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11. Timo Werner


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Last time I played football myself in a normal sized pitch was when I was at college, many years ago.
I remember three players from that match, apart from myself.
The centre forward who was a tall guy and he scored our goal. But I did n't like him because he had his eyes always on the floor.
Also a fast right winger we had and a talented Portuguese centre half - the Beckenbauer of the team.
I think what makes a lot of difference is not having your eyes always on the floor when in possession but you should also be capable of
looking around and this is true not only for the midfielders but also for the attackers.
I think that's Werner's main problem. His eyes are fixed on the floor.
But yesterday it was n't that either. It was more like the opposite of what I 'm saying. He thinks he can guide it in with his left foot but fails to make proper contact and it's not even a shot at goal what he does. In fact it was quite easy for him to stop the ball and shoot with the right foot - no opponents near by and it was too close for the goalkeeper to manage a save.
 

 

 

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Werner has never been the most clinical of players. Last season in the Bundesliga he recorded 20 big chances missed, only second to Lewandowski at 24. That said, it comes with the territory. He's

Really taking the piss now 

he has a real mentality off the field but also different level on it. Hard doesn't faze him, but he's a killer, he is going to get tons of goals this season.

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1 hour ago, cosmicway said:

Last time I played football myself in a normal sized pitch was when I was at college, many years ago.
I remember three players from that match, apart from myself.
The centre forward who was a tall guy and he scored our goal. But I did n't like him because he had his eyes always on the floor.
Also a fast right winger we had and a talented Portuguese centre half - the Beckenbauer of the team.
I think what makes a lot of difference is not having your eyes always on the floor when in possession but you should also be capable of
looking around and this is true not only for the midfielders but also for the attackers.
I think that's Werner's main problem. His eyes are fixed on the floor.
But yesterday it was n't that either. It was more like the opposite of what I 'm saying. He thinks he can guide it in with his left foot but fails to make proper contact and it's not even a shot at goal what he does. In fact it was quite easy for him to stop the ball and shoot with the right foot - no opponents near by and it was too close for the goalkeeper to manage a save.
 

 

 

It’s true he made it difficult for himself not realising the amount of time and space he got and rushed it with his left foot. But I am not sure he should have stopped and taken with his right.  Still he should score that one blind folded. I was never a very talented player but I used to train that exact movement with my bro. A simple pass or one two coming from the left side while moving at pace and what I remember is that any kind of proper contact would do even with your shin or ankle. so just be aware of your surroundings, position your body towards the ball not across it as Werner does and just swing at it. It must be deeply psychological. it appears that the universe does not want him to score or that he wants to avoid it. The one vs Leeds where he shins it onto the bar still will remain the worst IMO but his miss compilations remain rich. Even on form he has always used to miss easy chances but would go on and score a goal the same match . Now we are seeing him getting fewer yet easier chances and really expertly missing them all. There is something deeply wrong with his head

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Feel for him but he should take some mental time off. He's obviously in his own head to be missing so many easy chances this season.

Seems like he's got good positioning and obviously great speed but the finishing has never been clinical enough. 

Still young so I hope he snaps out of it but in the mean time he needs to sit

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Tuchel on Werner's form...

https://www.football.london/Chelsea-fc/news/thomas-tuchel-Chelsea-press-conference-20309382

"It was a bad pass from Ilkay Gundogan is how I see it! I'm only joking. He missed that chance and everybody is passionate to talk about it which is a bit annoying.

It's easy at the moment to point the finger at Timo, which I can't understand. I am happy he is back here.

To look at it honestly, he is in a moment where he lacks confidence and things aren't too easy. The goals are not working out as usual but he works out for us.

He still scores for us, still assists for us, still wins penalties. If this is the most critical point of his career you can say it's still pretty impressive so far.

Timo has scored since he was five years old and he never stopped. So he can trust his brain and body, it will come back. That's easier said than done.

Yesterday I sent him in from training because he wanted to do extra finishing with us. But I sent him in because it will come. The goals will come.

Of course, he needs to do something and the best thing to do is to work hard. Work hard against the ball, make runs, don't hesitate, be fearless, don't overthink it.

That's easy for me to say but it's the challenge right now. Timo will start tomorrow and there we go."

Also dropped a zinger of a quote...

"If a woman doesn’t want to go out with you, you cannot force her. Step back and maybe she will call you..."

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2 hours ago, Jason said:

 

Also dropped a zinger of a quote...

"If a woman doesn’t want to go out with you, you cannot force her. Step back and maybe she will call you..."

This shit never worked for me..

 

Anyways, I think press and fans talk too much about Werner. He has not been doing outstanding, but not horrible either. 10 goals and 10 assists in quite a strange season. Let’s see him(and the whole team) after a proper preseason with Tuchel. We must improve in goalscoring.

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46 minutes ago, nyikolajevics said:

This shit never worked for me..

Never show to a woman you are hungry for her, entice her at other means and the rest will follow........my experience anyway.

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Is it possible that this thing happened:
The moment Werner is about to shoot the goalkeeper shouts at him something like "boommmm".
Werner is scared - he misses the chance.

This is what happened to me once:
I 'm in the army with a rifle shooting detail.
When I took position the trainer in sweet voice says to me "oooh, it's my dear friend, welcome, welcome". I take the rifle, place the cartridge in, was about to take aiming position when all of a sudden he starts yelling at me like a madman. Result: I drop the rifle on the floor !
Now this was part of the drill it seems so that's why he acted like that.

Edited by cosmicway
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He's a goal machine, an assist-maniac and we almost bought him for peanuts. It's nearly as beautiful as a dream or a virtual game.

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3 hours ago, OneMoSalah said:

Can we get Pedro back? 😂 He was unpredictable but in a good way. Werner is just unpredictable but not in a good way.

You're hilarious.

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2 hours ago, Jason said:

You're hilarious.

I am beginning to wonder though with Tuchel, Pedro seems like the sort of system player he would of liked. Although could never rely on the guy really bar that title winning season with Conte which was a shame.

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5 minutes ago, OneMoSalah said:

I am beginning to wonder though with Tuchel, Pedro seems like the sort of system player he would of liked. Although could never rely on the guy really bar that title winning season with Conte which was a shame.

The thing with Pedro is that we bought him when he was already 28 years old. He was going close to 30 and supposedly at the wrong end of his peak age.

As for Werner, think he can fill that role under Tuchel and we can argue about his current inconsistency till the cows come home again etc but I don't know why you're picking him out for yesterday. As you alluded to in the match thread, he did nothing outstanding but he did nothing horrible either. He did OK in linking up the play and did not even getting any meaningful service to do damage (or to miss chances!) despite West Brom giving us opportunities to let him thrive in transitions. There were others who were far worse and cost us goals but I haven't seen you said anything about those players.

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1 minute ago, Jason said:

The thing with Pedro is that we bought him when he was already 28 years old. He was going close to 30 and supposedly at the wrong end of his peak age.

As for Werner, think he can fill that role under Tuchel and we can argue about his current inconsistency till the cows come home again etc but I don't know why you're picking him out for yesterday. As you alluded to in the match thread, he did nothing outstanding but he did nothing horrible either. He did OK in linking up the play and did not even getting any meaningful service to do damage (or to miss chances!) despite West Brom giving us opportunities to let him thrive in transitions. There were others who were far worse and cost us goals but I haven't seen you said anything about those players.

I know but for me, he doesn’t look like someone who is ever going to be capable of doing anything more than just being this player who is doing the little he is doing at this rate. Game by game, its just accumulating for me, the more games I watch of us with him playing I struggle to see why he is in the team because he virtually does nothing that affects the game for us most of the time. Ok he has pace and thats good for our attacking transition but what else does he bring to the team? Maybe he gets in behind teams defensive lines at times (lets be honest any striker/attacker playing in the PL should be capable of this) but its not as if he even makes lots and lots of these runs a game or that he makes chances for others from open play very often when he drifts out wider or does anything else that makes you think you know what I hope he’s playing today because he can add something to the team. 

I mean he set Mount up with a 4 or 5 yard pass v WBA but I mean he could of easily scored that himself. The feint to put the defender down was impressive to be honest but why has he not just let it come across his body or used his instep to guide it in to the right hand side of the goal? Giroud or Abraham would of shot and scored that from Alonso’s ball I think. I mean the defenders there but the GK had left him basically the whole right side of the goal. Fuck half the team would of probably got it in. Says a lot about how confident he is and whilst there is trying to play someone through a slump to try end a goal drought, we are talking 1 PL goal in 20 games slump, 14 games, few performances where you think this guy can do something, scores once, then back to being well pretty much you wouldnt miss him if he wasnt in the team and you dont really notice him when he is. And unfortunately hes not the first striker we have had this happen to either. I mean I dont want to compare him to Torres because thats unfair and not completely accurate but I still dont get why he didn’t shoot from that Alonso ball, look at where the GK was and the amount of space to the keepers left. Its basically 2/3s of the net. All he had to do was get it to the corner. That was Torres-esque. Scared to shoot because hes scared to miss.

Strikers having a quiet game or a few a season is understandable or even going through a wee bad spell but strikers having quiet games where you forget their even playing or poor games consistently is not good. Or not scoring in the league in 14 games. Then scoring once and not scoring for another 6 games currently. If thats not worrying or if you can’t see why people are maybe digging him out then I dont know. Its not just yesterdays game. Everyone was poor we all know that. Nobody is going to deny he wasn’t the worst player on the pitch but majority of the other games with Tuchel , which he has started, theres no doubts about it as to why people are questioning his inclusion every week. 

I know Tuchel can say he just needs to be patient, he knows how to score, the whole sometimes you give a women space/back off and she will call you thing etc bla bla bla but Giroud and Abraham may as well be playing with the u18s if they seriously cannot convince Tuchel to play them either in tandem or instead of him, it would be near impossible for any of them to come in and do considerably worse than what we have generally gotten from Werner since the end of November bar the odd hopeful moment or two every now and then.

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His lack of confidence worked in our favour for once. If he had been on it, he would have taken the shot instead of squaring to the better positioned Mount to score. All counts for nothing in the end tho 

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12 minutes ago, Magic Lamps said:

His lack of confidence worked in our favour for once. If he had been on it, he would have taken the shot instead of squaring to the better positioned Mount to score. All counts for nothing in the end tho 

True but surely if he’s desperate for a goal, when your 4-1 down, you just shoot? Right? Strikers are greedy, or they are meant to be. If it was 3-2  I could see why hes shat it a bit and squared it but at 4-1, not sure

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5 minutes ago, OneMoSalah said:

I know but for me, he doesn’t look like someone who is ever going to be capable of doing anything more than just being this player who is doing the little he is doing at this rate. Game by game, its just accumulating for me, the more games I watch of us with him playing I struggle to see why he is in the team because he virtually does nothing that affects the game for us most of the time. Ok he has pace and thats good for our attacking transition but what else does he bring to the team? Maybe he gets in behind teams defensive lines at times (lets be honest any striker/attacker playing in the PL should be capable of this) but its not as if he even makes lots and lots of these runs a game or that he makes chances for others from open play very often when he drifts out wider or does anything else that makes you think you know what I hope he’s playing today because he can add something to the team. 

Should have known an essay-esque reply was coming! 

Okay, he might not be the most brilliant of players but how do you expect Werner to even affect games if we don't play to his strengths? How many times have we seen make the runs forward but isn't spotted with an early pass for example? If you look back and think through the games, how many chances do we even create overall and/or specifically for Werner? It's not as if all the teams we play just sit back and camp in their own box against us by the way. You have games where teams come at us and there's space to exploit and then games where, okay, teams sit back a bit more but there are still moments of transition to exploit, for example. I really wish we have a peak Fabregas in this team instead of Jorginho/Kovacic because I want to see what would have happened.

Werner is part of the attacking problems that we have but how is he made like he's the only one not making chances for others from open play? If you're gonna criticize an attacker for not creating chances from open play, then maybe you should look at someone like Mount instead, someone that @NikkiCFC has constantly ranted about. Werner is not a creative player and yet, he has the most assists in all competitions this season (8 excluding penalties; 11 otherwise), is second on our list for shot creation and first on our list for goal-creating actions (e.g. passes, dribbles, drawing fouls) - both from open play - in the league. He was bought to score goals but somehow, has actually outperformed the supposedly more creative players in the team when it comes to creating chances. 

34 minutes ago, OneMoSalah said:

I mean he set Mount up with a 4 or 5 yard pass v WBA but I mean he could of easily scored that himself. The feint to put the defender down was impressive to be honest but why has he not just let it come across his body or used his instep to guide it in to the right hand side of the goal? Giroud or Abraham would of shot and scored that from Alonso’s ball I think. I mean the defenders there but the GK had left him basically the whole right side of the goal. Fuck half the team would of probably got it in. Says a lot about how confident he is and whilst there is trying to play someone through a slump to try end a goal drought, we are talking 1 PL goal in 20 games slump, 14 games, few performances where you think this guy can do something, scores once, then back to being well pretty much you wouldnt miss him if he wasnt in the team and you dont really notice him when he is. And unfortunately hes not the first striker we have had this happen to either. I mean I dont want to compare him to Torres because thats unfair and not completely accurate but I still dont get why he didn’t shoot from that Alonso ball, look at where the GK was and the amount of space to the keepers left. Its basically 2/3s of the net. All he had to do was get it to the corner. That was Torres-esque. Scared to shoot because hes scared to miss.

I said this in the match thread yesterday, I do not know if he was scared to take the shot or did he make the right, unselfish decision to pass it to Mount because there's a defender and keeper closing him down. You can imagine the headlines if he had gone for the shot and failed to score. That might just destroy him completely, especially after the Macedonia game. A 100% confident Werner would have gone for himself, I suspect, but as it transpired, you could argue that he at least still has the clarity of thought to control the ball and pass it to Mount (the pass wasn't exactly the best either) instead of completely shitting himself in front of goal. 

41 minutes ago, OneMoSalah said:

Strikers having a quiet game or a few a season is understandable or even going through a wee bad spell but strikers having quiet games where you forget their even playing or poor games consistently is not good. Or not scoring in the league in 14 games. Then scoring once and not scoring for another 6 games currently. If thats not worrying or if you can’t see why people are maybe digging him out then I dont know. Its not just yesterdays game. Everyone was poor we all know that. Nobody is going to deny he wasn’t the worst player on the pitch but majority of the other games with Tuchel , which he has started, theres no doubts about it as to why people are questioning his inclusion every week. 

See my points above on this. 

Not going to sit here and say Werner has been brilliant under Tuchel because he hasn't but when he's contributed to goals - be it scoring himself, albeit only one, assisting others or winning penalties - it's hard for Tuchel to really drop him, especially when our attack has hardly been brilliant and we have been winning some games because of those contributions. On top of that, it's not as if the others were playing good in any shape or form to deserve to be in the XI. Havertz, Ziyech, Pulisic were all in their own bad form and had their injury problems to boot. 

49 minutes ago, OneMoSalah said:

I know Tuchel can say he just needs to be patient, he knows how to score, the whole sometimes you give a women space/back off and she will call you thing etc bla bla bla but Giroud and Abraham may as well be playing with the u18s if they seriously cannot convince Tuchel to play them either in tandem or instead of him, it would be near impossible for any of them to come in and do considerably worse than what we have generally gotten from Werner since the end of November bar the odd hopeful moment or two every now and then.

For the most part, think Tuchel has made the right selection to play Werner upfront against certain teams/matches like Liverpool at Anfield or the CL second leg against Atletico Madrid. Abraham or Giroud wouldn't have been able to do what Werner did in those games. So really, apart from such games, Werner was competing with Pulisic, Ziyech etc for one of the left/right positions in the front 3.

I do not know why Tuchel hasn't tried to play Werner and Abraham alongside more upfront considering they seemed to have formed a decent partnership earlier this season and Werner was in goalscoring form back then. But Tuchel doesn't fancy Abraham and on the other hand, let's not also pretend Abraham is a great #9 either. Even you have doubts over him. As for Giroud, if he doesn't score, he really contributes next to nothing. He hardly has assists or any sort of goal and shot creation stats to even back him up. Plus, it's getting obvious that Tuchel prefers someone with mobility, pace, link-up play etc to lead the line, especially when he has gone for Havertz as the False 9 of late.

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11 hours ago, Jason said:

Should have known an essay-esque reply was coming! 

 

lol, then you write a novella in reply

👁️

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