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John Terry


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Fergie employed the tactics many times at United, including at The Nou Camp in 2008 with his best ever team, LVG did it in the WC semi.

Infact the way we set up yesterday reminded me of how Ancelotti use to set us up against Arsenal, allow them possession were they can't hurt us and then hurt them on the counter.

It's really annoying how you use exceptions to make your point. so because a few managers used similar tactics once in a bluemoon somehow detracts from the point I was making? Arsene wenger also defended deep against City this season and against dortmund last season, does that also make him a pragmatist who has no appreciation for the quality of football his team plays in big games like Jose as well?

Perhaps I should have used the qualifier, Jose and Rafa are the only two managers shameless and stubborn enough to play defensive football at the top level on a consistent basis. I'm 100 percent certain that those clubs I listed would not tolerate their managers using Jose's tactics in majority of their big matches as often as jose does.

Top clubs set high standards and take performances very seriously, we are the only top club in europe that accepts winning at all cost and sets extremely low standard as far as the overall quality and performances is concerned and without a clear identity.

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There's nothing more to add that hasn't already be said but what I will say though is there has to be a balance between good football and parkimg the bus. At what point does it enter the territory of "overdoing it". This tactic is acceptable for a top team under certain circumstances like managing through difficult and hectic run of fixtures I.e UCL, the league and other cup competitions and in situations where the players are too tired to press but to make it your only tactic in big games is not only overdoing it but shows a distinct lack of tactical flexibility and respect for the fans who have paid good money to watch their team play.

And I still stand by my belief that negative football is cowardly and taking the easy way out. I know some will say if parking the bus was easy, why aren't other managers capable of doing it successfully apart from jose and my response to that is, no other manager (apart from rafa, who had a great run in the ucl with liverpool) have attempted to employ such tactics when managing a top top club. Jose and rafa are the only manager stubborn and shameless enough to stick to it at the highest level of football. Clubs like bayern, barca,real,utd, ajax (when they were a top club) wouldn't tolerate such football from their managers and rightly so.

So you are basically saying you would have to be a brave person to do it at a top club and playing like the fans want you to is the easy way :Goober:

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So you are basically saying you would have to be a brave person to do it at a top club and playing like the fans want you to is the easy way :Goober:

Im saying it's infinitely harder and more impressive to achieve success playing good, high quality football consistently aka winning with style than it is to win ugly/at all cost hence taking the easy way out.

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It's really annoying how you use exceptions to make your point. so because a few managers used similar tactics once in a bluemoon somehow detracts from the point I was making? Arsene wenger also defended deep against City this season and against dortmund last season, does that also make him a pragmatist who has no appreciation for the quality of football his team plays in big games like Jose as well?

Perhaps I should have used the qualifier, Jose and Rafa are the only two managers shameless and stubborn enough to play defensive football at the top level on a consistent basis. I'm 100 percent certain that those clubs I listed would not tolerate their managers using Jose's tactics in majority of their big matches as often as jose does.

Top clubs set high standards and take performances very seriously, we are the only top club in europe that accepts winning at all cost and sets extremely low standard as far as the overall quality and performances is concerned and without a clear identity.

So, you care more about being a morale winner , rather than a real winner? Because, as far as my knowledge is spread, that every single footballer on the Earth, would give their right arm to win a title in any means possible, rather than running the oposition ragged, only to miss a couple of chances and lose it at the end. Morale wins are for people who don't have a winning mentality. If you can accept a loss, then that is pathetic, because no one remembers number 2, EVEN if you are fucking amazing like, say, Brazil 2002.

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So, you care more about being a morale winner , rather than a real winner? Because, as far as my knowledge is spread, that every single footballer on the Earth, would give their right arm to win a title in any means possible, rather than running the oposition ragged, only to miss a couple of chances and lose it at the end. Morale wins are for people who don't have a winning mentality. If you can accept a loss, then that is pathetic, because no one remembers number 2, EVEN if you are fucking amazing like, say, Brazil 2002.

What's pathetic is yanking the joy and entertainment out of football all in the name of winning at all cost and reducing a sport that is just as much about entertainment as it is about being competitive to just winning.

I will always respect teams who do not sacrifice their integrity, identity and genuine love for the game, are able to combine entertainment with success (winning with style) infinitely more than those on the other side of the spectrum.

As for your other point History remembers the revolutionary rinus Michels and his Netherland team of the 70's, 1982 Brazil and they never won anything. The zidane galatico team are also well respected despite underachieving massively, success wise.

I'm not even advocating seeking to entertain at the detriment of winning but the notion that achieving the right balance between the two is some impossible mission and a little poor us cannot strike the balance is nonsensical at best. To those that always hold this view, How could you all possibly know that we wouldn't have won the big games we either won,lost or drew in the past if we had played an attacking and pressing game?.

It's crazy how most people have been brainwashed into thinking winning and playing good attacking football are mutually exclusive. No matter how hard it may seem, the ultimate target/goal should always be to strike the perfect balance between entertaining and winning and we certainly aren't working towards achieving such feat under Jose.

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It's crazy how most people have been brainwashed into thinking winning and playing good attacking football are mutually exclusive. No matter how hard it may seem, the ultimate target/goal should always be to strike the perfect balance between entertaining and winning and we certainly aren't working towards achieving such feat under Jose.

I respect your opinion and to be fair I realize what you mean. But by all means this IS a competitive sport. Competition makes this sport what it is, and nearly everybody would love to get trophies by any means necessary and that even includes cheating in certain situations. History may remember these days, but that is based also on the fact of the players that were playing at that team, who achieved so many big things at club/country level(Cruyff at Barca, Van Basten at Milan respectively) and managed to NOT do so at the other. I don't think it's mutually exclusive, I just firmly believe, that with this manager, and even with Klopp, Simeone, Guardiola(God forbid) or whoever, there would still be a tactical asset in his mind when and IF managing Chelsea, rather than just go all - out attractive. I don't remember who said it, but it was well said, titles are won against the small teams. And let's be honest, you have to really hate Mourinho, if you actually deny that we went on to control and beat nearly every team in the first half of the season, and partially in the second. We've dropped form, yes. We've played more hasty, more tactical, allowing the opponent to control the ball more than we maybe, should, YES. That doesn't mean, we don't and we can't play attractive, and that we don't deserve titles and wins. By the way you are saying, it sounds like we haven't played one good attacking match and our whole season is based on tactical awareness and counter-attacking football, which I personally, don't believe is the whole story. Cheers.

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It's really annoying how you use exceptions to make your point. so because a few managers used similar tactics once in a bluemoon somehow detracts from the point I was making? Arsene wenger also defended deep against City this season and against dortmund last season, does that also make him a pragmatist who has no appreciation for the quality of football his team plays in big games like Jose as well?

Perhaps I should have used the qualifier, Jose and Rafa are the only two managers shameless and stubborn enough to play defensive football at the top level on a consistent basis. I'm 100 percent certain that those clubs I listed would not tolerate their managers using Jose's tactics in majority of their big matches as often as jose does.

Top clubs set high standards and take performances very seriously, we are the only top club in europe that accepts winning at all cost and sets extremely low standard as far as the overall quality and performances is concerned and without a clear identity.

Fergie doing it wasn't really once in a blue moon, he would do it whenever he feels it's nessesery, he has always been partial to it. I can list a number of examples in the morning but right now im too pissed (birthday).

Of course ideally id love to see us blow a big team out of the water, infact we did do it on Jose's return vs Liverpool and Arsenal (the 2-1 flattered Liverpool big time) but I don't honestly believe this squad is anywhere near complete (one for a greavsie explains it much better than I do).

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Absolute legend, not just of Chelsea but a legend of the EPL and football in general. On par with football legends such as Nesta, Pirlo, Ronaldo...etc. Not much more can be said about this brilliant brilliant man except maybe that he's also one of the best skippers in football history.

The love and emotions I have for this man and what he represents of football and Chelsea cannot be put into words :worship:

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