who just wants some radical changes every time. He just cant work with current team, but needs to buy 10 players who suit him.

Sell Mata to United and then you will see what a player we have, but no on reckognises it just like with Studge, Lukaku,...

[Sir Mikel OBE 4,920]

I said nothing about that he should start the games even if he is in bad form but what I said was that he should get more support from FANS because he deserves it as he held the club for two years. Learn that there is more than just trophies and good performances. Mata did a lot to our club in past two years and that is why he should have support. Period.

He is one of main reasons why we actualy got more popular among other fans. He is basicaly only player besides Lamps that no fan hates from our team. He made Chelsea play better, nicer football in last couple seasons, brought much needed creativity.

There is something called respect and loyalty. That is one hard thing to learn and show. Everyone can support man who is on top. What is harder is to support someone who is on bottom. Then you are true fan. Stop with no one is bigger than club bs. Mata is not bigger than club no one is, but he deserves some support right now.

Your first line just proves that you are cold trophy want fan with no real care to players. With Mata we might not play best atm, but he is still our player and give him some support. Should we have proper midfield and wingers who actualy defend and go back, then it would work with Mata. But jose bought Willian who is just another flair guy. He brought Etoo who gives shit in defensive duties. Should he buy Cavani, Vidal or Di Maria who are work horses, we would put balance with Mata lack of work. Ozil is same type of player but he still worked well at Rm and Arsenal. Its Jose who just wants some radical changes every time. He just cant work with current team, but needs to buy 10 players who suit him.

Sell Mata to United and then you will see what a player we have, but no on reckognises it just like with Studge, Lukaku,...

Cold trophy fan? Save that mate, I support Chelsea FC. CHELSEA FC. Mata isnt the first good player we've had who has seen the bench, and he wont be the last. If I would have caught feelings about a player I like getting shown the pines then we all would have been gone long long ago.

Mata has to buy in the system. It is a simple as that. A team where Mata can do whatever he fucking wants may be good enough for Rafa, but isnt where we are going.

Mata also would do fuck all at Manchester united. They cant get in the creative players they have now, and Kagawa works much harder on both sides of the ball than I have ever seen Mata do.

Also you have not been paying attention if you dont think Eto'o has a defensive workrate. He, even out of shape, has been everywhere on the pitch to where he isnt even in the box many times. You cant go on about Loyalty, yet try to throw the players on the pitch giving their all for us under the bus. Loyalty should come first to your club.

If Mata is good enough he will get on the pitch. If he is not, then he will be sold. You'll get over it.

[Tomo 21,733]

I said nothing about that he should start the games even if he is in bad form but what I said was that he should get more support from FANS because he deserves it as he held the club for two years. Learn that there is more than just trophies and good performances. Mata did a lot to our club in past two years and that is why he should have support. Period.

He is one of main reasons why we actualy got more popular among other fans. He is basicaly only player besides Lamps that no fan hates from our team. He made Chelsea play better, nicer football in last couple seasons, brought much needed creativity.

There is something called respect and loyalty. That is one hard thing to learn and show. Everyone can support man who is on top. What is harder is to support someone who is on bottom. Then you are true fan. Stop with no one is bigger than club bs. Mata is not bigger than club no one is, but he deserves some support right now.

Your first line just proves that you are cold trophy want fan with no real care to players. With Mata we might not play best atm, but he is still our player and give him some support. Should we have proper midfield and wingers who actualy defend and go back, then it would work with Mata. But jose bought Willian who is just another flair guy. He brought Etoo who gives shit in defensive duties. Should he buy Cavani, Vidal or Di Maria who are work horses, we would put balance with Mata lack of work. Ozil is same type of player but he still worked well at Rm and Arsenal. Its Jose who just wants some radical changes every time. He just cant work with current team, but needs to buy 10 players who suit him.

Sell Mata to United and then you will see what a player we have, but no on reckognises it just like with Studge, Lukaku,...

No one doesn't "realize" what we have, but its quite clear Jose is trying to make Mata a better player, if he adds pressing and tracking back to his game, then he could quite conceivably be the best of the rest in the world, ie behind Ronaldo and Messi. That will also give him more chance of starting for Spain as they like a pressing game.

Why should we let Mata rest on his laurels after an amazing two years? he should be getting pushed to get better, and i hope it's not just him Mourinho does that too. After the record breaking double we rested on our laurels, and played players just because they scored 103 goals the previous campaign, and even when everything stagnated, Carlo still stuck to the same players on the hope that they will suddenly re click and start hitting teams for 7 again. Do you want me to remind you how that season ended and how we are still to this day paying the price for letting our squad so badly stagnate and rest on it's laurels?

In short Mata is amazing player, and Jose can quite clearly see that he can get even better, so is giving him a bit of tough love like Artinho (can't remember his new username off by heart ) said.

Too say Mata doesn't get support from fans is absolutely ludicrous, there's a big difference between supporting a player and placing them higher than the club.

[Jase 43,479]

Gabriele Marcotti's take on the Mata situation.

http://espnfc.com/blog/_/name/mondaymusings/id/566

Jose Mourinho was extremely (and, unusually, by the standards of today's managers) forthright in explaining his reasons for dropping Juan Mata. The Chelsea boss explained that Oscar is his preferred choice to play in the hole and, given that he plays there for Brazil, it makes sense. That means that, if Mata, wants to get on to the pitch, he needs to play wide in Mourinho's 4-2-3-1.

Two problems with that. In Kevin De Bruyne, Eden Hazard, Willian and Andre Schurrle, he's competing with four others guys for two slots.

The other issue is that Mata lacks the speed and athleticism to perform in that role, given the style Mourinho wants to play. It's not a question of talent -- he may well be the most gifted player on this squad -- it's simply that, in his current incarnation, other players are a better fit.

That, in a nutshell, is Mourinho's take. Which is fine, he's the guy in charge, he's entitled to it. That said, it's a bit silly to simply say it's a matter of fitness and doing defensive work. Mata can train all day every day, he's not going to acquire speed and athleticism on the training ground. If you want to have a Mata in your side, you need to make allowances for him, which is what Rafa Benitez did. (But then he didn't have Schurrle, De Bruyne or Willian.)

The one thing that doesn't quite add up is this. It's not as if Chelsea only discovered Mata's physical attributes last week. And it's not as if someone as meticulous as Mourinho only figured out how he wanted to play in September.

So why didn't Chelsea cash in on Mata when they had the chance? Why -- in this era of Financial Fair Play -- did they not halve the nearly $90m transfer deficit by moving him on? That part remains a mystery. And you suspect it wasn't entirely Mourinho's decision.

On Saturday, in the 2-0 win over Fulham, Chelsea looked labored and, more worryingly, narrow. Mourinho's sides -- particularly this season -- don't push the fullbacks on, which means width must come from the wingers. But both Schurrle and Hazard relentlessly cut inside, rather than staying wide to stretch the opposing back four. Things only really improved when Oscar and Hazard began switching positions in the second half and the Brazilian was able to find some space against Fulham's two banks of four.

[ephreak 42]

To be honest. I just can´t see Mata stay in Chelsea past next summer transfer.

It feels like Mourinho decided before he took over Chelsea job who his nr 10 player is going to be. Now you may be asking why we didn´t sell Mata this summer, and I think that is because it would destroy all the good feeling that Mourinhos great comeback as manager for Chelsea would bring. And to actually sell our best player the last two years would make every fan go crazy.

I suspect that the board decided to ride out this bullshit about him, that he suddenly isn´t good enough to play as nr 10 role, until next summer.

[CHOULO19 24,332]

Manure fans could say the same thing about Jose and Mata...

Except we have players similar to Mata who can cover for him, while Kagawa is their only genuine attacking midfielder.

[TorontoChelsea 4,064]

Gabriele Marcotti's take on the Mata situation.

http://espnfc.com/blog/_/name/mondaymusings/id/566

I tend to agree with this. Mata simply doesn't have the attributes that Mourinho wants from a winger. If you want Mata on your team, you need to largely build an attack around him. This is true of a almost any top offensive player. To me, this whole thing seems disingenuous and a way to isolate Mata without seeming like the bad guy. Mourinho is not going to make him a better player. We've seen the best of Mata which is pretty fantastic and know what he can and can't do. Take any player and say "you have to play at a position and role you're clearly not suited for and compete with 4 other players for it" and what do you expect to happen? If Mourinho didn't like the way Chelsea played with Mata on the team, then why the hell is he still here? Mata as the centrepiece of your offense is incredibly valuable. Mata as a squad player, playing a system and position that doesn't fit him is not worth a fraction of what Chelsea could get for him. I would have been fine if Chelsea had sold him, that would have made sense to me, but this treatment is much worse.

[Barbara 15,149]

When Mourinho keeps saying he's not ready to move Oscar from position doesn't it imply he may be able to move him later? I'm still not 100% sure as you guys are that he wants to use Mata in the wing. He could have said he won't ever move Oscar from the position or that the position's is Oscar's and will continue to be while he'll welcome Mata elsewhere. But what he really said is that when Mata shows him he'll play and that now he isn't ready to move Oscar.

So I'd hold the assumption that Mata will play in the wing because that's contradictory and stupid. As I said in some other match Mourinho may be counting on Mata to become the kind of #10 he needs and use Oscar's versatility to play him either in the wing or in the pivot. I'd hate to see Oscar on either, but if that's what's best for the team, so be it. There are no doubts offensively and creatively Mata is the best #10. If he can work on his shortcomings and the liabilities he offers to the whole system, of course he should be the #10. The defensive demands in the middle are lesser than in the wings. I'd reserve judgment about that for now because since that comment (prior to Willian's signing) back in the pre-season where he said he likes his wingers to play with the wrong foot, he has never once ever since repeated he wants Mata to play in the wing (not that I recall).

[remains of the day 564]

If Mourinho didn't like the way Chelsea played with Mata on the team, then why the hell is he still here? Mata as the centrepiece of your offense is incredibly valuable. Mata as a squad player, playing a system and position that doesn't fit him is not worth a fraction of what Chelsea could get for him. I would have been fine if Chelsea had sold him, that would have made sense to me, but this treatment is much worse.

Absolutely. Besides the unfair treatment - business wise, it makes no sense. I would think that the longer Mata spends on the bench, the lower his value will drop. If he isn't going to be part of Jose's plans, then I would have just preferred him to be sold rather than him being a squad player. But I think there's probably more to this than we know, it's entirely possible that Mourinho would have preferred to move him on, but perhaps the club weren't prepared to risk losing their investment. Say Mourinho tells the club that Mata is surplus to him and sanctions a transfer, the club backs him and sells Mata. After one season, it doesn't work out with Jose and both parties part ways. Then the club basically would have let go of an excellent, young player because (at the time) he didn't fit into the manager's plans, a manager who is now gone. This might explain why (according to some rumours) the club were considering a loan option rather than a permanent transfer.

[Jase 43,479]

I tend to agree with this. Mata simply doesn't have the attributes that Mourinho wants from a winger. If you want Mata on your team, you need to largely build an attack around him. This is true of a almost any top offensive player. To me, this whole thing seems disingenuous and a way to isolate Mata without seeming like the bad guy. Mourinho is not going to make him a better player. We've seen the best of Mata which is pretty fantastic and know what he can and can't do. Take any player and say "you have to play at a position and role you're clearly not suited for and compete with 4 other players for it" and what do you expect to happen? If Mourinho didn't like the way Chelsea played with Mata on the team, then why the hell is he still here? Mata as the centrepiece of your offense is incredibly valuable. Mata as a squad player, playing a system and position that doesn't fit him is not worth a fraction of what Chelsea could get for him. I would have been fine if Chelsea had sold him, that would have made sense to me, but this treatment is much worse.

Think the reason we did not sell him was because of this, as ephreak has mentioned here.

It feels like Mourinho decided before he took over Chelsea job who his nr 10 player is going to be. Now you may be asking why we didn´t sell Mata this summer, and I think that is because it would destroy all the good feeling that Mourinhos great comeback as manager for Chelsea would bring. And to actually sell our best player the last two years would make every fan go crazy.

If anything, it seems that Mourinho is looking for a reason to sell Mata so that it doesn't piss off the fans that much as opposed to him just doing so when he came in. Either that or he did want to sell him but the club prevented him from doing so.