Emerson Palmieri

[robsblubot 3,205]

1 hour ago, Blue Gee said:

Upgrade at the position is needed for sure. Alonso at his best is a better player than Emerson. Emerson hasn't pulled any trees up so far in the starts he's made. Few glimpses of quality here and there he has produced but awareness and concentration are a negative, his pace covers up the cracks in his game. 

agreed. Against wolves, the same backward passes esp coming from the back. Particularly culpable in Wolves goal: while his pace allowed him to tackle the player carrying the ball in the counter, the tackle was too weak and did not stop the play. It was time to stop the play and pick up a yellow (poor awareness).

Perhaps he will improve as he gets games, but it's not like he's a youngster.

[Vesper 27,281]

9 minutes ago, Robchels said:

agreed. Against wolves, the same backward passes esp coming from the back. Particularly culpable in Wolves goal: while his pace allowed him to tackle the player carrying the ball in the counter, the tackle was too weak and did not stop the play. It was time to stop the play and pick up a yellow (poor awareness).

Perhaps he will improve as he gets games, but it's not like he's a youngster.

agreed

all 4 of our fullbacks need to go (or at least shift Azpi back to CB)

[Special Juan 27,092]

See how many times he got passed Hazard last night and attacked the by-line? He's not afraid to attack, Alonso is.

Him and Hazard are linking well, Hazard played a few reverse passes to him last night and they are only possibly if the LB is prepared to take a risk and attack space and get forward.

Should be a main stay.

[ja1 1,166]

I also thought he was bit more aggressive in defence last night which was good. He was better than Azpi in one on ones and pressing them into mistakes. He is also good at playing it out. More than one move yday started out with him doing quite smart interplay in our own third.

 

i do like him and maintain he has potential, however I do sometimes wanna shove a rocket up his arse, yesterday he was pretty good but I think he could be better..sometimes his movement is odd, still overall of course an improvement on Alonso and I think he should start for remainder of season. I also think a number of games in our side with Hazard, with RLC will improve his game further.

 

just to divulge bit further about his movement, a player like him should be making best use of space I feel. And tbf this may be tactical, but sometimes the space is ahead of him and he doesn’t make the run or doesn’t take the player on, even though he is pacy and good at dribbling. This could also be a confidence thing as well, hence why increased gametime could help. If you watch Andy Robertson, who is really good, he’s not actually insanely talented well not like Kimmich or Marcelo he just does everything quickly, on the front foot, and excellent stamina (one of the best in PL) to dominate left hand side, that is what Emerson needs to improve further.

[Special Juan 27,092]

3 minutes ago, ja1 said:

I also thought he was bit more aggressive in defence last night which was good. He was better than Azpi in one on ones and pressing them into defence. He is also good at playing it out. More than one move yday started out with him doing quite smart interplay in our own third.

 

i do like him and maintain he has potential, however I do sometimes wanna shove a rocket up his arse, yesterday he was pretty good but I think he could be better..sometimes his movement is odd, still overall of course an improvement on Alonso and I think he should start for remainder of season. I also think a number of games in our side with Hazard, with RLC will improve his game further.

Your pretty much spot on, but also what we must not forget is that whilst he isn't top quality, what he actually is, is a much better LB than Alonso.

We have to some what make do with him but one things for sure is he attacks better than Alonso, crosses better than him and links up better.

[robsblubot 3,205]

On 4/4/2019 at 6:26 AM, Mana said:

Average LB. But, I'll take an average LB anyday of the week over a woeful LB.

Is he though? I don't actually know because he usually plays against the weakest opposition. So much so that I have barely watch him play: the games he starts usually don't show in the US.

Wish he would start more games away from home, when we have the in-your-face players at all times, which makes passing a lot harder.

[ja1 1,166]

13 hours ago, Robchels said:

Is he though? I don't actually know because he usually plays against the weakest opposition. So much so that I have barely watch him play: the games he starts usually don't show in the US.

Wish he would start more games away from home, when we have the in-your-face players at all times, which makes passing a lot harder.

He has had good games against both City and Tottenham. Alonso even against weak opposition tends to still be poor.

[robsblubot 3,205]

8 hours ago, ja1 said:

He has had good games against both City and Tottenham. Alonso even against weak opposition tends to still be poor.

Those were not pl right? Perhaps why I missed them.

yeah we have a big disagreement on what having a good game means: for me if the player directly helps us winning points, like winning that header in a tough away game, that’s def good game for me.

so for Emerson to be average, he needs to contribute something to the team. Merely looking like lb and running well is just not enough. I’ve hardly seen him play, but so far, his actual contributions are not even on par with an underperforming alonso.

[ja1 1,166]

1 hour ago, Robchels said:

Those were not pl right? Perhaps why I missed them.

yeah we have a big disagreement on what having a good game means: for me if the player directly helps us winning points, like winning that header in a tough away game, that’s def good game for me.

so for Emerson to me average, he needs to contribute something to the team. Merely looking like lb and running well is just not enough. I’ve hardly seen him play, but so far, his actual contributions are not even on par with an underperforming alonso.

Emerson since joining Chelsea has a goal or assist every 525 minutes. Alonso in same time has one every  487 minutes so it clearly is on par. Some things such as Alonso being taller and a better threat from corners as opposed to Emerson who stays back at halfway line and Alonso’s fees kicks are things that have little - no baring on how good they are as a LB. Alonso probably has more ‘contributions’ than Cole did and yet it’s clear that Cole is better,  comparing LBs purely on contributions and not on how well they play at LB seems a little short sighted.

 

I appreciate there are different gauges on how one can perceive a game but with respect I think it’s a very shallow view / black and white to say that x played had a good game because they won a header even if the performance was terrible and another player has a better performance, is involved with good moves but it isn’t a good game because there no clear contribution as defined by goals or assists..

 

And also it is not just about offensive measures, Alonso is poor defensively and has been at fault for many goals going against us. Emerson has not been much better  on the most part but, for example, he had a good game defensively against Brighton. He also had a good defensive game against City. This all contributes as well to him having a good game, imo. If Alonso is getting torn apart by a winger for the whole 90 minutes, slows our play down the left hand side going forward and wastes the ball from wide areas but happens to head the ball across the box from a set piece for another player to convert it’s still not a good game for me. Against Brighton Emerson started multiple attacks from either smart/quick interplay in our own third or pressing the opposition into mistakes in middle/final third - Alonso is simply not capable of this, and an example of how it goes deeper than just how many goals/assists they get. Emerson in the final minute of the Spurs cup game created a fantastic chance for Giroud by dribbling past their RB and putting in a 40 yard cross to his feet, again, Alonso is just not capable of that, and part of why I described Emerson’s game against Tottenham as good.

[robsblubot 3,205]

27 minutes ago, ja1 said:

Emerson since joining Chelsea has a goal or assist every 525 minutes. Alonso in same time has one every  487 minutes so it clearly is on par. Some things such as Alonso being taller and a better threat from corners as opposed to Emerson who stays back at halfway line and Alonso’s fees kicks are things that have little - no baring on how good they are as a LB. Alonso probably has more ‘contributions’ than Cole did and yet it’s clear that Cole is better,  comparing LBs purely on contributions and not on how well they play at LB seems a little short sighted.

 

I appreciate there are different gauges on how one can perceive a game but with respect I think it’s a very shallow view / black and white to say that x played had a good game because they won a header even if the performance was terrible and another player has a better performance, is involved with good moves but it isn’t a good game because there no clear contribution as defined by goals or assists..

 

And also it is not just about offensive measures, Alonso is poor defensively and has been at fault for many goals going against us. Emerson has not been much better  on the most part but, for example, he had a good game defensively against Brighton. This all contributes as well to him having a good game. If Alonso is getting torn apart by a winger for the whole 90 minutes, slows our play down the left hand side going forward and wastes the ball from wide areas but happens to head the ball across the box from a set piece for another player to convert it’s still not a good game for me.

Disagree. That’s very arbitrary and static view imo, a bit classic too if you consider how dynamic the possession sides play these days.

The stats are incomparable for the reason I mentioned above: Emerson played in FAR FAR easier games in average.

Alonso has just helped us win an away game we were going to lose!

tactics exist so that teams can make use of the best attributes the players have. If the player is capable of winning games, he should be allowed to try. Others who can't should cover for him.

therefore alonso being poor defensively should never be an issue with so many players in the squad who are not really contributing with goals and key moments. If kovacic cannot cover Alonso’s runs then what exactly does he do? Should kante drop back a little more so alonso can attack, win headers and games? Can't Azpi drop back and become the CB while alonso attacks? These are all possible with tactical tweaks.

let me put it his way: If alonso moved to Leicester the manager would immediately tweak the tactics so that alonso could win games for him. Even if he has to give him sort of a free role. That’s how important game winners are imo.

we have so few game winners in the team that I find it incredible that the one we do have is ostracized and hated by fans. Just because this manager insists in making him play like a classic LB. 

While I don’t disagree alonso has been poor, I disagree with the reasons for that. I also find folks here a bit inconsistent regarding their position with sarri.

[ja1 1,166]

13 minutes ago, Robchels said:

Disagree. That’s very arbitrary and static view imo, a bit classic too if you consider how dynamic the possession sides play these days.

The stats are incomparable for the reason I mentioned above: Emerson played in FAR FAR easier games in average.

Alonso has just helped us win an away game we were going to lose!

tactics exist so that teams can make use of the best attributes the players have. If the player is capable of winning games, he should be allowed to try. Others who can't should cover for him.

therefore alonso being poor defensively should never be an issue with so many players in the squad who are not really contributing with goals and key moments. If kovacic cannot cover Alonso’s runs then what exactly does he do? Should kante drop back a little more so alonso can attack, win headers and games? Can't Azpi drop back and become the CB while alonso attacks? These are all possible with tactical tweaks.

let me put it his way: If alonso moved to Leicester the manager would immediately tweak the tactics so that alonso could win games for him. Even if he has to give him sort of a free role. That’s how important game winners are imo.

we have so few game winners in the team that I find it incredible that the one we do have is ostracized and hated by fans. Just because this manager insists in making him play like a classic LB. 

While I don’t disagree alonso has been poor, I disagree with the reasons for that. I also find folks here a bit inconsistent regarding their position with sarri.

This would work if Alonso was good at football, eg. Good at crossing, passing, ball control, dribbling aka yes the classic things that a LB should be good at. Giving Alonso freedom may work better in 3 at the back but not with 4, he’s been at other teams of Leicester standard and been completely average as he is now. 

 

Sarri tried exactly what you’re saying  this at the start of the season, probably under the impression/myth that Alonso is good attacking full back, similar what what he did at Napoli. Alonso had full freedom to attack and goalhang, Azpi became basically 3rd CB and if he did overlap, Alonso was allowed to stay in the box. It doesn’t work as pushing Alonso up doesn’t lead to more chances being created down the left as you expect with a good attacking LB, he just goes into the box. Attacks break down leaving us very open. Sarri reverted back to a more even attacking contribution after maybe 5-10 games. If Azpi overlaps and Alonso is in the box, he goes back to Lb position. HT against United when Rashford kept taking advantage of the space Alonso leaves behind while doing nothing going forward is when I think this started. 

 

Recently against Everton Sarri tried the early season tactic again, probably again under the belief that Alonso, who he believes or at least has said is one of the best LBs in the world, was back in form after a goal and assist vs Kiev. Again it just didn’t work, and Everton win. 

 

Sarri’s tactics at Napoli where the LB was more attacking, fits Emerson’s profile more than Alonso. 

[robsblubot 3,205]

1 minute ago, ja1 said:

This would work if Alonso was good at football, eg. Good at crossing, passing, ball control, dribbling aka yes the classic things that a LB should be good at. Giving Alonso freedom may work better in 3 at the back but not with 4, he’s been at other teams of Leicester standard and been completely average as he is now. 

 

Sarri tried exactly what you’re saying  this at the start of the season, probably under the impression/myth that Alonso is good attacking full back, similar what what he did at Napoli. Alonso had full freedom to attack and goalhang, Azpi became basically 3rd CB and if he did overlap, Alonso was allowed to stay in the box. It doesn’t work as pushing Alonso up doesn’t lead to more chances being created down the left as you expect with a good attacking LB, he just goes into the box. Attacks break down leaving us very open. Sarri reverted back to a more even attacking contribution after maybe 5-10 games. If Azpi overlaps and Alonso is in the box, he goes back to Lb position. HT against United when Rashford kept taking advantage of the space Alonso leaves behind while doing nothing going forward is when I think this started. 

 

Recently against Everton Sarri tried the early season tactic again, probably again under the belief that Alonso, who he believes or at least has said is one of the best LBs in the world, was back in form after a goal and assist vs Kiev. Again it just didn’t work, and Everton win. 

 

Sarri’s tactics at Napoli where the LB was more attacking, fits Emerson’s profile more than Alonso. 

Fair enough, we fundamentally disagree on whether Alonso is a good footballer - remember you were never a fan even as a LWB and despite his strong contributions under conte. IMO he's really good at passing, ball control, and first touch. Great at winning high balls. Poor at crossing and fairly slow. However, reckon many times Alonso was not able to pass the ball well, esp in away games due to lack of movement and others did not do too well in that regard either.

As a classic LB, Alonso seems unplayable, but nobody is holding a gun to Sarri's head and saying that's how we have to play or how alonso has to play.

That's what I see regarding tactics: Alonso does play as a LB who needs to drop back very often esp in away games when we are under attack. The whole defense works in a high line, which I also dislike. Azpi goes up way too often considering how poor he is in attack, and so does Kante.

Seems like you may also not like possession systems, because defending in possession systems is mostly done by keeping possession. Those sides don't usually do too well without the football.

Let me emphasize that the discussion would've been very different if we were talking about a sure quality player to replace alonso. And yet, we are discussing Emerson, who again, has mediocre stats while playing far easier games in average.

[the wes 7,212]

Ac wants Emerson 

http://sportwitness.co.uk/chelsea-players-representative-held-meeting-club-e25m-need-transfer/

 

[!Hazard! 3,394]

How average is this guy. Surely someone from the academy could just take the LB spot at this point? Is DaSilva really that much worse than him cause honestly I don't really see any great qualities in this player

[Tomo 21,681]

So we have Alonso who tends to do allright in the final phase but can't get up there quick enough a lot of the time vs Emerson who can get up effortlessly but once there makes Moses look an ice cool decision maker.

I would say fullback not striker is the position that needs THE urgent upgrade, put Alexander Arnold and Robertson in this team tonight we win easily even with Giroud playing like an amateur.

[OneMoSalah 8,609]

1 hour ago, Tomo said:

So we have Alonso who tends to do allright in the final phase but can't get up there quick enough a lot of the time vs Emerson who can get up effortlessly but once there makes Moses look an ice cool decision maker.

I would say fullback not striker is the position that needs THE urgent upgrade, put Alexander Arnold and Robertson in this team tonight we win easily even with Giroud playing like an amateur.

Dont be saying that Emerson is the chosen one compared to Alonso... lets be honest both are painfully belpw average  have been saying it for ages. Sarri got stick for using Alonso at the start of the season and now Emerson has played considerable minutes its clear to see both arent great (Emerson will never be the same player he was before that injury and even then it was only one season that was hugely overhyped). Alonso's end product is below par but its probably better than Emersons, or there about the same. Personally think Marcos has got a lot of stick even when hes not played purely because he hasnt been anywhere near as effective as he was in his first season. Where he actually looked pretty good despite obvious physical limitations. 

[1905didierblue 748]

Alonso has got a lot of stick (and rightly so), due to his defensive ability (or lack of). Emerson's end product is poor but I would take that any day of the week over alonso's Sunday league defending.

[Tomo 21,681]

6 hours ago, bakayokofan said:

Alonso has got a lot of stick (and rightly so), due to his defensive ability (or lack of). Emerson's end product is poor but I would take that any day of the week over alonso's Sunday league defending.

Emerson's just as bad at defending.

The one thing he has over Marcos is his ability to run up the byline which can help speed up attacks, but anything else he's either just as bad or even worse.