Super Frank Thread

[Jase 43,479]

Arsenal, you know the team we all love to criticize and laugh at for their defensive flaws (not that they have gone entirely), have conceded 8 goals and kept 5 clean sheets in 11 games under Arteta. In the same period (since Arteta took charge of Arsenal's first game on Dec 26), we conceded 12 goals and kept only 2 clean sheets in 10 games. In fact, Arsenal's 5 clean sheets in 11 games under Arteta is just 2 (TWO!) short of our season's total of 7 in 37 games! 

[Jase 43,479]

25 minutes ago, Mana said:

You do know Arsenal's squad is better than ours right? They were just more lazy and disorganised under Emery. They have goalscorers in Martinelli and Aubameyang. Lacazette, who hasn't scored in months has now woken up from his long slumber.

Ozil, did more for Arteta then he EVER did for Emery in a short period of time.

Arsenal have a better squad than us? That's highly debatable but what's certain is that they have better goalscorers/strikers than we do. 

Never mind Emery, Arsenal were never organized even under Wenger. But so far, Arteta seems to have got them organized and made them competent defensively in just 11 games. It looks as though Arteta has been doing a lot tactical work to get Arsenal to be organized at the very least, rather than still be the messy, disorganized chaos side that we often saw under Emery and Wenger. Not sure if the same is done on our side...

[Iggy Doonican 4,186]

Good article this and should put to bed this bollocks narrative that having ball possession is something to take comfort in. It's the complete opposite it's a major flaw in your game if you dominate the ball have no final product and lose or draw against 10 men. We're going to have all the ball tomorrow if we lose the game against a team with no recognised strikers then serious questions have to be asked.

https://inews.co.uk/sport/football/frank-lampard-chelsea-manchester-united-ole-gunnar-solskjaer-champions-league-top-four-1883536

[chippy 342]

35 minutes ago, Iggy Doonican said:

Good article this and should put to bed this bollocks narrative that having ball possession is something to take comfort in. It's the complete opposite it's a major flaw in your game if you dominate the ball have no final product and lose or draw against 10 men. We're going to have all the ball tomorrow if we lose the game against a team with no recognised strikers then serious questions have to be asked.

https://inews.co.uk/sport/football/frank-lampard-chelsea-manchester-united-ole-gunnar-solskjaer-champions-league-top-four-1883536

Agree!

Ball possession and pass percentage mean jack!

A midfielder who makes very creative,  probing passes in the final third of the pitch is unlikely to have as high a pass percentage as ones like Jorginho and Kova who make lots of short passes much deeper. We simply need more players who can create and be a real threat to the opposistion. Take the Utd game. Kova was probably our best player. But for all his technical ability and running with the ball in the middle of the pitch, once he got into the final third he was clueless and downright poor. He has far too many of these kind of games.

 

[Tomo 21,681]

2 hours ago, Mana said:

You do know Arsenal's squad is better than ours right? They were just more lazy and disorganised under Emery. They have goalscorers in Martinelli and Aubameyang. Lacazette, who hasn't scored in months has now woken up from his long slumber.

Ozil, did more for Arteta then he EVER did for Emery in a short period of time.

We NEED to start doing a winning run if Arsenal is not going to catch us.

Three guarentee's in life. Death, taxes and you hyping up Arsenal.

[Tomo 21,681]

1 hour ago, Iggy Doonican said:

Good article this and should put to bed this bollocks narrative that having ball possession is something to take comfort in. 

If you're referring to me that would make a lot of sense if I actually said that.

[Iggy Doonican 4,186]

On 18/02/2020 at 6:56 PM, Tomo said:

Arsenal home (yes it was a fucking ball ache to blow two points Vs ten men but we absolutely dominated the game in terms of terrortory that was probably the most dominant we've ever been against Arsenal at home bar the 6-0).

Here you go mate absolutely dominating against 10 men is no consolation at all. If the same happens tomorrow would you post this again? Only on a forum could you say this if I said it tomorrow after the game in the pub or the tube home people would tell me not to be such a twat.

[Superblue 6,331]

47 minutes ago, Iggy Doonican said:

Good article this and should put to bed this bollocks narrative that having ball possession is something to take comfort in. It's the complete opposite it's a major flaw in your game if you dominate the ball have no final product and lose or draw against 10 men. We're going to have all the ball tomorrow if we lose the game against a team with no recognised strikers then serious questions have to be asked.

https://inews.co.uk/sport/football/frank-lampard-chelsea-manchester-united-ole-gunnar-solskjaer-champions-league-top-four-1883536

I think everyone agrees completely with this. I've never taken comfort in dominating the ball. It's certainly something from which could and should be built from, but ultimately if we're not scoring goals from our dominance then it remains a problem.The biggest flaw in our team is finishing, this is clear. We're the most wasteful team in the league and aren't clinical enough. But then in hindsight, should we have expected anything more?

When you look at our attack minded options - Pedro's numbers have declined significantly since the Conte title winning season and he's starting to show his age (nearly 33), Willian throughout his Chelsea career has only averaged around half a dozen goals a season, Batshuayi is poor (hence why he's been loaned out to three different clubs) and Giroud perhaps should have played more this season but let's not pretend like he's some goal machine. His numbers last season were massively inflated due to the goals he scored in the Europa League where we played a fair few poor teams. I think Lampard has missed a trick not utilising him more in the last couple of months against compact teams who are forcing us to play out wide rather than through the middle, and especially since Reece James has stayed fit for a run of games (as he seems to be the only player on our team who can consistently cross the ball), but I still wouldn't be expecting him to 'solve' our lack of goals.

Loftus-Cheek started showing signs at the back end of last season that he could be a regular goal scorer from midfield and really kick on this year but he's been injured.

That leaves us relying on four youngsters - two of which were unproven in the Premier League (if anything Tammy was written off for his season with Swansea), one coming from a foreign country and had never put up outstanding goalscoring numbers, and one off the back of a serious injury.

Realistically we've been fortunate that Tammy went on a hot streak that helped us rack up a lot of wins earlier in the season.

Creatively it's a similar issue too. The main midfielders we have - Kante is a ball winner and Jorginho and Kovacic are both better suited to controlling, dominating and recycling the ball. Neither are a Fabregas type that can create from deep and they rely on players to create around them who they can ensure the ball regularly gets to. Again though in attack we have very little creativity. We don't have a Mata type (although hopefully the Ziyech signing will help with this) and Pulisic and CHO are very much in the mould of Hazard in terms of their capability of beating players and creating pockets of space that way but neither are anywhere near that level at present. Apart from Reece James (who is also still quite raw in parts of his game and needs time), the rest of the full backs don't offer any real width and can't cross the ball in.

With Hazard taken out of this squad it does highlight how poor we've allowed the squad to get really over the last few seasons. Conte's first year papered over a lot of cracks, but a number of players haven't been adequately replaced and trying to change our style and philosophy from a more defensive style to an offensive one has added to the difficulties (although now we've started this shift I don't think we should revert back). Spurs didn't buy players for a season and whilst they fell down in the league, they still maintained 4th and made the Champions League final. Liverpool didn't buy any first team players of note last summer and have continued on from last season. There is no way that the club should have been affected as badly as it has been by a transfer ban, where too many players have been kept at the club to age, stagnate and/or decline and an influx of academy players on mass was needed to try and reinvigorate a stale squad.

A more pragmatic manager this season likely wouldn't have overseen these losses at home and a more solid and stable defence will have helped in some games, but it wouldn't have helped from an attack perspective. If we're struggling to score goals from 12-15 shots every game, how are we going to score many goals from 5 or 6 shots? We may not have lost as many games as we have but would we have won as many, particularly earlier in the season when we left ourselves open and vulnerable defensively but were scoring a lot more goals. Because whilst the number of games we've lost is alarming and quite frankly inexcusable, the reason we're in 4th is we don't draw as many games as a number of the other teams.

We are definitely at a crossroads I feel this coming summer. With or without Lampard in charge, we've got a good core of young players and in my opinion a strong central midfield core to build upon, but if we fail to buy players in some real key positions then these problems are not going to go away regardless of who the manager is.

[Tomo 21,681]

45 minutes ago, Iggy Doonican said:

Here you go mate absolutely dominating against 10 men is no consolation at all. If the same happens tomorrow would you post this again? Only on a forum could you say this if I said it tomorrow after the game in the pub or the tube home people would tell me not to be such a twat.

I didn't explicitly state possession.

And being a man up doesn't equate to guarenteed domination, have you forgotten the CL tie against Paris when we had much better players than now?

I've repeatedly stated that we should not escape blame for conspiring to draw that night, but the fact so many people called the overall performance shit just serves to back up my theory that a lot of people base their view on the match just by looking at the score.

[Iggy Doonican 4,186]

1 hour ago, Tomo said:

I didn't explicitly state possession.

And being a man up doesn't equate to guarenteed domination, have you forgotten the CL tie against Paris when we had much better players than now?

I've repeatedly stated that we should not escape blame for conspiring to draw that night, but the fact so many people called the overall performance shit just serves to back up my theory that a lot of people base their view on the match just by looking at the score.

It was a shit performance and you were trying to put a positive spin on it and there isn't one. And what's the difference between in your words in terms of territory and possession ? You can only be dominant again your words with the ball which equates to possession of the ball.

[Tomo 21,681]

17 minutes ago, Iggy Doonican said:

It was a shit performance and you were trying to put a positive spin on it and there isn't one. And what's the difference between in your words in terms of territory and possession ? You can only be dominant again your words with the ball which equates to possession of the ball.

No, I just look beyond the score when accessing a performance.

I've called a 6-0 win at Wigan a shit performance and a 2-4 defeat to City earlier that year a good one, I also (and you can check my history) critised the performance at Burnley even though it was on paper the most convincing win of the season, also the best performance I've ever seen by any team ever guess what? The team in question actually drew the match.

[Iggy Doonican 4,186]

42 minutes ago, Tomo said:

No, I just look beyond the score when accessing a performance.

I've called a 6-0 win at Wigan a shit performance and a 2-4 defeat to City earlier that year a good one, I also (and you can check my history) critised the performance at Burnley even though it was on paper the most convincing win of the season, also the best performance I've ever seen by any team ever guess what? The team in question actually drew the match.

Anyone who calls a 6-0 away win a shit performance is just taking the piss and takes football and commenting on football far to seriously. stop trying to be an apprentice Neville or Carragher. And again and this is my final post on this if we dominate tomorrow and lose come and post on here and say you were happy because you'll be in a minority of one. If Fury dominates tomorrow and gets caught with a sucker punch in the last round it will be scant consolation to him, his fans and people who had money him that he dominated but ultimately lost.

You keep changing the narrative by using other games and you're last sentence means fuck all am I supposed to second guess what you're talking about ?. The bottom line was you were happy that we dominated against 10 men and nobody else was and so they shouldn't be.

[Tomo 21,681]

1 hour ago, Iggy Doonican said:

Anyone who calls a 6-0 away win a shit performance is just taking the piss and takes football and commenting on football far to seriously. stop trying to be an apprentice Neville or Carragher. And again and this is my final post on this if we dominate tomorrow and lose come and post on here and say you were happy because you'll be in a minority of one. If Fury dominates tomorrow and gets caught with a sucker punch in the last round it will be scant consolation to him, his fans and people who had money him that he dominated but ultimately lost.

You keep changing the narrative by using other games and you're last sentence means fuck all am I supposed to second guess what you're talking about ?. The bottom line was you were happy that we dominated against 10 men and nobody else was and so they shouldn't be.

I never said I was happy, if you're going to quote me either do it accurately or stop wasting mine and everyone's time.

I have on many occasions stated it was irresponsible to let that result slip but just because I'm not saying the performance from minute 1 to 90 was shit you're creating this fantasy that I was happy with the result and trying to set a stigma towards me.

[NikkiCFC 7,560]

'He has got attacking players, let's get it right... Not many teams have had our injuries': Frank Lampard plays down Jose Mourinho's moans as Chelsea prepare to face rivals Tottenham in crunch top four showdown

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-8029283/Lampard-plays-Jose-Mourinhos-injury-wining-Chelsea-prepare-face-Tottenham.html#comments

 

I do not like this kind of excuses... And it is not true. Utd without Pogba full season, McTominay also out for months and now Rashford finished his season. Three best players.

Spurs without Kane and Son... Eriksen sold... Ndombele always injured and Sissoko who is very good for the last year and a half.

And Frank finds excuses with injuries? Btw we had best results when we had most injuries and played without Rudiger, Kante, Chris, Emerson...

 

[Laylabelle 9,292]

The performance for most parts wasnt shit. Defending however was...and the chances we missed were.  We had chance after chance after chance after chance. They scored from our corner! How?! 

It's the same story for every loss or draw though. Most the ball..most shots..come away with sod all.

[NikkiCFC 7,560]

9 hours ago, Mana said:

You do know Arsenal's squad is better than ours right? 

HAHAHAHAHA! Come on now, we suck lately but if Arsenal and Chelsea make fusion only Auba and maybe Leno would make it to starting 11 from Arsenal.

[NikkiCFC 7,560]

5 hours ago, Superblue_1986 said:

-Pedro's numbers have declined significantly since the Conte title winning season and he's starting to show his age (nearly 33),

Last season Pedro scored 13 goals just like in Conte winning season in all comps. Was our second best goalscorer after Eden. He was good in SuperCup but completely got dropped after. 

[communicate 2,703]

1 hour ago, NikkiCFC said:

'He has got attacking players, let's get it right... Not many teams have had our injuries': Frank Lampard plays down Jose Mourinho's moans as Chelsea prepare to face rivals Tottenham in crunch top four showdown

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-8029283/Lampard-plays-Jose-Mourinhos-injury-wining-Chelsea-prepare-face-Tottenham.html#comments

 

I do not like this kind of excuses... And it is not true. Utd without Pogba full season, McTominay also out for months and now Rashford finished his season. Three best players.

Spurs without Kane and Son... Eriksen sold... Ndombele always injured and Sissoko who is very good for the last year and a half.

And Frank finds excuses with injuries? Btw we had best results when we had most injuries and played without Rudiger, Kante, Chris, Emerson...

 

As much as I don't like team complaining but losing two of your main scorer for long term injury in the middle of a season is a massive blow to any team.