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4 hours ago, communicate said:

I just watched the replay and yes he was. 

 

7 hours ago, Puliiszola said:

Alonso was not marking Bartley as far as i remember, he was marking the guy who won the first header.

 

10 hours ago, communicate said:

 

"And then Marcos loses his man for the third goal from the corner, a clear mistake. 

I thought on the third goal, you can see our defensive line step up, james was the one left otherwise it was offside any day. 

I don't know how you can blame Alonso there 

Offside trap was not the planned option, everyone automatically just moved up bc of how the ball is played so it maybe also was a collective mistake which happen when everyone goes ball wathcing. but alonso actually should have stayed with his markee holding the line. bc he didn't Reece tried to cover them both i guess or simply lost concentration himself. A more sophisticated defender than RJ would probably have made the smart choice and played them all offisde, saving the day by doing so but he was brought in this position by Alonso being the only completely misjudging the direction of the ball.

On a different note whilst our attacking play is boring AF and we are still not solid at the back, there is some improvement in the ladder in the sense that only the Silva mistake was a goal we conceded without Kepa or Alonso being at least partly at fault. This is a trend that we also saw in the last few matches of last season. If concede less from collective mistakes and more from individual mistakes. Mostly from Kepa and Alonso who i have called out for ages. Vs Liverpool and Brighton we looked defensively extremely solid for most of the match apart from Alonso/Kepa. AC has really stepped up apart from that red card obviously. Zouma has been faultless this season so far (so really sad not to see him last weekend). But yeah the chopping and changing needs to stop. By playing Kante as holder again, Lampard has minimally improved our defending but downgraded our attacking fluidity.

IMO 4 things need to happen for us to finally improve in the long run

-finding a consistent back 4

-replacing Kante with a ball playing but physical DM

-Kepa and Alonso out of the squad, they are making the players around them look worse than they are

-get ziyech, chilwell and pulisic fit and gelling in the team

 

I am confident Lampard knows this but he might have a different schedule than we would like

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I can't actually believe how well coached we are. Puts it in further perspective when you see the garbage United and Arsenal are spewing. I love the fact Frank isn't so stubborn to try and do it

Very confused, can only assume the ones being somewhat negative did not watch the game? Aside from Dave and Zouma, I thought we played really well against the European Champions. I was shocked at time

Our pressing game was superb, and made all the difference today! 4-3-3 with Mount and Havertz to harass opponents and Kante to sweep up behind...that's the way to go. And we have two bombing

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35 minutes ago, Magic Lamps said:

 

 

Offside trap was not the planned option, everyone automatically just moved up bc of how the ball is played so it maybe also was a collective mistake which happen when everyone goes ball wathcing. but alonso actually should have stayed with his markee holding the line. bc he didn't Reece tried to cover them both i guess or simply lost concentration himself. A more sophisticated defender than RJ would probably have made the smart choice and played them all offisde, saving the day by doing so but he was brought in this position by Alonso being the only completely misjudging the direction of the ball.

 

That is a weird analysis. If the ball goes to front post, it would have been a goal as well because Havertz and tammy stepped up, in fact everyone stepped up except Reece. He was lost. 

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4 minutes ago, communicate said:

That is a weird analysis. If the ball goes to front post, it would have been a goal as well because Havertz and tammy stepped up, in fact everyone stepped up except Reece. He was lost. 

how is the ball gonna go to the nea post through allour players coming from that angle tho? if you watch closely there is not really an avenue for the near post ball across the box. far post was the only direction this could have causeddanger.

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9 minutes ago, Magic Lamps said:

how is the ball gonna go to the nea post through allour players coming from that angle tho? if you watch closely there is not really an avenue for the near post ball across the box. far post was the only direction this could have causeddanger.

Not sure I have the goal side angle but it doesn't matter for me this one is obvious. 

 

 

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Like Mourinho, Lampard is angered by defeat because he knows trophies are vital

https://theathletic.com/2098788/2020/09/29/like-mourinho-lampard-is-angered-by-defeat-because-he-knows-trophies-are-vital/

Frank-Lampard-trophy-West-Brom-angry-1024x683.jpg

The season is less than a month old and Frank Lampard is already finding it hard to keep his cool.

As The Athletic exclusively revealed, he was furious after Marcos Alonso broke squad rules during the 3-3 draw at West Brom on Saturday.

Lampard wasn’t exactly the picture of calm as Chelsea’s defence, which included Alonso at left-back, did their utmost to gift West Bromwich Albion three points at the weekend. The TV broadcast kept cutting away to the head coach looking worried, frustrated and infuriated on the touchline.

During his post-match media obligations, it was pretty obvious the three goals Chelsea scored in the second half on Saturday to salvage a 3-3 draw had done little to dilute Lampard’s disappointment over what he had witnessed in the first half. We now know one of the reasons why, given what he had to say about Alonso’s indiscretion.

Taking all this into consideration, you could argue the timing of a Carabao Cup last-16 tie against fiercest rivals Tottenham, which is also a match-up with the club’s former manager Jose Mourinho, tonight isn’t the best. There was always going to be a lot of scrutiny on this game anyway, but having also lost to Liverpool this month, Lampard knows he needs a win to keep the critics at bay and also to lift the mood in the camp.

Mind you, he is used to being in this position ahead of a meeting with Mourinho’s Spurs. Before securing a 2-0 triumph in north London last December, Chelsea had lost Premier League games to Everton and Bournemouth. And ahead of the rematch at Stamford Bridge in February, where they also came out on top, his side had picked up just two points from a possible 12.

Those victories were vital for Chelsea’s successful attempt to finish in the top four and secure qualification for this season’s Champions League. What makes this Cup encounter so important is that one of their two realistic chances to win silverware this season is at stake.

Chelsea have spent more than £200 million on new players in this transfer window yet Lampard, whose views were echoed by pre-season predictions from all the pundits, has admitted regaining the title in May is unlikely and the realistic aim is to close the gap to Liverpool and Manchester City in the final table — those two clubs finished 33 points and 15 points ahead of them respectively in 2019-20.

Similarly, after being comfortably knocked out of the Champions League by eventual winners Bayern Munich 7-1 on aggregate last month, nobody expects them to challenge to win Europe’s premier club competition this season either, even though Timo Werner and Kai Havertz have arrived to help their chances.

Lampard knows that despite the impressive achievement of taking Chelsea to fourth spot last season many people, including a section of their fanbase, will continue to question whether he is the right man for the job until he wins silverware.

Qualifying for the Champions League is one of the requirements the Stamford Bridge hierarchy expects from all their coaches, but they have also got used to success on a regular basis. Since owner Roman Abramovich took over 17 years ago, no English club has won more major trophies (16) than Chelsea.

Lampard came mighty close to No 17 in August. Having defeated Liverpool, Leicester City and Manchester United en route to the FA Cup final, Chelsea fell short right against Arsenal, not helped by the unfortunate injuries of Christian Pulisic and Cesar Azpilicueta as well as a harsh red card to Mateo Kovacic for two cautionable offences.

That loss, combined with the inevitable exit to Bayern in the Champions League’s last 16 a week later (they went into the second leg in Germany 3-0 down), seemed to take a lot of the shine off Lampard’s first season in some quarters. Despite coping for several months with the departure of Eden Hazard to Real Madrid, a transfer ban and playing more academy talent than any Chelsea boss had before, things ended on a negative note.

The Arsenal match at Wembley particularly vexed Lampard. One might assume a coach will have soothing words of comfort or encouragement for their players after suffering such a disappointment in a showpiece occasion. However, sources have told The Athletic that the 42-year-old was incensed and spoke angrily about the manner in which they stopped playing with intensity after going 1-0 up. It’s been described as one of his most furious dressing room outbursts thus far — well that is until Alonso’s misdemeanour anyway. On top of the normal ire over how they were beaten, perhaps it was also a sign of how much of an impact Lampard knew lifting the FA Cup would have for him, as well as the club.

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You only have to look at what a difference a trophy has made to how his Arsenal counterpart Mikel Arteta is perceived. That success meant Arsenal’s lowest league finish for 25 years, even if he only took over in December, was forgotten and the Spaniard appears to be held in higher esteem than Lampard because of that winner’s medal on his managerial CV.

Unlike former Tottenham boss Mauricio Pochettino, who spoke many times about how the domestic cups were not a priority during his tenure, Lampard knows what winning one can bring to a squad.

He learnt this lesson under Mourinho, whose first trophy in both spells as Chelsea manager was the League Cup, firstly in 2005 and then a decade later — against Pochettino’s Spurs outfit. The Portuguese also won it in 2007.

Lampard played in the first two of those finals, and didn’t regard the prize as second-rate. As he said after defeating Liverpool in Cardiff 15 years ago: “If you haven’t won anything, a runners-up medal is not what you want at all. He (Mourinho) actually gets angrier with each one (defeat), so every time we lose it’s the worst I’ve seen him. He’s a winner, though, that’s what you expect, and that’s the attitude that’s needed at Chelsea these days.”

That mantra hasn’t changed now he’s the one at the helm. When asked about his views on Chelsea challenging for four trophies during his debut season he spoke about “targeting them all”. Here we are a year later and nothing has changed.

Speaking on the eve of the encounter at the Tottenham Hotspur Stadium, where the hosts may have to play a weakened side given they have a Europa League game 48 hours later, Lampard said: “We all know the Carabao Cup for teams like ourselves and Tottenham, teams challenging for top four and Champions League, that the Carabao Cup does have its place. But we certainly respect it and every tournament we go into, we want to win.

“When I analyse Tottenham and the squad that they have and what team they might have, and the players who didn’t play 90 minutes (against Newcastle), they have a fantastic squad. I know that whatever team Jose puts out they will be very strong.”

Mourinho will have his own point to prove. Not only has Lampard got the better of him in two Premier League meetings, Mourinho also came off second-best when his former midfielder’s Derby County side defeated his Manchester United on penalties in the Carabao Cup two years ago.

A week later, Mourinho sent a message paying tribute to Lampard as he was inducted into the Legends of Football Hall of Fame. He said: “As I told you at Old Trafford, only a manager with great potential can organise a team to play that way. I knew you were desperate to beat me. And you did. Though it was 2-2 after 90 minutes.”

Lampard will certainly be desperate to do it once more.

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2 minutes ago, killer1257 said:

If Mount and CHO did make the right passes, we would have won today easily.

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You're opening a can of worms there...

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1 minute ago, killer1257 said:

These passes were not even that hard to make

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But you're talking about ifs and buts here, which one easily make about other situations that happened. 

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I thought he got his first half tactics spot on once again but second half we looked like the less eager side.

FL sadly already feels like a dead man walking in that jobwith the fans getting on his back here at least. I think he will be given a bit more time by Roman tho.

It is not at all black and white. This might not be the best football in the world but we lost with bad luck vs a highly motivated Mourinho side. There is no shame in that and no sense in blaming shit coaching or tactics. This is still a team finding its feet even tho it should be further ahead there is no use in throwing your toys out of the pram. Mourinho in 2015 was 10x worse, the Sarri slump was worse, Conte missing out on 4th was worse. Lampard has been through rough patches here already and so far always bounced back. Lets at least give him end of the year before being too terminal in judgement.

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1 minute ago, Jason said:

But you're talking about ifs and buts here, which one easily make about other situations that happened. 

Tbf there isn't exactly a shortage of people happy to bring if,buts and maybe's to the table whenever we narrowly win, like recently vs Brighton.

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But you're talking about ifs and buts here, which one easily make about other situations that happened. 
You have to find the right passes in those big moments. A guy like KDB always finds the right passes and even in much more complicated and tight spaces. CHO did not see Tammy and Mount saw Werner's run and passed it to the opponent. This is not Chelsea level.

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The question is who are we going to bring in. Simeone would be a perfect fit but no way is he coming. 
Allegri doesn‘t convince me. Maybe Poch?
Simeone needs a whole new squad. We do not have a Simeone squad

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