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Fulham Broadway

The Mourinho Thread

Started by Fulham Broadway,

It will take something drastic like an abramovich intervention, giving him a mandate to play the sort of football that is befitting a team of our status and resources. And even then, im honestly not sure jose is capable of it. Some People fail to realise that any idiot can play/coach disjointed,poorly rehearsed, lacklustre gungho football but only select few managers are actually capable of coaching well cordinated, precise,creative attacking football consistently and then have the conviction to stick to it and perfect it.

Even if jose wins the champions league and is given a mandate to change his approach, im not so sure he's capable of going toe to toe with the big teams in the big games playing high quality attacking football

And even if by surprise, he's able to deliver such football, the moment it goes wrong or appears to not be going according to plan his natural instinct will kick in and he will revert to his comfort zone anyway. Either way, the sort of football people are demanding isn't going to happen under jose.

What a load of shite.

Unless next season I am proven wrong, the only reason why we don't play such flowing football is because the players in some positions are inadequate for what we need, at least now.

For example, we need a high line to play offensive football, and against bigger sides that press us that becomes a problem, which is why we retreat, imo. Our youngest lineup possible is passable but firstly he never plays Azpi and Luis together, and Ivanovic causes severe weaknesses on our defence, especially when it's Cahill who is exposed. (Azpi-Zouma-Terry-Luis) and to fix this we need a new fullback to act as second choice to Azpi/Luis and a fast centre back to pair with Zouma against such sides.

Another is that Matic is being left with too much work to do in midfield, I noticed that only when Oscar came on in our last match in a 4-3-3 that midfield stopped getting raped... but I think that only Koke or Pogba could improve this area of midfield, but with a high line this would have the effect of taking pressure off the mid.

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What a load of shite.

Unless next season I am proven wrong, the only reason why we don't play such flowing football is because the players in some positions are inadequate for what we need, at least now.

For example, we need a high line to play offensive football, and against bigger sides that press us that becomes a problem, which is why we retreat, imo. Our youngest lineup possible is passable but firstly he never plays Azpi and Luis together, and Ivanovic causes severe weaknesses on our defence, especially when it's Cahill who is exposed. (Azpi-Zouma-Terry-Luis) and to fix this we need a new fullback to act as second choice to Azpi/Luis and a fast centre back to pair with Zouma against such sides.

Another is that Matic is being left with too much work to do in midfield, I noticed that only when Oscar came on in our last match in a 4-3-3 that midfield stopped getting raped... but I think that only Koke or Pogba could improve this area of midfield, but with a high line this would have the effect of taking pressure off the mid.

well, isn't that Mourinho's fault

he's had 4 windows now to shape his squad

The Chels, lionsden and Korial like this

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well, isn't that Mourinho's fault

he's had 4 windows now to shape his squad

Well,,, this team was an absolute disgrace 4 windows ago...

It's really funny all that talk about winning the Premiere it's not that good, or we need to improve if we want to win the CHampions... but the reality is that this team had no quality at all, the person that built the team did an awful job, and Chelsea was fighting for a CHampions League spot at that time (we were just like Arsenal).

By the way without Mourinho the titles won and the level of game in the last 6 years was really bad also. It's really cool to look at the future... 2 years ago you were thanking Benitez because he won a minor title and he could do an Arsenal on League.

If United continues to spend 200M£ without selling players every season you need to start asking the club to spend something like that on the team (and not 30M£ per season like in the last 2) because it's imposible to fight regularly with a team that spends 5 or 6 times the money you are spending.

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What a load of shite.

Unless next season I am proven wrong, the only reason why we don't play such flowing football is because the players in some positions are inadequate for what we need, at least now.

For example, we need a high line to play offensive football, and against bigger sides that press us that becomes a problem, which is why we retreat, imo. Our youngest lineup possible is passable but firstly he never plays Azpi and Luis together, and Ivanovic causes severe weaknesses on our defence, especially when it's Cahill who is exposed. (Azpi-Zouma-Terry-Luis) and to fix this we need a new fullback to act as second choice to Azpi/Luis and a fast centre back to pair with Zouma against such sides.

Another is that Matic is being left with too much work to do in midfield, I noticed that only when Oscar came on in our last match in a 4-3-3 that midfield stopped getting raped... but I think that only Koke or Pogba could improve this area of midfield, but with a high line this would have the effect of taking pressure off the mid.

First off it's the managers responsibility and duty to recognise and fix the inadequacies of his team and he's had two full seasons to do so that's after making empty and boastful promises of seeking to play more attacking football. He even said we have no other choice but to play attacking football due to the type and profile of players we have which contradicts your point and his actions so far.

Now how did riijkard and guardiola barca manage to play highline and free flowing football with puyol (jt lite) as the main CB. Mertasacker and koscienly are no quicker or more suitable to playing highline than jt and cahill/zouma. Fernando hiero and riofor madrid and utd respectively werent exactly pacy either. The way I see it, your argument is just a load of excuses.

our squad is sufficient enough to play better football than we have done thos season and if jose was a manager capable of playing such football, he would have found a way

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People complaining abt out style of play. Why?

Said style of play has us 6 pts clear w/ a game in hand & a lg cup

Because the club has invested enough money to guarantee a brand of football that shouldn't rely on luck and on the class of a single player in Hazard week in, week out.
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Because the club has invested enough money to guarantee a brand of football that shouldn't rely on luck and on the class of a single player in Hazard week in, week out.

Where is that money in Mourinho era? Because we spent less money than Manchester United, Manchester City and Arsenal in the last 2 seasons (the difference between what we bought and our sells)... and we are not only the team with the best evolution but also the best team in the country.

You can moan what you want, but this is the reality.

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Where is that money in Mourinho era? Because we spent less money than Manchester United, Manchester City and Arsenal in the last 2 seasons (the difference between what we bought and our sells)... and we are not only the team with the best evolution but also the best team in the country.

You can moan what you want, but this is the reality.

Why do only the last 2 seasons matter? Excuse me Mourinho was given a full squad instead of only 2 or 3 players. The mere reason we haven't spent much money during Mou's second time here is because we have had good enough players already in the team before Mou arrived that we then sold to make money and room for "Mou players".

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It will take something drastic like an abramovich intervention, giving him a mandate to play the sort of football that is befitting a team of our status and resources. And even then, im honestly not sure jose is capable of it. Some People fail to realise that any idiot can play/coach disjointed,poorly rehearsed, lacklustre gungho football but only select few managers are actually capable of coaching well cordinated, precise,creative attacking football consistently and then have the conviction to stick to it and perfect it.

Even if jose wins the champions league and is given a mandate to change his approach, im not so sure he's capable of going toe to toe with the big teams in the big games playing high quality attacking football

And even if by surprise, he's able to deliver such football, the moment it goes wrong or appears to not be going according to plan his natural instinct will kick in and he will revert to his comfort zone anyway. Either way, the sort of football people are demanding isn't going to happen under jose.

SAD but true I think

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Unless next season I am proven wrong, the only reason why we don't play such flowing football is because the players in some positions are inadequate for what we need, at least now. For example, we need a high line to play offensive football, and against bigger sides that press us that becomes a problem, which is why we retreat, imo. Our youngest lineup possible is passable but firstly he never plays Azpi and Luis together, and Ivanovic causes severe weaknesses on our defence, especially when it's Cahill who is exposed. (Azpi-Zouma-Terry-Luis) and to fix this we need a new fullback to act as second choice to Azpi/Luis and a fast centre back to pair with Zouma against such sides.

We have within our squad the ability to change the defence such that we are capable of playing a more proactive defensive game (as you say: Azpi, Zouma, Terry, Luis) but Jose hasn't suggested that he is interested in making these changes. If he did then we'd be lining up with more mobile defenders who are more compatible with a high-intensity pressing game but ultimately he has shown clear preference to the current defence even though it is very limiting in the big games especially, perhaps because it gives him an excuse to play the reactive, passive football he craves.

Barcelona have been the ultimate example of how good a pressing team can be but the first lesson to take from their example is the quality of players required to succeed that way. Forget their defenders, that's not how Barca defend. They recover the ball high and they are exceptionally good at retaining it once they have. That's because they have a critical mass of players who can receive a pass, even a bad one, in tight situations and do something positive with it. We don't.

Sure Barcelona are a team with technically excellent players all-round but you don't need that to play a pressing game successfully as the likes of Leverkusen and Atletico have shown.

Blue Colored Sky and Myself like this

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I think we can all agree Jose has been over-conservative in a lot of our big matches this season. If we manage to win the league,hopefully a lot of the pressure will be off his shoulders. I hope he will know exactly what to do in the summer transfer window to increase the team's flexibility in terms of playing different styles at different stages of the game.

Koke - Will allow us to keep the ball and also have an eye for goal when the team is ahead. Him being a very complete player gives us a huge advantage in these situations.

Varane - Cahill has been a disgrace this season and loses it when the slightest things go against him. Varane will be our present and our future alongside Zouma.

Kondogbia - We really can't expect Fabregas to be battling it out in midfield. If the team is under huge pressure and we need more defensive qualities on the pitch, Kondogbia is our answer. Positionally very good unlike Ramires and Mikel and attacking wise he good as well. Other option: Khedira.

Icardi/Dybala - I feel the need for another striker because Drogba doesn't seem to cut it anymore. Most of top teams have more than 1 world class strikere and although these two are not world class, they have a huge potential to be so. Also I really can't find a striker who is willing to sit on the bench.

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We have within our squad the ability to change the defence such that we are capable of playing a more proactive defensive game (as you say: Azpi, Zouma, Terry, Luis) but Jose hasn't suggested that he is interested in making these changes. If he did then we'd be lining up with more mobile defenders who are more compatible with a high-intensity pressing game but ultimately he has shown clear preference to the current defence even though it is very limiting in the big games especially, perhaps because it gives him an excuse to play the reactive football he craves.

Sure Barcelona are a team with technically excellent players all-round but you don't need that to play a pressing game successfully as the likes of Leverkusen and Atletico have shown.

Atleti are an excellent team, packed with outstanding players. Leverkausen have won what since 2002 and what in the ten years before that?

I suppose the word successfully can be defined in different ways. At Chelsea I think it defines winning trophies. It's up to Bayer fans and officials to decide what success means to them.

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And even if by surprise, he's able to deliver such football, the moment it goes wrong or appears to not be going according to plan his natural instinct will kick in and he will revert to his comfort zone anyway. Either way, the sort of football people are demanding isn't going to happen under jose.

Didn't that happen once already ? After Sunderland game in League Cup in December 2013, Jose said that scrapping wins and winning by one goal in the easiest thing in football. Since then we've reverted to his shell and as you said 'comford zone' by playing very conserative with Ivanovic-Cahill-Terry-Azpilicueta back line almost every time with maximum protection. I think we played better and more expansive at the beginnig of this season but even then when big game arrived or away game then we reverted to usual self.

So even when we indeed are going to sign more of his players, players that suits his demands and style of play (which is not only neutralizing opponents, right ?), a trusted lieutenants but with more quality, then I'm not sure that he doesn't pull Sunderland speech all over again and revert to his unstrained land ...

I fully believe that he deserves time to form his team with majority of players that he pickes to be the ones AND THEN BE JUDGED but I simply can't get over that the more could be done now. He said about long term plans many times but currently it's short term solutions by him all over again.

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I think Jose has done brilliant short-term work now - 2 trophies in 2 years is very good, regardless of quality of todays league. He deserves time to done the job on the long term and get final grades for that in the future seasons.

Anyone of you have read Carlo Ancelotti's biography ? He talks there about his first meeting with Abramovich in Paris (when he moved like a spy not to be spotted by anyone because he still had a contract with Milan - funny story). During his first meeting with the boss, Roman said to him "My team lacks identity. I see other teams like Barcelona with recognisable style and I don't see anything like that in my team. I want to have team with clear identity ... Can you deliver that to me ?" That's what Roman emphasised the most as Carlo said.

I just reminded myself about this and I think our boss isn't overly happy with current team. If he knows football as is said he knows and still has freak about clear identity then Jose hasn't delivered yet what Roman wants. I believe that Jose knows what our owner is expecting and after 2 years of short-term solutions he has to build long-term plan starting from next season. For example, the youths from the Academy have to start playing and not be numbers you can mess about, playing style without overly protection but with real pressing game.

We nullified Spurs by sacrifing Zouma to exclude Ericksen from the game, we put Azpilcueta on exterminate mission against Filipe in last year Champions League semi-final. We're not talking about nullifing Messi, Neymar or Robben/Ribery FFS but about teams against which we should be on top. We haven't yet imposed ourself against big side from the beginning and we're the big team.

We played some very good stuff against respectable team for example against Liverpool last year in December at home when we conceded early. We were on top for majority of the game, playing very good. The same happened again this season in the away fixture, until we conceded we were in our shell, after we conceded we imposed ourself, creating lots of chances. Against Spurs in autumn 2013 in an away game, we played carefully and shit in the first half eventually conceded a goal, then in the second we were absolutely brilliant, playing dominant football for majority of the game when our players had mind adjusted 'to score' not to 'not concede'. Against PSG last year in the away game, we conceded early but then for that 20-25 minutes spell we played some brilliant stuff because we really WANTED to score. And I don't think that's a coincidence. After we scored against PSG and LFC (both away games) and had positive result then we retreated again and had a hard time once more.

These examples just give me reasons to think that even with this side more could be done, for real. When we're not afraid to lose we can impose and be on top despite having Willians, Oscars etc. But we rarely have that mindset 'to score' against big teams, only looking to neutralize them.

But if Jose is saying that no, we can't impose ourself and Roman wants to have an identity in his side, then there is conflict of interests. Roman will help Jose with financial fundings and let's hope vice-versa will be done too.

Mourinho said something like that after the PSG game. He said the players didn't know how to handle the pressure of being a man up and with the lead. When we don't need to get a goal, we suddenly react over cautiously.

That's why we need to win the league. After that we'll go into games having nothing to lose since we've won the big trophy already...

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Atleti is a team packed with outstanding players but we aren't? I don't buy the excuse that a team needs everyone to be technically good à la Barcelona to play a pressing game. It's simply not true. If you watched the recent Atleti-Leverkusen games then you'll have noticed that both teams are excellent at pressing the opposition even though they are not so good at being pressed themselves (since they are not technically outstanding). You argue that because the likes of Willian, Oscar, Costa, Ramires, etc. wouldn't get in the Barca squad, that somehow justifies Jose's excessively passive and reactive big-game approach. I can't agree with that.

My argument is that if we played the high press game with our squad we'd concede possession far too often in dangerous situations and get countered to death. Pick the best back five on the planet, put them in that situation and they'd concede goals for fun. If we played that way we'd win as much as Leverkausen do.

Sides hoping to be successful playing that style need to be packed with players who are good at recovering and retaining possession. That requires a critical mass of players with high energy, great touch, poise in possession, tight close control, rapid speed of thought and accurate passing. I say a critical mass because it only takes one Ramires, Willian, Oscar, or Mikel to break the chain and we not only have those four, we also have more where they came from.

My point re Barca is that most of our starters wouldn't even get in their squad precisely because our lot don't have the qualities to play the Barca way. I know it's only my opinion but I simply do not believe you are right to think that our current squad can be successful playing the way you want us to. The inescapable conclusion is that you rate our players more highly than I do.

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