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Jason

29. Kai Havertz

Started by Jason,

362 posts in this topic
1 hour ago, DDA said:

I know, I know. Still, the lack of attacking cohesion is a little worrying... New signings and injuries are not helping the cause but there were warning signs of a shitshow towards the back of end the covid return and it seems we will have to endure more of it in the coming weeks. 

I think Havertz suffers from his own versatility. We said before he came that he could do well in several positions, and clearly we see that Frank feels likewise. Until our first choices are back he will most likely be moved around to wherever we have a gap. 

 

Most likely we won't see the new Chelsea until after the international break, and even then it will take months to create some kind of cohesion. 

I don't rate Frank very highly as a tactician, but even if he was one it would be a tall task to expect six new players (of which five are from a different league) in the starting eleven to start playing as if they know what to expect from each other. 
We will have to rely for some time on individual brilliance and flair. 

 

 

 

 

 

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11 minutes ago, Rekin said:

I think Havertz suffers from his own versatility. We said before he came that he could do well in several positions, and clearly we see that Frank feels likewise. Until our first choices are back he will most likely be moved around to wherever we have a gap. 

Funny thing is, even with the absentees, we actually still have enough options for now, for example, to play Havertz as the No.10 with Mount and CHO as the wingers but that didn't happen in any of the two games.

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Doing well in a few positions doesn't mean he can play anywhere, it means he still offers something but it's a simple equation when you watch him he is way more ineffective from wide than centrally.

If FL continues with him wide then we have problems, both with him and why we bought him. 

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3 minutes ago, Special Juan said:

Doing well in a few positions doesn't mean he can play anywhere, it means he still offers something but it's a simple equation when you watch him he is way more ineffective from wide than centrally.

If FL continues with him wide then we have problems, both with him and why we bought him. 

Isnt this down to FL tho? Not Kais fault hes not playing to the strengths WE think he should play.

I got no fret at all about him coming good. Tho I do worry about FL more.

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Just now, Unionjack said:

Isnt this down to FL tho? Not Kais fault hes not playing to the strengths WE think he should play.

I got no fret at all about him coming good. Tho I do worry about FL more.

Exactly.

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Why are people so impatient after two matches. When Pulisic and Ziyech are fit to play, he will play as a no. 10. I remember people went nuts when Pulisic did not start couple of matches at first to get used tk everything.

Funny thing to me is that Havertz actually is a decent RW and false 9. In my opinion, his best position is actually false 9 long term wise. But on here people are trying to make Lampard look clueless for playing Havertz in those positions, even though he has played those positions last season and was much better than as a no. 8 and no. 10. People forget that he is very inconsistent as a midfielder

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1 minute ago, killer1257 said:

Why are people so impatient after two matches. When Pulisic and Ziyech are fit to play, he will play as a no. 10. I remember people went nuts when Pulisic did not start couple of matches at first to get used tk everything.

Funny thing to me is that Havertz actually is a decent RW and false 9. In my opinion, his best position is actually false 9 long term wise. But on here people are trying to make Lampard look clueless for playing Havertz in those positions, even though he has played those positions last season and was much better than as a no. 8 and no. 10. People forget that he is very inconsistent as a midfielder

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Why are you surprised?....is not same sets of people that wants the club to loan Pulisic this same time last year...

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3 minutes ago, Special Juan said:

Exactly.

Im no way a footballing brain. I cant see moves that are building up. I just watch the over all game. I rewatch it to see the moves etc and rewind blah blah

BUT even with my basic viewers brain I can tell is a formation or team selection isnt working. And see that other things would maybe work better.

So I never understand why the manager doesnt see that FAR earlier than me and do summet about it
If he sees that Kai would be netter as ACM WTF doesnt he move him there?

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10 minutes ago, killer1257 said:

Why are people so impatient after two matches. When Pulisic and Ziyech are fit to play, he will play as a no. 10. I remember people went nuts when Pulisic did not start couple of matches at first to get used tk everything.

Funny thing to me is that Havertz actually is a decent RW and false 9. In my opinion, his best position is actually false 9 long term wise. But on here people are trying to make Lampard look clueless for playing Havertz in those positions, even though he has played those positions last season and was much better than as a no. 8 and no. 10. People forget that he is very inconsistent as a midfielder

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I don't think people actually know Havertz and his play properly. So there is not much to forget really.

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4 minutes ago, killer1257 said:

Why are people so impatient after two matches. When Pulisic and Ziyech are fit to play, he will play as a no. 10. I remember people went nuts when Pulisic did not start couple of matches at first to get used tk everything.

Funny thing to me is that Havertz actually is a decent RW and false 9. In my opinion, his best position is actually false 9 long term wise. But on here people are trying to make Lampard look clueless for playing Havertz in those positions, even though he has played those positions last season and was much better than as a no. 8 and no. 10. People forget that he is very inconsistent as a midfielder

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A question, why can't Havertz be used as a No.10 now and flanked by Mount and CHO for example? 

The Havertz situation is also different to Pulisic last season. Havertz is at least getting game and looks set to continue getting it while Pulisic started and got dropped to be eased in. Havertz's versatility is useful but is it useful that he is being moved around so much when he is still in that development age? Will it help him to settle into the squad, the league etc? Plus, I think people want to see what he can do and want to see him contribute to the team in a positive manner because so far, it has been average at best. He almost played like an auxiliary full back at Brighton and was treated like a target man against Liverpool. It's only two games I know but that just feels like an incredible waste for someone of his talent. 

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A question, why can't Havertz be used as a No.10 now and flanked by Mount and CHO for example? 
The Havertz situation is also different to Pulisic last season. Havertz is at least getting game and looks set to continue getting it while Pulisic started and got dropped to be eased in. Havertz's versatility is useful but is it useful that he is being moved around so much when he is still in that development age? Will it help him to settle into the squad, the league etc? Plus, I think people want to see what he can do and want to see him contribute to the team in a positive manner because so far, it has been average at best. He almost played like an auxiliary full back at Brighton and was treated like a target man against Liverpool. It's only two games I know but that just feels like an incredible waste for someone of his talent. 


I agree with you that CHO should have played, but when I read Lampard's comments on CHO, CHO does either not deliver in training and/or Lamps does not like him as a player. So CHO is out of the picture and I do not why. And he also has to do something with Ruben, who waited a year to play a match and that does not help either. Havertz had 5 days of training before he started against Brighton. Werner and Ziyech have been training 2 months for Chelsea now and both have looked sharp in our short pre season and Werner has looked good in the first two matches. Havertz, who lacks pressing qualities, starting in his first match as a no. 10 might have been too much for him, especially considering the fact that he is inconsistent as a midfielder. He only played 2 matches in two different positions. Wait more matches when everyone is fit to see in which position Havertz will play long term wise. Ziyech will play RW, Puli LW, Werner CF and Kai as a no. 10.

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3 minutes ago, killer1257 said:


 Ziyech will play RW, Puli LW, Werner CF and Kai as a no. 10.

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That makes far to much sense tho!

 

And as I said before those 4 should be fluid on the pitch. I see them all swapping round once they know each others moves.

These are players who should be here years so will get to read each other more n more,

Klopps lot have been together long ebough to do that.

We will get there.

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1 hour ago, Special Juan said:

Doing well in a few positions doesn't mean he can play anywhere, it means he still offers something but it's a simple equation when you watch him he is way more ineffective from wide than centrally.

If FL continues with him wide then we have problems, both with him and why we bought him. 

I don't think when he play as rw he really play as rw, he still play narrow.

 

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His awareness is way off, but that will come I hope.

His tackling is good and his to work in tight areas is good. I want to see him get on the ball this half and another goal.

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First game in a natural position for him leads to three goals, an uncredited assist and two passes that really should have been assists. Quite a difference from the wing.

I don't think he was perfect this game stats aside, he gave the ball away a few times and was a bit nonchalant in his work rate here and there.
Mount is the less talented but harder working twin of Kai, they are so similar on the pitch that I honestly confuse them regularly. 

Anyway, clearly has heaps of talent and just needs to get more matchfit and learn what to expect from his new teammates. 

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He gets sharper, Ziyech and Pulisic get fit, and Werner/Tammy in form in front of him....he will be a statistical monster.

This is why people should be patient with him. He's not anywhere near fit yet and will take a run of games in the position he played today to get up to speed.

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