The Mourinho Thread

[lionsden 4,689]

Guardiola?

Appearances for players aged 21 or under in the Bundesliga since Guardiola joined Bayern:

Lukas Raeder (2 appearances, 1 of those off the bench)

Ylli Sallahi (1 appearance)

Pierre Hojbjerg (8 appearances, 5 of those off the bench)

Mitchell Weiser (5 appearances, 3 of those off the bench)

Gianluca Gaudino (4 appearances, 3 of those off the bench)

Overall: 20 appearances, 12 of those off the bench.

Appearances for players aged 21 or under in the Premier League since Mourinho joined Chelsea:

John Swift (1 appearance off the bench)

Marco Van Ginkel (2 appearances off the bench)

Mohamed Salah (10 appearances, 4 of those off the bench) [13-14 season only as 22 this season]

Tomas Kalas (2 appearances, 1 of those off the bench)

Nathan Ake (1 appearance off the bench)

Kurt Zouma (8 appearances, 3 of those off the bench)

Ruben Loftus-Cheek (1 appearance off the bench)

Overall: 30 appearances, 13 of those off the bench.

Stats don't lie man, Jose isn't perfect but the stats prove he's better at integrating young players into the team than Pep.

Your analysis would be great if it wasn't completely irrelevant to the point and misleading.

Every single one of those players you mentioned were promoted from the Munich academy and none of them were experienced and fairly established youngsters bought for decent money like Salah and Zouma.

The likes of Hojbjerg and Weiser are essentially the Chelsea equivalent of John swift and RLC and in this case, they were still giving more playing time overall than our youngsters. This despite the fact that Bayern have the deepest and strongest squad in Europe over the last 3 years.

And to the most important point, Guardiola was used as a benchmark for managers who are pioneers of promoting and developing youngsters due to his body of work at Barca were he turned players like Busquets (he basically sold Toure to accomodate him) Pique,Pedro, from mere la masia youth players to world class or very good players in Pedro's case and also gave players like Thiago,Bojan, tello,Cuenca et al plenty of game time.

Using fairly experienced players that were bought for decent money like zouma,Salah et al to illustrate Jose's tendency or lackthereof to promote and develop youth is very daft indeed. if that;s the case you will also have to include the likes of Gotze,Alcantara,Shaqiri et al in your analysis but then it wouldn't suit your agenda/argument, would it.

[lionsden 4,689]

Well said! I think the problem here is Lionsden is a xenophobe and of that list only two are english born. Though I'm sure Baker and Brown have made it into the matchday squads.

So the mods are just going to ignore this?

[DH1988 1,194]

Loved seeing him after we won the cup, those celebrations will stay a long time in the memory, so different.

[Viper22 2,418]

Your analysis would be great if it wasn't completely irrelevant to the point and misleading.

Every single one of those players you mentioned were promoted from the Munich academy and none of them were experienced and fairly established youngsters bought for decent money like Salah and Zouma.

The likes of Hojbjerg and Weiser are essentially the Chelsea equivalent of John swift and RLC and in this case, they were still giving more playing time overall than our youngsters. This despite the fact that Bayern have the deepest and strongest squad in Europe over the last 3 years.

And to the most important point, Guardiola was used as a benchmark for managers who are pioneers of promoting and developing youngsters due to his body of work at Barca were he turned players like Busquets (he basically sold Toure to accomodate him) Pique,Pedro, from mere la masia youth players to world class or very good players in Pedro's case and also gave players like Thiago,Bojan, tello,Cuenca et al plenty of game time.

Using fairly experienced players that were bought for decent money like zouma,Salah et al to illustrate Jose's tendency or lackthereof to promote and develop youth is very daft indeed. if that;s the case you will also have to include the likes of Gotze,Alcantara,Shaqiri et al in your analysis but then it wouldn't suit your agenda/argument, would it.

While I see what you're saying, the whole "it doesn't suit your agenda/argument" cuts both ways here. I didn't include Alcantara/Shaqiri/Gotze because they were too old for my analysis otherwise I would have included Salah's stats from this season and more importantly Courtois, so... yeah.

As for the dropping established players to bring in youngsters, I will go no further than to point you towards the Varane/Pepe situation, i'm not going to disrespect you by going into the details of that.

As for Hojbjerg and Weiser, they were both signed to the club in 2012 (neither of them came through the Bayern academy) and currently has Hojbjerg loaned out to a lower league club (a bit like Kalas) so I don't think they're great examples of youth integration... Cheers for proving my point though.

I stand by what I said, and i'll reiterate that while Mourinho is far from perfect, he's much better than most people think and Pep is at best only as good a him at youth integration. I highly doubt any of the facts I have presented will change your mind in this matter but I just felt like pointing them out.

[Rom2013 446]

Your analysis would be great if it wasn't completely irrelevant to the point and misleading.

Every single one of those players you mentioned were promoted from the Munich academy and none of them were experienced and fairly established youngsters bought for decent money like Salah and Zouma.

The likes of Hojbjerg and Weiser are essentially the Chelsea equivalent of John swift and RLC and in this case, they were still giving more playing time overall than our youngsters. This despite the fact that Bayern have the deepest and strongest squad in Europe over the last 3 years.

And to the most important point, Guardiola was used as a benchmark for managers who are pioneers of promoting and developing youngsters due to his body of work at Barca were he turned players like Busquets (he basically sold Toure to accomodate him) Pique,Pedro, from mere la masia youth players to world class or very good players in Pedro's case and also gave players like Thiago,Bojan, tello,Cuenca et al plenty of game time.

Using fairly experienced players that were bought for decent money like zouma,Salah et al to illustrate Jose's tendency or lackthereof to promote and develop youth is very daft indeed. if that;s the case you will also have to include the likes of Gotze,Alcantara,Shaqiri et al in your analysis but then it wouldn't suit your agenda/argument, would it.

Guardiola was also the coach of Barcelona B, he knew all those players, la Masia is great, he trusted all those players, it won't happen again in his carrer spomething like that

[LondonsFinest 692]

People actually mentioning Guardiola and youth, because he dumped a 30 year old Deco, a declining Ronaldinho for the world's best talent and a never shining mexican for a good CB, who he bought.
The word support, means to be behind somebody through thick and thin. Critisice him for bad decisions and praise him for good ones and actions at the same time. Then we look at the fact, that we are challenging for the title for a second year, won a domestic cup, no matter it's importance, nearly reached a CL final, without a good striker(despite it being last year). Can someone please tell me a good defensive midfielder in this years Bundesliga. Someone that jumps on the AMC directly? Specifically this year. And please, don't use the fact that Xabi Alonso is a DM on fifa. I think Mourinho is too much of a crush for me, and I believe him and trust him a lot. But, no one can tell me, he is doing a bad job at Chelsea, IT'S NOT EVEN DEBATABLE BY 1 FREAKING PERCENT.
Thanks.

[Jase 43,479]

Tim Sherwood...

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2982852/Tim-Sherwood-play-small-club-need-b-play-Aston-Villa.html

The night that Villa defeated West Brom, their thunder was stolen by images of Gus Poyet and Steve Bruce having to be kept apart during Sunderland’s match with Hull City.

Sherwood sympathises. ‘It happened to me once last season with Tottenham,’ he recalls. ‘We were playing Chelsea. Nearly an hour in we had them where we wanted them. Then Jan Vertonghen makes a mistake, Younes Kaboul gets sent off, and we capitulate, lose 4-0.

‘I’m hot, I’m upset. Jose Mourinho shakes hands, doesn’t say much. Steve Holland, his assistant, comes up and he’s trying to be nice. “Unlucky mate,” he says. “You played really well in the first half.” I tell him to f*** off. Lost my temper. Called him a patronising c***. I had to phone and apologise. Still fuming, but it was my mistake. He didn’t mean it as I thought. You’re not safe in the heat of that battle.

[Kieran. 6,317]

Tim Sherwood...

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2982852/Tim-Sherwood-play-small-club-need-b-play-Aston-Villa.html

at least he admitted his mistake.

[kellzfresh 7,226]

http://weaintgotnohistory.sbnation.com/2015/3/5/8149935/chelsea-film-room-i-the-defensive-5-4-1

Fantastic article explaining our tactics.

I had a feeling this is why ivanovic tucks in close to the centerbacks, Willian comes back like a rightback and hazard stays higher than the other winger.

[HD3D 1,038]

Professional players in the PL would rather play for Mourinho than Guardiola or Wenger

From the article:

FourFourTwo magazine have conducted an anonymous survey with professional players from across the Premier League, the Football League and the Scottish Premier League, asking them about a range of football issues.

One of the questions asked the players to name their ideal manager - and there was a runaway winner.

(...)

As one League One player says:

"Players play for Mourinho. Look what he did at Inter. Players would run through walls for him. That's 99% of winning."

[Laugh1ngMan 393]

Tim Sherwood...

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2982852/Tim-Sherwood-play-small-club-need-b-play-Aston-Villa.html

With Tim Sherwood as a coach i feel like they could have just picked any fan from the stands and make him a coach, all he does is get riled up

[BlueLion. 21,491]

With Tim Sherwood as a coach i feel like they could have just picked any fan from the stands and make him a coach, all he does is get riled up

Which is sometimes all a Club needs. I like Sherwood, he may be limited as a coach/tactician but he fires people up. He almost has a WUM approach to management.

[hjperdeath 2,226]

Your analysis would be great if it wasn't completely irrelevant to the point and misleading.

Every single one of those players you mentioned were promoted from the Munich academy and none of them were experienced and fairly established youngsters bought for decent money like Salah and Zouma.

The likes of Hojbjerg and Weiser are essentially the Chelsea equivalent of John swift and RLC and in this case, they were still giving more playing time overall than our youngsters. This despite the fact that Bayern have the deepest and strongest squad in Europe over the last 3 years.

And to the most important point, Guardiola was used as a benchmark for managers who are pioneers of promoting and developing youngsters due to his body of work at Barca were he turned players like Busquets (he basically sold Toure to accomodate him) Pique,Pedro, from mere la masia youth players to world class or very good players in Pedro's case and also gave players like Thiago,Bojan, tello,Cuenca et al plenty of game time.

Using fairly experienced players that were bought for decent money like zouma,Salah et al to illustrate Jose's tendency or lackthereof to promote and develop youth is very daft indeed. if that;s the case you will also have to include the likes of Gotze,Alcantara,Shaqiri et al in your analysis but then it wouldn't suit your agenda/argument, would it.

A friend of mine looked over that.

Lukas Raeder was stolen away from Schalke?

Pierre Hojbjerg came from Brondby

Mitchell Weiser came from Koln

Out of the two I haven't mentioned, I'm surprised Gaudino hasn't got a lot of chances. Seen him personally play here, lot of potential.

also the fairly experienced youngster's idea seems rather flawed. Salah and Zouma were fairly experienced youngsters in the Swiss and French League, that doesn't translate efficiently to the Premier League does it?

[Laugh1ngMan 393]

Which is sometimes all a Club needs. I like Sherwood, he may be limited as a coach/tactician but he fires people up. He almost has a WUM approach to management.

You may like it or you may not but if its all a team needs why spend any money on a coach and not just hire a passionate fan who will do it gladly for free.

He's just way over the top for me, and if i was a player the positive effect of it would very quickly turn into irritation since like you said he brings very little else.

It's all flash and no substance imo

[Jase 43,479]

Which is sometimes all a Club needs. I like Sherwood, he may be limited as a coach/tactician but he fires people up. He almost has a WUM approach to management.

True but that 'fire up players/instill the passion' approach isn't going to get one far, especially when in Sherwood's case, he doesn't even have the tactical nous to back that up. He's almost the typical English coach - plenty of huff and puff but no genuine substance to go along with it.

[Muzchap 8,966]

True but that 'fire up players/instill the passion' approach isn't going to get one far, especially when in Sherwood's case, he doesn't even have the tactical nous to back that up. He's almost the typical English coach - plenty of huff and puff but no genuine substance to go along with it.

Anybody watching Villa - would probably agree they need firing up.

I think it's way too early to judge him, sure he wears his heart on his sleeve - but I don't think thats a bad thing.

Time will tell....

[Jase 43,479]

Anybody watching Villa - would probably agree they need firing up.

I think it's way too early to judge him, sure he wears his heart on his sleeve - but I don't think thats a bad thing.

Time will tell....

Not saying that's a bad thing but that quality alone won't be enough to get one far. Most managers have passion and live for the game but the more successful ones, be it at the top club or even the middle ones, marry passion with tactical nous. Sherwood looks short of the latter in his managerial career.

[Tomo 21,681]

Not saying that's a bad thing but that quality alone won't be enough to get one far. Most managers have passion and live for the game but the more successful ones, be it at the top club or even the middle ones, marry passion with tactical nous. Sherwood looks short of the latter in his managerial career.

That's putting it mildly.

Didn't he go to Anfield last season with Chadli and Sigurdson in centre midfield? absolutely clueless.