Paulinho

[KonohasOrangeFlash 2,607]

Hmmmm, haven't seen any of him. From what I've read I'm not sold on him.

[Reddish-Blue 2,223]

http://www.sambafoot.com/en/news/37265_corinthians_dismiss_paulinho_to_chelsea_rumours.html

Well, Corinthians doesn't want to let him go...

[Joker10 946]

Corinthians distance Paulinho from speculation linking him with Chelsea

http://www1.skysport...im-with-Chelsea

This quote caught my attention:

"Hernanes, for example, moved to Lazio. He was doing fantastically well here, but is not playing much now.

Hernanes is arguably the best CM in Serie A, i am not sure if he is aware of that. Such a poor example.I am absloutly dumbfounded that he doesn't get a nt callup. I guess same could be said for Filipe Luis and Fernando Reges.

Paulinho?

He is basically on the same level as Ramires, if we sign another CM it should be someone who is an upgrade over Ramires. Or offers another demension, ex: passing, discipline.

[Rmpr 8,977]

This quote caught my attention:

Hernanes is arguably the best CM in Serie A, i am not sure if he is aware of that. Such a poor example.I am absloutly dumbfounded that he doesn't get a nt callup. I guess same could be said for Filipe Luis and Fernando Reges.

Paulinho?

He is basically on the same level as Ramires, if we sign another CM it should be someone who is an upgrade over Ramires. Or offers another demension, ex: passing, discipline.

I dont agree with the quote, but you must know who you are talking about.

Seria A and Brazileirao are fairly close in quality today. Hernanes is arguably the best CM in Italy and Paulinho is the best CM in Brazil. He does offer discipline, passing, shooting, heading, tackling.

It is incridible how Brazilian League is underrated and overlooked. Middle East, Ukraine, Russia, China, Turkey, Portugal are probably the only countries that really know about Brazileirao. No wonder they make tons of money selling to Europe aftrwards...

I am not sold on him (as I posted previously), but you cant question his football skills. I am worried about external factors.

At Club World Cup, Paulinho and Emerson Sheik are by far the most threatening players.

[Land 331]

Comparing Paulinho and Hernanes is like comparing Ramires and Modric,different type of CMs

[Rmpr 8,977]

Comparing Paulinho and Hernanes is like comparing Ramires and Modric,different type of CMs

I agree. However, Tite (Corinthians headcoach) started it and there is only one spot on CM role in Brazil squad. The comparison is inevitable...

[Joker10 946]

I dont agree with the quote, but you must know who you are talking about.

Seria A and Brazileirao are fairly close in quality today. Hernanes is arguably the best CM in Italy and Paulinho is the best CM in Brazil. He does offer discipline, passing, shooting, heading, tackling.

It is incridible how Brazilian League is underrated and overlooked. Middle East, Ukraine, Russia, China, Turkey, Portugal are probably the only countries that really know about Brazileirao. No wonder they make tons of money selling to Europe aftrwards...

I am not sold on him (as I posted previously), but you cant question his football skills. I am worried about external factors.

At Club World Cup, Paulinho and Emerson Sheik are by far the most threatening players.

I don't want to get into League vs League debate, but Italy Serie A is fairly better and by a good margin. Eventhough i enjoy watching the Brazilain Serie A. Paulinho does offer those qualities you listed, but what i should've said is that we need a playmaking CM( Hernanes, Moutinho,etc) then B2B midfielder which is what Ramires and Paulinho are tbh.

Anyway i think Paulinho next step is most likely Italy, he would do well for either Napoli, Milan, or Inter.

I agree. However, Tite (Corinthians headcoach) started it and there is only one spot on CM role in Brazil squad. The comparison is inevitable...

There is actually room for both; i will admit i have seen close to nothing of Giuliano but i doubt he is anything close to class of Hernanes, he should not be getting called up instead of Hernanes. Thiago Neves, Sandro and Fernando are also questionable selections by Mano.

Brazilian National team is the team i follow the most after USA, so i do follow their league and players closely.

[Reddish-Blue 2,223]

There is actually room for both; i will admit i have seen close to nothing of Giuliano but i doubt he is anything close to class of Hernanes, he should not be getting called up instead of Hernanes. Thiago Neves, Sandro and Fernando are also questionable selections by Mano.

Brazilian National team is the team i follow the most after USA, so i do follow their league and players closely.

I don't see any problems with the selection of Fernando (20) or Sandro (23). Both of them are young, talented DM/CM's who are getting the chance to bond with their international team-mates.

I still don't know why Thiago Neves is being selected for the national team, he hasn't lived up to the hype since 2007/08.

[ChelseaKid10 35]

Don't know why the fuck im posting at 5:45 am when I should have gone to sleep already.... But paulinho is a great player although I think we can do better. I would rather have Cabaye, tiote, Fellaini

[Joker10 946]

I don't see any problems with the selection of Fernando (20) or Sandro (23). Both of them are young, talented DM/CM's who are getting the chance to bond with their international team-mates.

I still don't know why Thiago Neves is being selected for the national team, he hasn't lived up to the hype since 2007/08.

Wouldn't say there is a problem with Fernando selection(its against Iraq and Japan), Sandro on the other hand i do have a problem because Luiz Gustavo and Fernando Reges are better players. Beside that Mano is not even trying to keep a consistent squad and a squad going forward.

Anyway back to Paulinho.....

[Mufassir08 2,400]

Next year de bruyne will also return and he can and should play in the midfield so for the cm position next year we will have ramires,de bruyne and lampard which is good enough,So there is not much room for paulinho.

[Rmpr 8,977]

I don't want to get into League vs League debate, but Italy Serie A is fairly better and by a good margin. Eventhough i enjoy watching the Brazilain Serie A. Paulinho does offer those qualities you listed, but what i should've said is that we need a playmaking CM( Hernanes, Moutinho,etc) then B2B midfielder which is what Ramires and Paulinho are tbh.

Anyway i think Paulinho next step is most likely Italy, he would do well for either Napoli, Milan, or Inter.

There is actually room for both; i will admit i have seen close to nothing of Giuliano but i doubt he is anything close to class of Hernanes, he should not be getting called up instead of Hernanes. Thiago Neves, Sandro and Fernando are also questionable selections by Mano.

Brazilian National team is the team i follow the most after USA, so i do follow their league and players closely.

1st: Please dont call it Brazilian Serie A, If you want to use the official name use Brazileirao Petrobras. Italian teams are all worse than the top 4, 5 or 6 Brazilian Teams. Juve and Napoli are the only that would challenge the title (they would probably win it).

2nd: I also think we should get Moutinho or something, but that was not what you posted first.

3rd: There is no space for 2 CM in the starting lineup (that was my discussion). If you follow Brazil very closely, you would know that Mano called more players from Brazileirao because in the next international break (which we dont have because it does not stop the games), he will only call abroad players (since it will be in its very important final weeks).

Since it was friendlies vs Iraq and Japan, nobody gave a damm.

4th: Italy has no money to pay Brazil's wage right now.

BACK TO PAULINHO THOUGH.

[robsblubot 3,219]

1st: Please dont call it Brazilian Serie A, If you want to use the official name use Brazileirao Petrobras. Italian teams are all worse than the top 4, 5 or 6 Brazilian Teams. Juve and Napoli are the only that would challenge the title (they would probably win it).

2nd: I also think we should get Moutinho or something, but that was not what you posted first.

3rd: There is no space for 2 CM in the starting lineup (that was my discussion). If you follow Brazil very closely, you would know that Mano called more players from Brazileirao because in the next international break (wich we dont have), he will only call abroad players.

Since it was friendlies vs Iraq and Japan, nobody gave a damm.

4th: Italy has no money to pay Brazil's wage right now

BACK TO PAULINHO THOUGH.

Personally, I think there is absolutely no comparison between the Italian and the Braizlian leagues. I'm a Gremio supporter and Gremio is tied with Atletico in the second place. Gremio stars include 36-year-old Gilberto Silva (playing as CB), 38-year-old Ze Roberto, and 31-year-old Elano. These players, with the exception of Elano (who was also an European flop) wouldn't get a game in Italy (or any other top league).

There are many examples of old players, European flops, or pretty much just bad players starting for the top sides in Brazil. Not to mention refereeing, which is probably the worst in the world. Neymar and most other forwarders dive and are awarded with free kicks on the slightest contact. Neymar for example, has not been able to deliver internationally. Even in the olympics (playing against U23 sides), he was just another player in the squad. While people look for other reasons, I see refereeing as the main one; defending in Brazil is piss-poor.

Concerning incomes, if you take Neymar out of the picture, as it should be because Santos does not pay him (only a small percentage of his income), the VERY top players make around R$500,000 a month. That's $250,000 a month, which is $115K weekly. While a very good income, that's average for Italian and especially English clubs (pretty sure Russian clubs pay far better as well).

While I agree that the Brazilian league has improved, the improvements have been uneven at best.

So, yes, moving from the Brazilian league to Europe would demand some adapting. Depending on the player, it can be more or less of an issue.

Concerning Paulinho, I haven't seen much of him leaving abroad and all, but he seems like one fine box-to-box midfielder. People currently enamored with sideway passing would certainly prefer other type of players, but I do think players like Ramires and Paulinho can win you the midfield, and when that happens, you are very likely to win the game.

[Rmpr 8,977]

Personally, I think there is absolutely no comparison between the Italian and the Braizlian leagues. I'm a Gremio supporter and Gremio is tied with Atletico in the second place. Gremio stars include 36-year-old Gilberto Silva (playing as CB), 38-year-old Ze Roberto, and 31-year-old Elano. These players, with the exception of Elano (who was also an European flop) wouldn't get a game in Italy (or any other top league).

There are many examples of old players, European flops, or pretty much just bad players starting for the top sides in Brazil. Not to mention refereeing, which is probably the worst in the world. Neymar and most other forwarders dive and are awarded with free kicks on the slightest contact. Neymar for example, has not been able to deliver internationally. Even in the olympics (playing against U23 sides), he was just another player in the squad. While people look for other reasons, I see refereeing as the main one; defending in Brazil is piss-poor.

Concerning incomes, if you take Neymar out of the picture, as it should be because Santos does not pay him (only a small percentage of his income), the VERY top players make around R$500,000 a month. That's $250,000 a month, which is $115K weekly. While a very good income, that's average for Italian and especially English clubs (pretty sure Russian clubs pay far better as well).

While I agree that the Brazilian league has improved, the improvements have been uneven at best.

So, yes, moving from the Brazilian league to Europe would demand some adapting. Depending on the player, it can be more or less of an issue.

Concerning Paulinho, I haven't seen much of him leaving abroad and all, but he seems like one fine box-to-box midfielder. People currently enamored with sideway passing would certainly prefer other type of players, but I do think players like Ramires and Paulinho can win you the midfield, and that happens, you are very likely to win the game.

What you said is half truth. The EXTERNAL FACTORS ARE ABSURD (as I pointed out in many threats already), but the players are pretty good. Our refs are more than crappy, but you havent seen any Asian or African League matches. European flop does not make a player bad. You also can not generalise and compare your old team with the other top teams (Fluminense, Santos, Corinthians, Sao Paulo, Internacional, etc), league table does not necessarily reflect the quality of the team. Is Chelsea behind Arsenal, Spurs and Newcastle just because they finished in better places? Is Gremio better than Corinthians? You are again wrong on the wages, R$200-300k/month is more common than you imagine, VERY TOP players receive R$500k+ (Seedorf is on 700k, and he is not a top5, probably top10).

Yes mate, you know a lot about Italian Football. They dont even have match fixing every year, empty stadiums, shity fields, gambling problems, finacial crysis, etc, etc, etc. Have you take a look at Serie A squads???? I mean, Juve and Napoli are on another level (as I posted, they would win in Brazil), but even Milan, Inter and Udinese are not better than Corinhtians, Santos, Fluminense, Sao Paulo...

I agree with you, I do not see him leaving. However, the threat was open because Chelsea did enquire about him a few days ago.

[Dion 2,476]

What you said is half truth. The EXTERNAL FACTORS ARE ABSURD (as I pointed out in many threats already), but the platers are pretty good. Our refs are more than crappy, but you havent seen any Asian or African League matches. European flop does not make a player bad. You also cant not generalise and compare your old team with the other top teams (Fluminense, Santos, Corinthians, Sao Paulo, Internacional, etc), league table does not necessarily reflect the quality of the team. Is Chelsea behind Arsenal, Spurs and Newcastle just because they finished in better places? Is Gremio better than Corinthians? You are again wrong on the wages, R$200-300k/month is more common than you imagine, VERY TOP players receive R$500k+ (Seedorf is on 700k, and he is not a top5, probably top10).

Yes mate, you know a lot about Italian Football. They dont even have match fixing every year, empty stadiums, shity fields, gambling problems, finacial crysis, etc, etc, etc. Have you take a look at Serie A squads????

I mean, Juve and Napoli are on another level (as I posted, they would win in Brazil), but even Milan, Inter and Udinese are not better than Corinhtians, Santos, Fluminense, Sao Paulo...

I agree with you, I do not see him leaving. However, the threat was open because Chelsea did enquire about him a few days ago.

I think Milan and Inter are still slightly better than the top brazilian teams, even though they're looking bad nowadays. However, the difference isn't as big as it once was.

[robsblubot 3,219]

What you said is half truth. The EXTERNAL FACTORS ARE ABSURD (as I pointed out in many threats already), but the platers are pretty good. Our refs are more than crappy, but you havent seen any Asian or African League matches. European flop does not make a player bad. You also cant not generalise and compare your old team with the other top teams (Fluminense, Santos, Corinthians, Sao Paulo, Internacional, etc), league table does not necessarily reflect the quality of the team. Is Chelsea behind Arsenal, Spurs and Newcastle just because they finished in better places? Is Gremio better than Corinthians? You are again wrong on the wages, R$200-300k/month is more common than you imagine, VERY TOP players receive R$500k+ (Seedorf is on 700k, and he is not a top5, probably top10).

Yes mate, you know a lot about Italian Football. They dont even have match fixing every year, empty stadiums, shity fields, gambling problems, finacial crysis, etc, etc, etc. Have you take a look at Serie A squads????

I mean, Juve and Napoli are on another level (as I posted, they would win in Brazil), but even Milan, Inter and Udinese are not better than Corinhtians, Santos, Fluminense, Sao Paulo...

I agree with you, I do not see him leaving. However, the threat was open because Chelsea did enquire about him a few days ago.

I only measure success by trophies won, and by that Gremio and Corinthians aren't very different, despite Corinthians having far more supporters. Let's not go there though...

Here's my prediction: Corinthians wont be able to contain Chelsea. Pretty much the same way Santos couldn't cope with barca. Or internacional would have fared against Inter (had they not lost to Mazembe first ).

I don't think it's so much about quality of refereeing (which has been poor due to the renewal), but style, which has been the same for decades. I've heard former referees claim that it was a penalty because the attacker "was touched by the defender."

Because of the above (refereeing styles), players like Ramires and Paulinho usually have an easier time adapting abroad, because European leagues demand more dynamism, defensive work, as well as strength (esp the premiere). People don't realize it, but Oscar is also a special player because he is complete.

38-year-old Ze Roberto was just MOTM yesterday against Fluminense in Rio.

BTW, I expect Neymar not to do well in the next world cup precisely because he's staying in Brazil. Which is a shame, because Brazil need him to fulfill his potential.

Let's agree to disagree (on the quality of the Brazilian league).

[Rmpr 8,977]

I think Milan and Inter are still slightly better than the top brazilian teams, even though they're looking bad nowadays. However, the difference isn't as big as it once was.

I really dont think so, looking carefully at their squads, they have the worst teams in the last 2 decades. If big players like Sneijder, Milito, Cambiasso, Cassano, Pato, Boateng and Robinho (etc) were in their best moments I would agree with you. However, that is my opinion, if you still believe they are better, you have the right to do so. We all se football diferent.

If we compare the last to decades: 90s, we had some fucking great teams (Palmeiras, Sao Paulo, Cruzeiro, Corinthians, Gremio, Vasco), but Milan/Juve/Roma/Inter were fantastic also. The small teams left Italian football with a great "win" margin. 00s we were just soooooooo bad, wont even compare. 10s Milan/Roma/Inter are in free fall, Italy in a big financial problem, match fixing scandals, lesser sponsors and tv money. We are improving inside the field (players, coaching, facilities) and we have the money to keep young prospect (we still need to sell some, but they go for a lot) and to make old players return.

Well, that is my point of view.

I only measure success by trophies won, and by that Gremio and Corinthians aren't very different, despite Corinthians having far more supporters. Let's not go there though...

Here's my prediction: Corinthians wont be able to contain Chelsea. Pretty much the same way Santos couldn't cope with barca. Or internacional would have fared against Inter (had they not lost to Mazembe first ).

I don't think it's so much about quality of refereeing (which has been poor due to the renewal), but style, which has been the same for decades. I've heard former referees claim that it was a penalty because the attacker "was touched by the defender."

Because of the above (refereeing styles), players like Ramires and Paulinho usually have an easier time adapting abroad, because European leagues demand more dynamism, defensive work, as well as strength (esp the premiere). People don't realize it, but Oscar is also a special player because he is complete.

38-year-old Ze Roberto was just MOTM yesterday against Fluminense in Rio.

BTW, I expect Neymar not to do well in the next world cup precisely because he's staying in Brazil. Which is a shame, because Brazil need him to fulfill his potential.

Let's agree to disagree (on the quality of the Brazilian league).

WTF??? You just started arguing some strange things...

1st: I was saiyng that you cant say Gremio is better and start comparring their old players (wiho are still good) with Italian football and then generalise to other Brazilian teams. Success and amount of titles are not the same as best team at the moment. Is Loserpool better than Chelsea because it has more BPL? Is Milan better than Barcelona because it has more UCL?

2nd: Club World Club was not discussed.

3rd: You can not say the style is bad (it is, I am quetioning your argument, not your opinion) because you heard former refs saying shit on TV. It is the same with english commentary (or any ohter language), former footballers also say shit on TV.

4th: Who does not realize Oscar is complete?

5th: Neymar wont do well in 2014 just because he stayed. Will Oscar fail, since he went to CFC?

6th: Oscar has not done anything diferent than what he had done in Inter, back then, he was not worshipped by many clubs. Now that he played in the same level for Chelsea, clubs wanted to have bought him. He is only one example, it proves how players are overlooked and underrated in Brazil (by International Media).

7th: I wont agree to disagree, you start saying some untruth stuff about Campeonato Brasileiro and want me to settle?

P.S.: Mods, please move it to a proper threat. I do not know where to put it.

[Dion 2,476]

I only measure success by trophies won, and by that Gremio and Corinthians aren't very different, despite Corinthians having far more supporters. Let's not go there though...

Here's my prediction: Corinthians wont be able to contain Chelsea. Pretty much the same way Santos couldn't cope with barca. Or internacional would have fared against Inter (had they not lost to Mazembe first ).

I don't think it's so much about quality of refereeing (which has been poor due to the renewal), but style, which has been the same for decades. I've heard former referees claim that it was a penalty because the attacker "was touched by the defender."

Because of the above (refereeing styles), players like Ramires and Paulinho usually have an easier time adapting abroad, because European leagues demand more dynamism, defensive work, as well as strength (esp the premiere). People don't realize it, but Oscar is also a special player because he is complete.

38-year-old Ze Roberto was just MOTM yesterday against Fluminense in Rio.

BTW, I expect Neymar not to do well in the next world cup precisely because he's staying in Brazil. Which is a shame, because Brazil need him to fulfill his potential.

Let's agree to disagree (on the quality of the Brazilian league).

That kind of example adds nothing. Ronaldinho was a starter for Milan not too long ago and he sucked last year at Flamengo. Seedorf was an important Milan player aswell, and, although he's doing fine in Botafogo, he's not ripping any team apart. He's probably not even the best midfielder in brazilian league. In fact, Botafogo holds the 11th position. There are examples of players that were nothing short of extraodinary playing in weaker leagues that surplisingly turned out to be awesome players in other (even stronger) leagues. You could even fit Radamel Falcao there. He wasn't that good playing in the weak argentinian league not too long ago.