The Mourinho Thread

[1chelsea 864]

Since this is the main mourinho thread i would like to share a post that i posted on another mourinho thread in this forum, i am a madrid fan and here is my analysis of how i rank mourinho's time in madrid.

In Madrid theres a structure where behavior and values are looked at with a microscope in a special way, in madrid this is called "senorio", where madrid is looked or was looked at as classy to put it simply. Kind of how Barcelona stands for values as they say with "mes que un club". ( This was problem A for Mou before he went to madrid).

In Madrid there is a belief that you have to "die" attacking, people dont want to see madrid defending on their back foot in their own home. There is a certain spanish style in madrid's history (epitomized recently in the late 80's with la quinta del buitre which won la liga for almost an entire decade). ( Problem B for Mou before he went to madrid.)

So these two problems were going to make it hard for mourinho to live a peaceful life here because as everyone knew, he had an attitude which would clash with "senorio", like joining barcelona with the values they have...So he had the problem with attitude and he had the problem with the way hed make the team play, so controversy and pain was almost guaranteed before he arrived.

Well when madrid got him, pellegrini was sacked so he could come. People knew that bringing mou had its drawbacks, specially for us as not only the attitude and style was in doubt, but also his ability to build a long term plan. Well the whole thing when we brought him was that THE END HAD TO JUSTIFY THE MEANS. Mourinho is more RESULTIST than a coach like guardiola in that a coach like guardiola or cryuff hellped build legacies, canteras, styles of football, and football with substance that could be evolutionized and revolutionized into being something special. Mou brings nothing of this because as his track record showed, his football was not long term in that sense and if anything he had shown that his way of being was ANTI long term. So based on this maybe a coach like guardiola who is classy and has this long term thing to him could be saved from being "hanged" but when a coach that is so arrogant and controversial and plays such a negative football and is like SATAN to what madrid stands for comes to madrid and fails to justify the means with his arrival, the only thing i can do as the majority can is deem his time here as a FAILURE.

Forget about all other competitions other than la liga and champions league.

HE FAILED TO WIN 5/6 OF THOSE TOURNAMENTS.

He got beat by barcelona twice in the league, and despite things that you can point at like the red card on pepe in 10/11 in the CL SEMI FINAL, the scheme he brought to madrid was so poor that we got lambasted 3 years in a row by dortmund, munich, and barcelona. Bare in mind that in each and every of the campaigns the only time we had real formidable foes in our way to the semi finals was this year when we faced manchester united and we only won because the referee made a mistake with NANI.

So bottom line mourinho failed in Madrid because his football philosophy is non existant, he left us with nothing, no type of good football that can be expanded and that a legacy or football project can be created with like the ones with bayern munich, dortmund, or barcelona, which are coincidentally the teams that took us down. His football was so horrible that we lost two la ligas because teams figured us out,we were either ill prepared tactically or mentally and emotionally because in 12/13 there was civil war in madrid leading to a huge dip in form in the first half of season. So mourinho left no type of football philosophy, and he failed to win 5/6 real trophies. Thats an 83 percent failure he had in madrid.

So he left us with a horrible brand of football if it can even be called a brand, and with 1 trophy out of 6. So in that side of the coin its a total FAILURE.

On THE OTHER SIDE OF THE COIN. You could say he brought madrid back into relevance into the CL SEMI FINALS, this is probably the only justification his most dire supporters can use, but the reality is that since VICENTE DEL BOSQUE IN 2003 AND NOT EVEN THEN! No one has been given more power or money to spend than jose mourinho. And what did jose do with that power? He made a circus out of madrid making us look like bastards with guys like Xavi defending the senorio of real madrid, our OWN CLUB by saying that mourinho was a cancer. So this is nto a justification. Its like saying " hey madrid finally gave someone a chance and when they gave the guy a chance you know what he did? he made us look like clowns, made horrible purchases, and failed to win the trophies more than 80 percent of the time!"

Aside from that theres nothing more to say, mou was a failure in each and every way. He gave us a 3 year run of consistency, its a step forward but its due to his overated status and not to what he did here, thats why guys like PEREZ are idiots and these last 4 years of his i will wish to see race past me as i dont want perez in madrid.

Mourinho failed.

He failed with the trophies.

He failed with the football.

Thats why everyone was saying "madrid is it really worth the cost?" well the answer was, "lets wait till its over to decide", and now we can answer with a big NO. He made us into clowns and losers, LITERALLY. The return of relevance was due to the club waking up a little bit and realizing that no matter who the coach if you treat him like sh*T and dont give him time nothing good will happen. Mou did nothing special with out team considering he built it wrong around a bad football brand, spent alot of money, i mean someone like pellegrini if he had stayed would have been classy, would have brought better football, and if given time would have probably led to trophies, as mourinho showed, he is not the best manager or coach in the world in any way, he just has a short term winning formula ( that is not guaranteed btw) that packs in a high dose of controversy and bullshi*T.

Now about his transfers..They were horrible...

He brought Nuri Sahin and probably never even watched him play considering he didnt know what to do with him and ostracized him completely, by making alonso play almost every game of the season. Nuri Sahin was a failure.

Di Maria is a clown, he is predictable, a prolific diver, overated, and cant pass for sh*t, only thing he has is good work rate.

Coentrao was a 30 million failure, not needed here, mou tried him in midfield and failed, and he failed at displacing marcelo too.

Altintop? HAHAAHAHAHa

Modric maybe his biggest failure. So expensive, could have brought someone like gundogan or given sahin more of a chance but he spent so much on modric just so that he didnt know what to do, what a piece of sh*T mourinho prove to be with transfers. None of his transfers had impact, they were all overpriced flops.

Coentrao is madrid biggest mistake but he will be sold for around 18 i heard, and modric will be given a chance since mou just played him as utility player anywhere not knowing what to do with him.

Mourinho is a bit of a fraud, he is sh*T tactically, he got beat soundly in all the 3 CL semi finals tactically.

Go to google and type in Zonal mARKING along with the match ud want to check like the bayern vs madrid match in 11/12, very profound explanations of the rape mourinho took. He built such a shit team that he had to take a midfielder out and the rb out more than once in la liga games this year to put in callejon and kaka in an attempt to throw all attacking players out there and hope for a goal. SEVILLA GAME WAS THE LOWEST POINT.

http://www.zonalmark...of-both-halves/

A piece of sh*t tactically and financially, and he failed in all fronts.

Forgive me if i am harsh but this is the reality. He made us waste money on people we didnt need and he didnt know how to use, he left us with no positives in the football area, failed to win the trophies, did not do a "special job", did not justify the means, behaved like a classless prick, and hurt our image. A CL would have justified the means as crazy as it sounds, but with the controversy with the players and everything...a facking disgrace.

Oh and dont get me started on the players..80 percent of the dressing room was against him. So were the fans because he was an asshole who didnt keep his promises to guys like benzema. Only arbeloa, modric, essien, lopez, callejon, licked his ass in the end. Even pepe told him to fck off after what he did to iker.

FAILURE.

Who do i want in madrid? Someone who could bring progressive football, with advanced technical football like the ones we see from the germans so that we can build a long term project like a modern club should, maybe someone like laudrup or heynckes. Trophy cabinets like mourinho's mean jack shit if you dont take all areas into account.

But perez is an idiot, i was illusioned with the arrival of zidane as our GM that we would do what i wish but we are sliding towards ancelotti which is like mourinho but less bound to successful, plays sht football, very defensive minded, all is going wrong. I dont know why zidane didnt advice perez on this.

Apparently madrid will get ancelotti and bale and that sickens me, we will play shit football that has led to our demise in europe ( i could go further into detail into mourinhos failings but i wont atm) with managers like him or mou we wont get to see ozil shine in the correct place in the pitch, we will fail against park the bus teams and lose la ligas, all while playing shit football. ( I maybe be too hard carlo him atm we will see).

And the overpriced one trick pony bale...He is overpriced and would get unmasked if put into a passing side. Weve never seen profficient passing skills, or football inteligence, or through balls, or ability to beat players without speed, from bale. All he is, is a countering machine with a hell of a shot, but in madrid we should strive for more than that, and its because of our reluctance that we lose our chances at real geniuses like gotze, reus, and now apparently isco. Which are much better with the ball, can do much more with it, and are much cheaper.

I think that answers your question

What do i expect from mourinho in chelsea? These are different circumstances, maybe hes happy here and vice versa, i dont know but to leave it shortly, dont expect great deals in transfers if mou is given big authority, all i can say is he will do atleast ok we will see. but the best case scenario is that he is given time, and he wins by keeping player morale high and keeping a good grip of the areas in football by winning. Worst case scenario is that there is YET ANOTHER COMBUSTION and everything goes to hell; the relationships the football, EVERYTHING. DO NOT expect to see revolutionizing football like Bayern's or barca's Or Dortmund, or simply put technical, like Athletic Bilbao's last season.

If anything i would like to inform many here to reconsider your view of mourinho if your are capable enough to realize that your view of him is overrated and miscalculated, IF THAT IS INDEED THE CASE ATLEAST. I feel i explained the reasoning behind this well.

Was given total control of the madrid ship and sent it crashing into flames. He was not the right man for the job.

yo your shit smell too bad take it other places

[Zinedine Iniesco 172]

Each to his own. I simply stated what i saw happen with an analytical perspective. He failed to win 5/6 trophies with madrid, made fools out of us image wise, and made horrible purchases, while leaving no good footballing ideas, and making tremendous individual tactical mistakes in "big" and "small matches". It Happened.

This is not to say that the same will happen in Chelsea as this is a different club. What i wrote was not a hate message, not at all, i actually tried to sound optimistic with his arrival here.He has said he likes to work in england, if he manages to keep squad morale high, and winning form on then he could have a good time here all things considered. His track record shows hes a ticking time bomb but we will see.

[nachikethas 1,149]

Who give the shit about real Madrid. We are only worried about us. Real Madrid is the biggest club on planet with no team spirit. We really appreciate your post and opinions but not bothered,because this not Madrid this Chelsea.

[1chelsea 864]

this thread need peace of mind we are about to welcome the king and you spraying our mind with what he did at Madrid, this Chelsea please all we need now is roses and merriment

[Zinedine Iniesco 172]

The thing here is that the analysis i give about madrid is about MOURINHO'S job there.

Its like me giving you an analysis and Resume of someone coming into work, and you deciding not to take a look at the workers past work and results simply because you want to ignore the negatives and take only the positives. This is not logically correct with all due respect.

There are clear flaws with Mourinho's Modus Operandi as he has had problems wherever hes gone that have led to short term projects ending in combustion. It is an analysis that is it. I dont think ignoring something as valuable simply to keep things "rosy" is logical or appropriate, but..Each to his own i suppose.

[Johnny Kills 164]

The thing here is that the analysis i give about madrid is about MOURINHO'S job there.

Its like me giving you an analysis and Resume of someone coming into work, and you deciding not to take a look at the workers past work and results simply because you want to ignore the negatives and take only the positives. This is not logically correct with all due respect.

There are clear flaws with Mourinho's Modus Operandi as he has had problems wherever hes gone that have led to short term projects ending in combustion. It is an analysis that is it. I dont think ignoring something as valuable simply to keep things "rosy" is logical or appropriate, but..Each to his own i suppose.

Do not worry about the insults. The offseason brings about the FIFA and FM kids who offer very little to an insightful conversation. I appreciate the analysis you wrote.

[Sheva. 5,373]

"Mourinho is shit tactically" lol. Madrid got beat in 3 semi-finals by Barca and Bayern, the 2 best teams in the world. And BVB who are a well oiled machine, and gave Bayern a much better game than Barca or Juventus did.

Apart from those games you can hardly judge his tactics because there's only 1 tough team for Madrid in La liga, and last i checked Mourinho didn't lose to Barca in the last 6 games.

Anyway, Madrid has always been a team that just buys the best players and there's hardly any sign of team spirit, the type of team spirit Mourinho won with at Inter and Chelsea, where all the players were fully committed to his ideas and gave 200% on the pitch for their manager.

[nachikethas 1,149]

We don't need a resume of Jose fucking mourinho. We know his positives and negatives.we are loving him knowing all these things. Something in football which can't be described in words. That's what most of us feels about him.

[nachikethas 1,149]

"Mourinho is shit tactically" lol. Madrid got beat in 3 semi-finals by Barca and Bayern, the 2 best teams in the world. And BVB who are a well oiled machine, and gave Bayern a much better game than Barca or Juventus did.

Apart from those games you can hardly judge his tactics because there's only 1 tough team for Madrid in La liga, and last i checked Mourinho didn't lose to Barca in the last 6 games.

Anyway, Madrid has always been a team that just buys the best players and there's hardly any sign of team spirit, the type of team spirit Mourinho won with at Inter and Chelsea, where all the players were fully committed to his ideas and gave 200% on the pitch for their manager.

if Madrid had a drogba lamps or terry in the match against bvb second leg they would have crushed them. Only ramos(even though he is against Jose) fought like a warrior.thats were i think Jose got all wrong.

[Melanicus 5,208]

[Zinedine Iniesco 172]

"Mourinho is shit tactically" lol. Madrid got beat in 3 semi-finals by Barca and Bayern, the 2 best teams in the world. And BVB who are a well oiled machine, and gave Bayern a much better game than Barca or Juventus did.

Apart from those games you can hardly judge his tactics because there's only 1 tough team for Madrid in La liga, and last i checked Mourinho didn't lose to Barca in the last 6 games.

Anyway, Madrid has always been a team that just buys the best players and there's hardly any sign of team spirit, the type of team spirit Mourinho won with at Inter and Chelsea, where all the players were fully committed to his ideas and gave 200% on the pitch for their manager.

No "The best two teams in the world" dont cut it.

When you come to madrid and are given money and power you should expect good things ideally but we at madrid got banged, badly.

When we faced Bayern a year ago, we were going in as favorites ( for those who didnt watch bayern)...

These two links will show you the errors Mourinho made on the two legs ALONE.

http://www.zonalmarking.net/2012/04/17/bayern-munich-2-1-real-madrid-what-type-of-player-to-use-as-the-number-ten/

http://www.zonalmarking.net/2012/04/25/real-madrid-2-1-bayern-munich-bayern-through-on-penalties/

To be honest we only survived with the football we played with him because we have talented players, but thats not enough as he built the team wrongly from the get go from making a player so limited like khedira a starter for 3 years ( for example).

Dont rate teams like you just did, thats not how its done. That is why Chelsea beat Barcelona last year because they did their job very well, just how Borussia which beat us did well against us with their superior football.

While chelsea got lucky that barcelona missed so many times but also did an amazing job tactically and on the field.

Dortmund is a better "team" than what mourinho made and they beat us in the individual strategies for the games as well.

Yes you can judge his tactics. Thats why we lost two la ligas and showed the whole world why we should not only worry about el classicos.

You dont watch real madrid, you arent aware of the embarrassment we faced against GETAFE FFS. One tough team for madrid in la liga? How does this make sense when he gets found out and beat by inferior teams more times than i can count with my hands TWO TIMES OVER, in his tenure in madrid?

Players without spirit? They have spirit but mourinho lost the players with his behavior, if they didnt have spirit you wouldnt have seen almost all of them cry when we lost against dortmund in the bernabeu when we were 1 goal away from the miracle, dont use these as excuses either.

And NACH obviously you cant ever be aware of all the flaws( as it is regular for people to either minimize them or over proportion them), nor can you speak for everyone. Like i said, if you feel like you'd like to maybe learn to look at things from a more analytical point of view if thats the case then do so if not then continue on. Just stating my opinion.

It is a manager's job to get the best out of his players but he built a bad climate, you cant just generalize and say all madrid players have no spirit, this is not logical either. They all gave their heart out ( most of them if not all looked sad and tired, they did care about the game) but werent given the tools to win. Thats why mourinho replaced defenders and midfielders with players like kaka because he was THAT clueless about what to do.

Well im going to sleep but ive said pretty much everything that had to be said at this point from my part. Good day.

[nono 791]

Nice post MadridOne and I agree with a lot of what you are saying. Mourinho builds expensive counter attacking teams. Why not spend that money to build a good passing football team ? Then if he gets sacked you have to start all over. I am concerned really when he comes here he'll still start Mikel and Lampard in midfield. Those two have been the plague for us and our midfield has been getting clowned regularly by any half decent team. This Chelsea team at the moment has a lot of potential due to Oscar, Mata and Hazard combination. With a couple of purchases in central midfield and a new striker we could really become a beautiful team. I am concerned however when I read stuff like he is bringing in players like Khedira and Coentrao. Mourinho generally is poor with transfers I feel but I think we've been giving Emenalo more control there so he won't be as disastrous in that regard.

There are a couple of things wrong with your post though. Modric I feel is an excellent buy. Most Madrid fans I know agree. Furthermore, Mourinho really didn't have the most money since Del Bosque since both Ronaldo and Kaka came before him.

[Melanicus 5,208]

I hope he will be announced after today's last match for Real at 5 pm.

[HNKS 508]

No "The best two teams in the world" dont cut it.

When you come to madrid and are given money and power you should expect good things ideally but we at madrid got banged, badly.

When we faced Bayern a year ago, we were going in as favorites ( for those who didnt watch bayern)...

These two links will show you the errors Mourinho made on the two legs ALONE.

http://www.zonalmarking.net/2012/04/17/bayern-munich-2-1-real-madrid-what-type-of-player-to-use-as-the-number-ten/

http://www.zonalmarking.net/2012/04/25/real-madrid-2-1-bayern-munich-bayern-through-on-penalties/

To be honest we only survived with the football we played with him because we have talented players, but thats not enough as he built the team wrongly from the get go from making a player so limited like khedira a starter for 3 years ( for example).

Dont rate teams like you just did, thats not how its done. That is why Chelsea beat Barcelona last year because they did their job very well, just how Borussia which beat us did well against us with their superior football.

While chelsea got lucky that barcelona missed so many times but also did an amazing job tactically and on the field.

Dortmund is a better "team" than what mourinho made and they beat us in the individual strategies for the games as well.

Yes you can judge his tactics. Thats why we lost two la ligas and showed the whole world why we should not only worry about el classicos.

You dont watch real madrid, you arent aware of the embarrassment we faced against GETAFE FFS. One tough team for madrid in la liga? How does this make sense when he gets found out and beat by inferior teams more times than i can count with my hands TWO TIMES OVER, in his tenure in madrid?

Players without spirit? They have spirit but mourinho lost the players with his behavior, if they didnt have spirit you wouldnt have seen almost all of them cry when we lost against dortmund in the bernabeu when we were 1 goal away from the miracle, dont use these as excuses either.

And NACH obviously you cant ever be aware of all the flaws( as it is regular for people to either minimize them or over proportion them), nor can you speak for everyone. Like i said, if you feel like you'd like to maybe learn to look at things from a more analytical point of view if thats the case then do so if not then continue on. Just stating my opinion.

It is a manager's job to get the best out of his players but he built a bad climate, you cant just generalize and say all madrid players have no spirit, this is not logical either. They all gave their heart out ( most of them if not all looked sad and tired, they did care about the game) but werent given the tools to win. Thats why mourinho replaced defenders and midfielders with players like kaka because he was THAT clueless about what to do.

Well im going to sleep but ive said pretty much everything that had to be said at this point from my part. Good day.

That is football. Even the best in the world loses to smaller teams. Real Madrid is full of big egos, people who believe they are bigger than the club. No manager will be able to do well with them. Jose may have "failed" at Real Madrid but he has done amazing for Porto, Chelsea and Inter. Thats good enough for me. I believe that when the squad respects the manager and the club the outcome is better. Real Madrid are a joke of a football team.

[KonohasOrangeFlash 2,607]

I would suggest you eventually read it as i think its insightful.

Fuck Madrid. Jose is back home and can only succeed.

[Zinedine Iniesco 172]

Nice post MadridOne and I agree with a lot of what you are saying. Mourinho builds expensive counter attacking teams. Why not spend that money to build a good passing football team ? Then if he gets sacked you have to start all over. I am concerned really when he comes here he'll still start Mikel and Lampard in midfield. Those two have been the plague for us and our midfield has been getting clowned regularly by any half decent team. This Chelsea team at the moment has a lot of potential due to Oscar, Mata and Hazard combination. With a couple of purchases in central midfield and a new striker we could really become a beautiful team. I am concerned however when I read stuff like he is bringing in players like Khedira and Coentrao. Mourinho generally is poor with transfers I feel but I think we've been giving Emenalo more control there so he won't be as disastrous in that regard.

There are a couple of things wrong with your post though. Modric I feel is an excellent buy. Most Madrid fans I know agree. Furthermore, Mourinho really didn't have the most money since Del Bosque since both Ronaldo and Kaka came before him.

Thanks for the appreciation.

He builds counter attacking teams but the problem here is that he doesnt build teams differently because he doesnt know how to. He plays with his own style and it has its drawbacks. You guys could have gone for a more proactive style of football as i remember was the idea with villas boas but that went wrong, and with the pressure from abramovich, the need for results sometimes makes it impossible to build projects like shown in madrid the last decade. You dont need khedira, its an embarassment mourinho chose him to start for us for 3 years, but coentrao is good and wont sell for more than 20 million, he could be a goo purchase for you. Best lb available id say.

I did say modric will be given another shot in the modric thread, but he failed with modric because he was given the shot to bring both cazorla and isco as reported by reliable sources like EL CONFIDENCIAL and decided to bring modric for a very expensive price instead and didnt know what to do with him which resulted in a bad season for modric. He is too expensive, and there are too little options on the market for us not to give modric a chance. He is defensively kind of poor and gundogan is superior for a CM. madrid tried to go for him a week ago but dortmund says to wait a year because of the sales being made this season so we stick with modric for now.

Ronaldo the brazilian one was not chosen by del bosque, he was thrust on him like schevchenko on mourinho. CR7 and Kaka were brought by perez, Kaka is the worst purchase ever, and cr7 was a success but both were not due to managers.

HNKS - "That is football" is not an argument. Its like murder rates spiking up in a country when in another one they are going down, everything has a reason, not just because "its life".

Madrid is not a sht club, in the last 26 years for example united have won 12 PLS and 2 CLS while madrid have won 13 la ligas and 3 cls, all this despite fergies long term reign. And we must not jump to conclusion about the players, mourinho lost the wagon here, and he has had problems every where he went.

It was combustion.

He had problems with people in chelsea, and as said by many people near him and in his documentary he was losing some people in chelsea's dressing room. In inter he said that he didnt like italian football didnt like him and vice versa. And then in madrid he imploded as well.

He made a bad team, had many errors in almost all aspects, and now is coming back here to redeem himself in his favorite environment. But he went to the hardest job he had and failed, similarly leaving as he left with the other clubs.

Its a recurring thread for him to implode.

@ Konohas : Keep living in wonderland then. Thats barely a proper statement, much less an argument you boasted there. I pointed out problems he has that he has shown not only in madrid but in chelsea it self in the past. He has imploded every where hes gone with the same problems.

Cant ignore his failings really, thats why everyones pointing fingers at madrid illogically.

[nachikethas 1,149]

For the last 10years Madrid is joke and will continue to be.

well i saw the spirit on cassias face when Ronaldo scored the winner against city.i only started watching football from 2002and never seen Madrid as world beater with their galaticos. And how did you feel about losing against lyon and other(fk i forgot that team) in cl every year making yourself fool. If am talking about Jose positives only you are talking about his negatives only.

[KonohasOrangeFlash 2,607]

For the last 10years Madrid is joke and will continue to be.

well i saw the spirit on cassias face when Ronaldo scored the winner against city.i only started watching football from 2002and never seen Madrid as world beater with their galaticos. And how did you feel about losing against lyon and other(fk i forgot that team) in cl every year making yourself fool. If am talking about Jose positives only you are talking about his negatives only.

Indeed. The Madrid fool is living in a world of delusion and butthurt. Jose's succeeded at every team except Madrid because of the ridiculous amount of player power they have. He was a great success here and will be again. He belongs here.